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?go Base Captaincy Needs a List of Veteran Caps

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  • #46
    In any kind of sport you get this problem as well. That's why there are divisions if there are enough people for it to work. You just generally know their skill set and you can base your pick on that knowledge. There are captains who would pick players that have been in spec for a while, it is most likely not half as bad as described in this thread.

    Also with the previous way of allowing anyone to claim !cap at any time it would still not solve the problem of some players not getting picked. And claiming a captain spot just to get yourself a moment to play. I feel like that is a terrible way to go, unless the player is also really keen on getting to make the lineup. A point system would be to complex and there are already TWBD and TWDTB that could fill that role, sort of. It just remains a difficult problem whenever the 16 player limit is reached, but I think if you apply Rab's points you shouldn't be waiting very long. And after getting picked once, you are more likely to get picked again in the future.

    P.S.

    I will try to quote more of the text I'm responding to in the future. It might seem like I'm just rambling to everyone and no one in particular

    Comment


    • #47
      Originally posted by Rab View Post
      Falco goes into a thread about newbies wrecking the game and says what it needs is more newbies.
      Newbie logic.
      I mean don't tell me you wouldn't be happier with a 12 squad league and 400 players in pub? We all want more players. I want noobies to play so they stop being noobies, so they join leagues.

      Personally, I don't care if i ever captain, not in hockey zone, not in pro league, and not in TW base. I just care that when I login it doesn't take 2 hours to have 1 game.

      So I'm trying to advocate for people to not be excluded. I'm saying YOU guys decide what is best but keep in mind not to exclude someone because he's inexperienced. Make some requirement that 1 out of 8 players should preferably be low rated or something. This in a way makes games more fun because you're not always playing with the same 8 people. There's an element of unknown on your team now, and equally on the other persons team if there were 2 new guys in the arena.

      You could also have pro hour? 1 hour of the day you could give preferential captainship to vets? You could also make it once a day. Once a day a 7/10 rated player is chosen as captain over a new player. But only once. Second time, it's even/time based.

      Comment


      • #48
        All i'm trying to say is you want to have rules "protecting" pro players who probably outnumber inexperienced players in ?go base (not many inexperienced players are in there compared to in pub). But by the same token no one wants official rules protecting inexperienced players. There are no rules that I'm aware of that protect new/inexperienced players in league, like at all.

        With that said, it's the staff/communities right to do that, if that's what the majority wants. But keep in mind what you sow in the spring, is what you reap in the fall. In my opinion a zone should be trying to cultivate their new players, make it easy for them to enter league without having to jump through hurdles. At the very least some sort of balance between the vet active players and the inexperienced possibly interested in league players should be there. Cultivate the little guy who probably doesn't have many friends in the game, and who is new to league and you effectively ensure in the very long term - future leagues and more fun for yourself and your veteran friends.

        Like this should be the golden rule in any game: "I want to be able to logon and not have to wait 1-2 hours to play" Sure it's true in pub, but what if i am seeking out the same fun you are all seeking out in ?go base? But everyone keeps me benched and then dinner is ready and I have to log off?

        That's all i'm trying to say. Not trying to ruffle feathers or upset anyone by seeming disagreeable or anything like that. So i just hope you guys keep this in mind, whatever the outcome of this thread, if you see a new guy/girl, invite them to play.

        Comment


        • #49
          Originally posted by Falconeer View Post
          All i'm trying to say is you want to have rules "protecting" pro players who probably outnumber inexperienced players in ?go base (not many inexperienced players are in there compared to in pub). But by the same token no one wants official rules protecting inexperienced players. There are no rules that I'm aware of that protect new/inexperienced players in league, like at all.

          With that said, it's the staff/communities right to do that, if that's what the majority wants. But keep in mind what you sow in the spring, is what you reap in the fall. In my opinion a zone should be trying to cultivate their new players, make it easy for them to enter league without having to jump through hurdles. At the very least some sort of balance between the vet active players and the inexperienced possibly interested in league players should be there. Cultivate the little guy who probably doesn't have many friends in the game, and who is new to league and you effectively ensure in the very long term - future leagues and more fun for yourself and your veteran friends.

