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Elim rating system is bad and broken

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Jessup View Post
    Irrelevant people chiming in like jeff potato head. Guy is literally saying I don't die enough rofl. Thanks for the compliment.

    I also am a top R1 killer on Paladen so again more bs hearsay being thrown around.
    You honestly believe the entire zone is out to get you, and nobody is ever telling you the truth when they say your playstyle actively hurts your team? You can't seriously look at the results over many years and not wonder what is going on, can you? Paladen is no longer full of inexperienced new players, so the fact that it's done nothing for so many years with you leading it should give you a few hints as to what's wrong. Have you not noticed how much better every other squad seems to team in DD or LD compared to your own? Have you never noticed yourself flying around by yourself non-stop while your team is 4vs5? Can you really be so blind for so long? You blame everyone but yourself in every game? Have you never noticed how people simply ignore you in games and focus on your teammates instead, because everyone knows you're a nonfactor who will just run away and let them die? If you actively took a look at yourself, Paladen would benefit greatly from it.

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    • #17
      Stop derailing this thread Exalt. You are such a jerk. You are just wanting to insult me. You have not addressed one thing relating to the rating system in this thread and are using quotes and making responses that have nothing to do with the topic.

      The fact of the matter is you are a liar and an instigator. You know nothing about me or Paladen. You have zero room to talk too. Get better stats in twd and elim than me first before being a shit talker.

      You are such a trash bag. You play on a team with better players and still can't go positive . Crawl back into your hole .

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      • #18
        i dont see an issue with rewarding a playstyle that lends itself to quicker games. quicker games = more games = more people not in spec for extended periods of time. its pretty self serving imo.
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        • #19
          not to say 'playing defensive' should be illegal or anything, just that having the rating reflect better on folks who push the pace is probably better for the arena as a whole
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          • #20
            Small games should not be hurting stats like it is though. As it is now if you go 0-0 due to your opponent lagging out you lose points. If you go 5-5 in a smaller game often your rating falls too. This I see no logic in, No change is ok but to lose rating for going even is bad. It is not a players fault if someone lags out or if lower players enter a small game. It whittles away players ratings and is unjustified.

            If smaller games don't count I could support that. 5 or less in maybe should just be games for fun. As it is now there is ZERO reason to play smaller games as all it does it hurt your ratings.
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            • #21
              The rating is bullshit and doesnt mean anything.

              I just played against a guy 1vs1 on elim. I won 10-1 in wb and my rating went down. I wonder if i did 10-0 my rating would still go down. How can i do a 15-0 in a 1v1?
              If I start caring about rating, i would not play any game unless there are many people playing it. But that would not mean im a better player. It would just mean I play more games when more ppl are playing it.
              It discourages people from playing elim whenever the zone is not very active. I actually think its bad for the zone activity.
              But I will play it anyway. I want to play wb, have fun, own and practice, whenever i want and whether there are 30 people playing elim or just 1. I'll destroy and own any1 with no distinction of time zone, race, average rating, color, sex, lag , country of birth, number of years playing this game, religion or anything.
              Also, I will not play more agressive even if the rating tries to give bonus for people who play agressive. I will play however i want and believe thats the best way to play at that time. Playing more agressive doesnt mean u r better than a player that play more defensive. Jessup trying to keep alive and win the elim. That's a good thing, not a bad thing. There are wall in the borders of the elim map that prevent her from running forever. You people are great agressive players and yet dont know how to rush a defensive player? Then ur not a good rusher. Just a noob suicider.

              Playing only on games with huge number of players (huge number of noobs) and killing the noobs (everyone) faster than the other noobs, doesnt make u less noob than the noobs that only play defensive. You still a noob, but a noob that only play agressive and want a bigger elim rating to have the illusion that you are better than the other noobs.

              At the end of the day, u'll still suck my dick.

              Also, I play on paladen, bcz i have huge respect for the oldest squadron of tw, and i can tell that Jessup has been playing good and we'll be ready to own you all when twl start (it didnt start, because twl start on playoffs. Only noobs believe that twl already started) . Jessup helps alot by staying alive and doing good scores.

              Even if Jessup was that horrible as u guys say, and was just like a DECOY, I still would prefer to team with the decoy, because the decoy would distract the enemies, than teaming with a rusher that get killed out 2 mins of game, leaves the others alone (wow, great teaming), but believes he helped the team.

              Being good on elim is being good on elim. Playing only on games on huge numbers of players and playing agressive might give you a better rating on elim, but thats not the same as being good. U all still noobs and will suck my dick. Get ready for twl (on the only league that matter, twld, bcz the others are for noobs and females).

