Martyrs, brave or stupid?

[PaulOakenfold]

Well as long as he gets those virgins in the afterlife, I don't see anything stupid about it.

[Zerzera]

I'd rather have a girl I love

[Doc Flabby]

Well as long as he gets those virgins in the afterlife, I don't see anything stupid about it.

but virgins are crap at sex....or will at least require extensive training. training 70 sounds like a lifes work....

[MetalHeadz]

but virgins are crap at sex....or will at least require extensive training. training 70 sounds like a lifes work....

Really hard work..... The attraction of a virgin is not that they are experienced but because they haven't been 'used' or 'stretched', for the want of better adjectives.

[milosh]

zerz.... why are you wise, kind, religious on the forums but an idiot in game? <3 <3

[MetalHeadz]

wow... all of you still don't get it... why do you think that martyrs CHOOSE to be martyrs???? Most of the notable martyrs in history were people KILLED by other people because of beliefs they had. It's not that they submitted themselves to the oppressing group, it's not that they committed suicide for their cause, and it wasn't a deliberate choice they made so that they would appear brave or noble; these people were captured, imprisoned, possibly tortured, and executed. The only way they could possibly have gotten out of this situation would be to deny their beliefs, curse their God, or turn in their companions. For people that truly love their God, faith, and companions THIS ISN'T EVEN A CHOICE. But by telling the truth and not lying I think it's safe to say that its BRAVERY not STUPIDITY. Only a coward would lie and deny himself. For clarification, bravery doesn't mean they weren't afraid and sad; it means they WERE afraid and sad but they stuck to their guns anyway.

I won't lie: this was difficult to read but let's have a go at shutting your annoying arrogant ass up. For a start, for the purposes of having a debate, we all acknowledged that the meaning of 'martyr' was someone who died for a cause. We read what you said about martyrdom being a post-appointed title but we chose to ignore it because it's an anal way of looking at things. Secondly, having so damningly proved to us that the definition of martyr was redundant, you actually give an answer to the initial question posed. If you're trying to undermine a debate atleast do it with style.

Pathetic.

[Kolar]

But if someone is willing to die for what they believe, what if that belief is irrational or meaningless? The problem is we all see this through our cultural perspective. I believe killing yourself in the name of your God(s) is wrong but many people, not just in Islam, would agree that at least dying and sometimes killing in the name of their God(s) is justified, brave/honor worthy.

[milosh]

For a start, for the purposes of having a debate, we all acknowledged that the meaning of 'martyr' was someone who died for a cause.

When did this occur? I didn't see anyone defining the word martyr nor did I see anyone agreeing with said definition.

We read what you said about martyrdom being a post-appointed title but we chose to ignore it because it's an anal way of looking at things.

How so? It's factual?

Secondly, having so damningly proved to us that the definition of martyr was redundant, you actually give an answer to the initial question posed. If you're trying to undermine a debate atleast do it with style.

Pathetic.

Who said I was trying to undermine the debate? My intention WAS to answer the initial question. I'm not denying that the reason this thread became so ridiculous is due to the ambiguity of the term; I'm simply defining the term which in turn provides the answer to the given question.

[milosh]

mar·tyr /ˈmɑrtər/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[mahr-ter] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun
1. a person who willingly suffers death rather than renounce his or her religion.
2. a person who is put to death or endures great suffering on behalf of any belief, principle, or cause: a martyr to the cause of social justice.

[Chino]

Are you considered a martyr when you sacrifice your(self)worth to satisfy the needs of pubescent teens by distributing nudes?

[sixtoo]

brave and stupid, if your dead you can't accomplish what your here on earth to do, brave because knowingly facing ones own death and accepting it is euphoric and divine

[iLDuce]

lol 2 pages

[Galleleo]

I agree with Bete, I don't view people who suicide as martyrs. With the possible exception being Thich Quang Duc.

[Pandagirl!]

I agree with bete too. People don't decide whether or not to be a martyr because that would defeat the purpose of becoming a martyr. People are made martyrs, through actions and sometimes public opinion.

[MetalHeadz]

1. a person who willingly suffers death rather than renounce his or her religion.
2. a person who is put to death or endures great suffering on behalf of any belief, principle, or cause: a martyr to the cause of social justice.

Oh, pardon my obvious stupidity, where abouts does it say that martyrs are appointed post-death which was, afterall, the central point to your argument?

I agree with those definitions - they are not contradictary to anything I have said.

May I also add that the social connotations of the word 'martyr' have evolved since around 8-10 years ago (given recent events in the middle east). A dictionary definition may not actually truly describe what people associate with the word 'martyr'.