          Like this should be the golden rule in any game: "I want to be able to logon and not have to wait 1-2 hours to play" Sure it's true in pub, but what if i am seeking out the same fun you are all seeking out in ?go base? But everyone keeps me benched and then dinner is ready and I have to log off?

          That's all i'm trying to say. Not trying to ruffle feathers or upset anyone by seeming disagreeable or anything like that. So i just hope you guys keep this in mind, whatever the outcome of this thread, if you see a new guy/girl, invite them to play.
          gotta agree with this

          Comment


          • #50
            Originally posted by Rab View Post
            Sorry qan but you're just wrong. Think of it like any sports team, some players become managers, most don't, it's a different skill set.

            Quite a lot of the newbies who are so bad at capping it results in an imbalanced and therefore waste of time game are 7*.
            If you included everyone who's 7* it wouldn't solve anything.
            If you included everyone who's 8* it's less bad, but there's still people in there who can't cap or are inactive.
            I resolved all that for you with my judgement and that's what my list is.
            I'm not saying do exactly what I say, I gave us a starting point that other players can add/remove people from... waiting for someone else to contribute something constructive...

            For example, last night we had 3 games in a row ruined by newbie caps.
            Jessup (7*) pissing about with specials vs JAMAL (10*): http://www.trenchwars.org/base/129055
            Johnie (6*) letting JAMAL (10*) have all the top players: http://www.trenchwars.org/base/129056
            Johnie (6*) putting people in the wrong ships vs Morph (8*): http://www.trenchwars.org/base/129057
            People got annoyed and went back to elim. Base could have continued all night, newbies killed it.
            Those games were not ruined in the least. I used one warbird to start with and the other team matched it. This is nothing new in ?go base. These type lines have been used for 20 years. Please spare me with the strawman dramatics. Go through each game I have capped in the last year. NOT ONE ISSUE and my team has won probably more than I have lost as a cap. There were no failed games you listed at all.


            You yourself asked me to be a jav to break the cram a little past midway point as we were struggling to get in. I obliged you. Johnie did not ruin the game after either. I was not around for the 3rd game but it looks like it was a 6 vs 6 game with some lagout issues. Nothing unusual there. Johnie appears to have corrected this with subs as a proper cap should do. All games were completed without issue.

            TWDT-J CHAMPION POWER 2018
            TWDT-B CHAMPION POWER 2018
            TWDT TRIPLE CROWN MEMBER POWER 2018
            TSL TRIPLE CROWN FINALIST 2018
            TSLD CHAMPION 2018
            TSLB CHAMPION 2018

            Comment


            • #51
              Originally posted by Jessup View Post
              Those games were not ruined in the least. I used one warbird to start with and the other team matched it. This is nothing new in ?go base. These type lines have been used for 20 years. Please spare me with the strawman dramatics. Go through each game I have capped in the last year. NOT ONE ISSUE and my team has won probably more than I have lost as a cap. There were no failed games you listed at all.
              There's a reality you're in, and a reality everyone else is in.

              Comment


              • #52
                1. The 30 seconds should be after a game just happened.

                2. 90% of games include everyone in the arena and no one sitting. Most veteran captains add newbies. I always ask who wants in and add them in the final 2-3 spots.