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              • #22
                LOL mega newbie chiming in from his dirt floor hut in central america

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                • #23
                  I have nothing against people who run in TWD or league matches. Why? There is a timer. If the game has a time element to it, timer scamming is totally a strategy. Good on players if they can consistently bring the game to that stage of the game and still come out on top. Jessup is far from being able to utilize this mechanic and consistently bringing out the wins.

                  However, playing lame in elim is pretty distasteful because there is no timer element. You could literally hold up the entire arena from playing the next round. Duels are different because its just two committed players who are not affecting anybody even if they play for over an hour. I totally wish that energy is not automatically recharged to full in 1v1's in elim, and that you have to green to max energy in set points on the map.
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                  • #24
                    There should be a timer in elim. Start off generous then tighten it up until someone hits it.

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                    • #25
                      I could get behind a timer that kicks in. Especially when it is tied. Say 10-6 and 18-6 last two in start timer.We need to be careful about limiting good scores though too. Often people breaking 20 kills do so at the end with last few in as they mop them up.

                      A timer is legit to think about though. Just how to use it fairly is the question. Also make small games just for fun with no ratings.
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                      • #26
                        I think the elim rating system is very good.

                        Whoever designed it understood some basic principles about how people play, and what to value.

                        Jessup cites his KDA, but that argument is fallacious. As Turban pointed out, you can simply log in late at night and get fed or play against 1 bad player, or even during big active games, stray from a corner until you're 5-1, then spec, and conceivably have a 3:1, 4:1, or 5:1 KDA.

                        In less extreme examples, playing more within the spirit of the rules, you can be unbelievably (and some would say detrimentally) defensive like Jessup, and consistently end up with ridiculously low scores at the end of every elim round, being 7-3, 6-2, 5-1, and kill someone who is 16-9 and win, and you maintain a good KDA, but didn't eliminate many people.

                        Therefore, your KDA may be good, but you mostly hid, ran, and/or played extremely defensively.

                        If you want to play that way, fine, but the notion that a decent KDA and playing that way results in a lot of wins does not mean you're good or that you should be high on the ladder.

                        Nobody thinks someone winning an elim with a 7-9 record is good, and most people think someone losing with a 28-10 record is impressive and indicative of skill.

                        Jessup placing 15th or 16th on the ladder with his current playstyle seems very accurate and reflective of his ability and accomplishments in elim. He's better than a lot of players, but is not elite.

                        It is worth noting that Caos plays very similarly, is extremely defensive and safe, enters the endgame somewhat often with low scores, but due to being a more talented player, finishes with the #2 or #3 seed in elim, while having an excellent KDA and high winrate.

                        So I don't think the ratings system is punishing safe and defensive players (that's the most polite way of framing it), given that someone who plays almost the same style as Jessup is so successful across multiple seasons.

                        I do think that style is annoying and forcing elim players to sit and watch them with low deaths at the end of rounds and wait for 20 minutes to play is egregious, but that is a different conversation. My recommendation would be, when 2 players are left, that the bot automatically adds 1 death and 1 kill to each player until one reaches 8 deaths.

                        So in a game to 10, the two players with the following scores:

                        12-3
                        10-1

                        would then be shifted up to:

                        17-8
                        15-6

                        so basically shift the players up to Sudden Death + 1. I remember being like 16-2 and Lockdown was 15-3 or something, and it was to 10... it's just ridiculous. We both agreed in chat to suicide up until I was on 8 and he was on 9, or else it would just be too onerous on the rest of the arena. Moving the final 2 players deaths up until one reaches 8 or 9 deaths would be nice.

                        The ratings system rewards higher kill games anyway, so it's really not going to negatively impact your final rating.

                        Caos vs. Jessup game endings are some of the most slow and painful things to watch in elim.

                        1:Ogron> Redemption (349) killed by: Shaw
                        1:Ogron> looks like Shaw shanked Redemption :-)
                        1:Ease> ...
                        1:Heaven> LOL
                        1:Heaven> Ogron ? fired from Thunder Mar. 17, 2019 - 02:39

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                        • #27
                          good idea

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                          • #28
                            I'm not for changing the scores of the players, especially not awarding players who had 8-1 scale all the way up to 15-8. I don't think that is reflective of how they played during the game. Kind of need to poll around and see what is considered an acceptable number of deaths remaining for the two last players. For myself, I think if two players have more than 5 deaths left, changing it so both players are specced at 2 more deaths than they currently have, essentially making it a best of 3, would be nice. I don't know how acceptable it would be to not preserve the number of deaths advantage. I can see how some ppl might be upset if someone had more than 3 deaths advantage over the other player but still had to conform to the best of 3 kills. Personally, it doesn't matter, if its a duel, it should be on even footing.
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