My Official Appeal

[Liquid Blue]

Nice way to twist my words around, staff. My cheating in a few games was absolutely NOT a deciding factor in whether or not grapevine made TWL. Most of those games were after the TWL squads were announced. I'm sure you had staffers watch me, and you know I did not cheat in every game.

You were the fucking captain. It doesn't matter if you cheating was or was not a deciding factor, you fucking cheated. You don't have to cheat in every game, 1 game is 1 game too many.

I can guarantee that none of my squadmates knew I was cheating. I never "blatantly" cheated.

Oh so that makes it ok? It's even worse that you cheated if none of them knew, I'm glad you had little to no respect for them or respect in their abilities.

I didn't see myself as a real captain of Grapevine, and nobody else did. I leave that title to Randedl, Buja X and Weaver. Randedl promoted me to captain

Stop right there. He promoted you, correct? That means even if you didn't see yourself as a real captain, even if no one else did, you still had a responsibilty to your squad. It doesn't matter if you didn't see yourself as a real captain, you were captain, and should have acted like one.

I think out of everybody he trusted me the most. If I was in his position I would have trusted me too.

And that's what you did with his trust, you threw it in his face by cheating. Congratulations, your team is out of TWL because of your actions, not anyone else's.

I had no intentions of cheating again, but like I said when you feel like you can get away with something, there will always be temptation.

You didn't think you'd get caught but you did, now you have to pay the price. Now your squad has to pay the price. If you had the temptation to cheat you should have given Randedl back the captain position, or given it to someone else. Instead you decided to try and have your cake and eat it too. No one else to cry, scream rant or rave at but yourself.

Staff you're full of shit. You made a decision before this and you should have stuck to it. Grapevine doesn't deserve to be punished for my mistakes.

No, you're full of shit. You made the decision to become the captain, you made the decision to cheat, it's your fault. Not staff's, not anyone else's, you. You were the captain, you have no excuses. Leaders are supposed to set examples, not dick their team out of TWL by cheating.

"But I didn't think they'd get banned! It's not their fault, they don't deserve to be banned! "

It doesn't matter.

A squad captain cheated, so yes his entire squad should have to pay for it. Don't like it folks? Choose better captains. Captains don't like it? Don't act like Myth and cheat.

Change has to occur to get rid of cheaters and it has to start sometime. Until people are punished for cheating, until people realize that cheating not only effects themselves, but potentially their squad mates as well, change will not occur. It sucks GV had such a shitty player for captain, but oh well. Live and learn.

[Aquatiq]

GV has to be banned from twl because this will affect how other squads are dealt with when a cheater is found among them. It has to be clear that cheating will not be tolerated.

[Jason]

i didn't read every post in this thread. i got down to around bram's post on the first page and decided i knew what i was going to say.

with all due respect to rand, and the majority of grapevine, you should not be allowed in twlb. the reasoning behind this is very simple. were you to do well in the league (even just make playoffs, let alone win the thing) your success would be incredibly tainted. everyone that is currently saying, "oh, just let them in because it will make for greater parity within the league." would be singing an entirely different tune if GV did well. they would all hop the fence and start saying, "they just did well because of cheating. i mean look at what happened with mythril."

we've already dealt with enough cheating and cheating accusations and just bullshit in general over the past few seasons. it would be nothing short of a farce to allow you, GV, to participate in twlb and set ourselves up for more of the same this season.

as has been said time and time again, be thankful that you're still allowed to participate in twld and twlj and best of luck to you in both of those leagues.

[Kid Kaos]

Fuck that, this is bullshit. Nethila you completely went bad on your post saying "TW Staff has decided that GV will still be in TWL" but just because a bunch of these nerdy lil brats whine and complain and you cant take verbal abuse yuou decide to go bad on your own words. This just shows you that the Staff is full of shit, and I agree with rand, we dont want to play that fucking league if we gotta come in because some other squad cant handle it. We already know we can hang with anyone in lb.

[Mythril]

Yes, we'll believe you on your word, because why in earth would you not tell the truth to us.

Seriously Mythril, if you'd have any brain you would've never posted anything at all, same goes for your bright squadmates, who make everyone lose the little bit of respect they have left for GV. Stop digging the hole any deeper. If you really love the squad you fucked over so much, which got away with your egoistic actions to have a bit of fun quite well comparing to what happened to other squads when one of their captains got caught cheating, you should go away real quickly and hope everyone forgets about you..

Whether it helped or not, I felt the need to clear things up. I didn't want people thinking the only reason grapevine was in TWLB was because of my cheats. Hell, we even lost the games vs ancients and passion.

And liquid blue, please shut the fuck up. Your words have no weight to them, you don't even play this game. Even if you did nobody would care about what you have to say.

[Tyson]

In sports if an athlete uses performance enhancing drugs, he/she gets disqualified. Sure the athlete chosen to take their place will likely perform on a lesser level, but that's exactly what you would expect considering the replacement is a "natural" competitor.

In the World Cup of soccer, if an athlete is found to be using drugs, the team/country is immediately disqualified and penalized even further.

These are facts, gentlemen.

GV is a great squad, no doubt. It really is unfortunate that this had to happen to them. I really have no interest in seeing them disqualified for I am not in TWLB nor planning to ever participate. I do however have an interest in seeing all cheaters removed from this game permanently. I can't comprehend how much of a nerd someone would have to be to "hack" SS in order to perform better. Hell you can all think I'm the newest person in TW and suck the most, but I'm going to use the tools given to me by this game to do the best I can. With all these cheater revelations, I'm starting to think everyone that was ever "good" probably cheated at one point or another. Sad really.