                3. Whitelist:


                MATTEY
                STAYON
                MEGAMAN89
                EASE
                SPEZZA
                JAMAL
                ZIDANE
                TRASHER
                TURBAN
                CAPE
                A2M
                DREAMWIN
                DWOPPLE
                CRIPPLE
                OGRON
                M_M GOD
                HELLKITE
                VELOCE
                SOLACE
                MIKKIZ
                KESS
                CRANIUM
                HULK
                MCVICAR
                FERMATA
                SHAYDE
                ZIZU
                DIAKKA
                DOMI
                GLAVITIK
                CINTRA
                SPIKEY
                VATICAN ASSASSIN
                NL>TRIGGER
                SARGER
                PH
                DAVY
                SKATARIUS
                TABARNAK!!!
                SQUALLFF8
                COMMODO
                TURMIO
                ROYST
                ACIDBOMBER
                THIX
                LUNCH3
                RENZI
                MENELVAGOR
                LEITZ
                JEENYUSS
                ZHOU
                ZIZZO
                TIM
                KATE UPTON
                CIG SMOKE
                WBM
                EELAM
                DEAD_RAIN
                SPHINX
                MYTHRIL
                SUPERSTAR-PROKILLER
                MIKES
                SIKA
                MINOTAR
                BROOKUS
                UNDERCUT
                NECROMOTIC
                GAZO
                PAVEMENT
                CHIEF UTSAV
                DOWNFALL
                ZEEBU
                FLARED
                RODNEY
                RO
                TSUMETAI
                OMEGA RED
                MAJOR CRISIS
                MR. HOMO
                RIVERSIDE
                EVUL
                LIONHEART
                KIAN
                JURASSIC
                HEAVEN
                STEEP
                RICKO
                TJ HAZUKI
                PASKA
                DEVERSE
                LF
                ANIDALIFE
                ZUNG
                MEAN GENE
                ODER
                HENRY SAARI
                RISKE
                OKYO
                RAB
                FIT OF RAGE
                RA
                MARKMRW
                TRANCE
                FIZZY
                TEMPORARY
                RASAQ
                HYDRIDE
                SPRAINED
                KADO
                WEAVER
                DRAFT
                NOKKONEN
                MAKETSO
                KAWRAE
                EVERETT
                NOWYOUDIE
                BACON
                BEANIE
                VYS
                RASPI
                DSIN
                POXY
                APRIX
                STUNG
                FLUDD
                HOLY SHIP
                TRIPIN
                BRAM
                BURNT
                RAPLES
                PURE_LUCK
                MURDER
                WARPORTAL
                GILDER
                24
                RUCCI
                BANKS
                SKYFORGER
                BEAM
                STEADMAN
                RECKFUL
                BONGHITS
                NANTO
                GEIO
                USOI
                WAR
                MILOSH
                BELLFLOWERS
                JATT
                ROZAY
                KATC
                WILLBY
                NOWON
                MORPH
                FIRE PHOENIX
                ERIAS
                ERIAS <ZH>
                SPACEHIKER
                Last edited by Claushouse; 02-09-2019, 12:42 AM.
                1:Ogron> Redemption (349) killed by: Shaw
                1:Ogron> looks like Shaw shanked Redemption :-)
                1:Ease> ...
                1:Heaven> LOL
                1:Heaven> Ogron ? fired from Thunder Mar. 17, 2019 - 02:39

                Comment


                • #53
                  Originally posted by Claushouse View Post

                  There should be a list of who can captain, i.e., everyone who is a 7* or above in TWDT-B. That's an extremely long list of players who at least have some experience in the league and a basic understanding of making decent lines where people can have fun.



                  Way to bait and switch with this list. Sure doesn't look like the twdtb 7 stars to me.

                  The true nature of what's going on here is so obvious.

                  This thread is a RED HERRING

                  If a list is to be made ...ogrons list is incomplete. Many more players are capable to cap base than this list. For example there is no reason not to allow all the current twd squad captains to be used on the list. I know I definitely deserve to be on it and so do many others I can think of. 15 years capping , starting base as a staffer countless times and claiming cap for games as a player I know all the commands without thought. I also do make adjustments accordingly as the game progresses. I know all these players too and the ships they excel in. A fair chunk on this list are not really active too...so this is allowing a much smaller number than is perceived at first glance here to be in complete control of base. Plenty of other actives are capable too. Not having my name on the list shows how partial ogron/claus is being in going about this.

                  I still feel this is a non issue too. If anything base has been running SMOOTHER in the last 6 weeks. Why this is even being considered is silly to me.
                  TWDT-J CHAMPION POWER 2018
                  TWDT-B CHAMPION POWER 2018
                  TWDT TRIPLE CROWN MEMBER POWER 2018
                  TSL TRIPLE CROWN FINALIST 2018
                  TSLD CHAMPION 2018
                  TSLB CHAMPION 2018

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Captain ability really does need to be quantified, guys, so that people can look over the list and see not whether someone is on it or not, but whether their level of competency as a captain is over a certain threshold. Then people can evaluate both the values applied to each person, and the threshold itself.

                    The other problem with creating a qualitative whitelist is that it's not immediately obvious who you are adding to a de facto blacklist. And pretty much everyone in this community (myself included) has shown that they are incapable of being impartial or unemotional.

                    I can provide Ogron's early TSL captain evaluation sheet if that would help get things started.
                    "You're a gentleman," they used to say to him. "You shouldn't have gone murdering people with a hatchet; that's no occupation for a gentleman."
                    -Dostoevsky's Crime and Punishment

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Well fucking congratulations. Something simple just got made complicated so it will never happen. You win the prize.

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        If you don't care enough to put in the time to ensure it's done fairly, it's probably not enough of a problem to justify the risk of it being fixed in a way that could very well be unjust.
                        "You're a gentleman," they used to say to him. "You shouldn't have gone murdering people with a hatchet; that's no occupation for a gentleman."
                        -Dostoevsky's Crime and Punishment

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Originally posted by Jessup View Post

                          Those games were not ruined in the least. I used one warbird to start with and the other team matched it. This is nothing new in ?go base. These type lines have been used for 20 years. Please spare me with the strawman dramatics. Go through each game I have capped in the last year. NOT ONE ISSUE and my team has won probably more than I have lost as a cap. There were no failed games you listed at all.


                          You yourself asked me to be a jav to break the cram a little past midway point as we were struggling to get in. I obliged you. Johnie did not ruin the game after either. I was not around for the 3rd game but it looks like it was a 6 vs 6 game with some lagout issues. Nothing unusual there. Johnie appears to have corrected this with subs as a proper cap should do. All games were completed without issue.
                          You are really missing the point of Ogron
                          ​​​​​​unbalanced teams ruin base, even some 'vets' turn it into trolling. Often you see the better team troll around to get a closer match, which you dont see in the time score. But still neither team will really have a good time, atleast i dont when that happens. The quality of even go base matches is very low, hence why i rately play it. Javduel has the same situation sometimes, but it tends to hurt the arena less.

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            qan Can we make it so the bot actually adds the 8th person itself? And that person is someone who is low rated/not rated. And they have 5 seconds to type !accept to get in. Otherwise it defaults it back to the captain to add the last person? Like maybe it actually sends a message to the three lowest rated players saying they have 5 seconds to claim spot and the one who does it first gets in.

                            I feel like this would be a "rule" that would protect new/inexperienced players but give the teams balance, and let the pro's captain all they want. And it "wastes" all but 5 seconds of everyone's time if it doesn't pan through. Not a big deal.

                            Do you feel this would be a good solution? if not then why not?

                            Like I know clause is saying he gives new people a chance. But look at that huge ass captains list. I doubt 50% of the captains are as nice as Clause.
                            Last edited by Falconeer; 02-09-2019, 04:27 PM.

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              Originally posted by qan View Post
                              If you don't care enough to put in the time to ensure it's done fairly, it's probably not enough of a problem to justify the risk of it being fixed in a way that could very well be unjust.
                              It's not supposed to be fair or just, it's supposed to produce good basing games, and that means excluding people.
                              Experienced basers are all saying the same thing, and you're still arguing against it, that's pretty derpy IMO.

                              Originally posted by Falconeer View Post
                              Can we make it so the bot actually adds the 8th person itself? And that person is someone who is low rated/not rated.
                              The whole point of this thread is to get good quality captains. If this feature existed then good captains would not want to cap.
                              Good captains want control of who is on their team, because they are experienced enough to know who to add and when.
                              If you could stop suggesting things that do the opposite of what we're trying to achieve that'd be cool.

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                It is 2019. 80% of population have no issue doing those commands and knowing who is who to add.
                                TWDT-J CHAMPION POWER 2018
                                TWDT-B CHAMPION POWER 2018
                                TWDT TRIPLE CROWN MEMBER POWER 2018
                                TSL TRIPLE CROWN FINALIST 2018
                                TSLD CHAMPION 2018
                                TSLB CHAMPION 2018

                                Comment

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