This decision could have easily gone either way, in fact I would probably support either choice.

A line had to be drawn somewhere; sorry GV you had to be it.

In no way do any of your posts represent United Force. If you are going to be like others who cannot wait for Randedl to post something so that they could scramble to get their 2 cents in at Grapevine then take of United Force from your profile.

As for the rest of you, I have openly stated my opinion on the TWLB Update thread. There is no need for me to comment or reply to any of your posts. I just look at your names and your two sentence replies and then I laugh.

Good luck Rand.

[gran guerrero]

this is some fucked up shit ill stick with gv even though i wont play ld or lj, wont take part of lb because of this cock and bull shit fuckers who half of which sucked so much of pl's cum yet they arent staff and half who are celebratin because they cheat themselves and they have one ez win in lb now. have fun dickheads, you took out a whole squad beacause of one cheater but u wont take out a whole squad of cheaters. you know who you are.

[swim]

since cheating is such a controversial issue as it seems from the banning of GV from TWLB n' such... n' there are still many cheaters out there... who haven't been caught n' still being sneaky... we should push back TWL until those computer wizzes out there... come up with something to detect cheatin in full scale... this way.... it justifies the means of banning GV from TWLB because one player was cheating in couple TWBD games...

P.S. im jus being ignorant cause i think this banning is ridiculous as i have addressed before...

[MILOS]

In no way do any of your posts represent United Force. If you are going to be like others who cannot wait for Randedl to post something so that they could scramble to get their 2 cents in at Grapevine then take of United Force from your profile.

As for the rest of you, I have openly stated my opinion on the TWLB Update thread. There is no need for me to comment or reply to any of your posts. I just look at your names and your two sentence replies and then I laugh.

Good luck Rand.

They in no way represent United Force, just my own opinion (one of many).

I'm not out to offend GV, I have my own history with them. My statement was fairly objective, which I generally try to be in any discussion. As I said before, I have no interest in seeing GV compete or disqualified. I am merely a spectator voicing his concern.

BTW: I don't agree that staff should change their minds any time they wish. That was a mistake. If you posted that the squad should play, then stick to your word. But I guess as with anyone in power, rules/morals generally do not apply.

[Scoop]

You guys should stop bitchin about being dq'd from LB u guys arent even good at that league. Ur lucky staff wasnt harsher and dq you from both LD and LJ also. The guy cheated now u all pay, maybe next time consider someone a lil more b4 giving them (C).

shut it fat ass

[Aquatiq]

Would GV players react to the same situation differently if it were another squad that got banned?

[gran guerrero]

if it was in the same situation
like getting banned for one players mistake before twl even started
even if the squad was dice.
then yes i would feel the same.

[Sir>elim_killer!]

Stop bitching!

Seriously this is just like Jerry Springer. all we need are some fat, drunk rednecks and then we can start throwing some chairs. I dont ply this zone anymore, so my opinion is not biased. I like many people in Grapevine, but I do agree they should be banned from all leagues. No matter how you look at it, you had a CAPTAIN caught cheating in twd match.

Cheating in an online game is probably the saddest thing a person could do. I feel because the squads has many people that are like and respected they got off very easily. If this was Quicksand they would be banned from all leagues. The truth is we dont know how many games he has cheated in, and if it was just a TWBD. He could have cheated in twd, twjd as well and you would never know. This means all the games that he has played in are tainted. Next time be careful on who u select as your leader and this would not have happened.

Lastely to all you bitching Grapevine members, you would not be saying this if it wasn't your squad. Look at these forums, I say atleast 80% of the population thinks your team should be removed from all leagues. So just be happy you are not removed from all leagues, and kick ass in twd. It is not like you were going to win in twb anyway.

EK

[Ekko]

Whether it helped or not, I felt the need to clear things up. I didn't want people thinking the only reason grapevine was in TWLB was because of my cheats. Hell, we even lost the games vs ancients and passion.

And liquid blue, please shut the fuck up. Your words have no weight to them, you don't even play this game. Even if you did nobody would care about what you have to say.

I like you but don't for a second think Grapevine is better then Ancients, or even Passion in TWLB. =P You guys would not have made playoffs, so it doesn't matter, the like 4 basers you recruited can join other squads.

[King Baba]

I think the responsibility you have to take as a captain, Rand, begins with accepting the punishment. I mean, just take a step back and view this scenario with an unbiased eye. If someone was caught cheating RIGHT before TWL, would you wonder if the squad didn't know about it? Would you wonder how many other people are cheating just for kicks?

There's no way to sniff out cheaters, nor is there a way to ensure nobody cheats. The one thing that we have though is the ability to persuade people that cheating just isn't the cool thing to do.

It really is unfortunate that GV is out of TWLB, but think of it... it could have been much worse compared to what some people were wishign for your squad. This excuse that "TWL didn't even start yet" is kind of far-fetched, too... cheaters only cheat until their caught, so he probably would have done it in TWLB, too.

I think this situation is pretty much finalized, bar some majorly intelligent decision from Dameon Angell (he has a trend going lately). I wish you luck, GV, but a cheater on your squad is a cheater on your squad. Nothing we nor you can do about it, and the fact that he was a Cap just makes it worse.

Is that really the sorta image you want for GV? A squad that dissolves after every TWL and cheats leading up to it? I think as a squad captain, you're more responsible for your squad's actions than your own, so...

Much luck Rand, but your appeal doesn't hold any water.