Here's an idea, kill NAFTA

[Jerome Scuggs]

How does all socialism fail? Netherlands is doing just fine, thriving economic, strong currency, etc.

a number of factors - for one, the netherlands have actually been decreasing their regulation of many industries, coupled with the fact that the political setup has been fairly consistent (not patchwork creeping socialism, but a relatively better planned model) and further boosted by the cultural attitudes and small population. given that taxation is almost 40% of the GDP, it's pretty hard for the government to not fuck up. give it time

Capitalism is the better word to describe the U.S. Republic of which some call a Democracy.

In some ways you're right, but I think a better word would actually be mercantilism. The operations of the Federal Reserve and treaties like NAFTA parallel the 18th century notions of wealth as a product of the state and trade as warfare.

"Capitalism" I think is distinct from "free markets" in that there is still a notion of government-secured rights, which is, as you mentioned earlier, contradictory (no matter how you bullshit it, democracy is STILL not "of the people".) This manifests itself in such ways as the legal entity of "corporations", which creates systemic problems due to lack of accountability. On that level, I would consider myself an anti-capitalist.

[gran guerrero]

lies and deceit! You jack off to Ayn Rand novels

[Jerome Scuggs]

the more i consider her, the more i dislike her. she's like the ann coulter of economics, on every level: radical firebrand whose inability to accept any deviation from her exact views made her a world-class bitch, and for some reason college-age libertarians think she is hot.

[Galleleo]

I personally no longer care about NAFTA, in fact I am looking to move & retire to the Vancouver area one day.

I would go for Vancouver Island or one of the small Island around it.

[Money]

no plz, stay on your side of the earth

[Money]

How does all socialism fail? Netherlands is doing just fine, thriving economic, strong currency, etc.

cuz its tiny

[Exalt]

none of you realize that the US government never ever ever claimed to be a democracy, they are a democratic republic, which is completely different in its own right

all we do is vote and then the delegates represent (usually) our popular vote by keeping it parallel, but also have the right to vote differently

this is completely different then a true democracy... which you will only find in places like ancient Greece

no one knows if even it worked well in ancient Greek society because frankly, how can you ask them? none of us know the political problems they had day in and day out, just that their society lasted this long, had these wars, this was their culture based on historic writings, etc


Also, jerome, you are fighting the wrong fight here... you yourself or anyone else on these forums could never change the policies of the US government, it will take a serious (and i mean great depression serious) depression for the US to change anything

on a side note, 2012 here we come great depression! woohoo! start saving non perishable foods and fill up your spare gas containers! we are going back to the stone age bitchessss

[404 Not Found]

none of you realize that the US government never ever ever claimed to be a democracy, they are a democratic republic, which is completely different in its own right

Actually the Idiot President has spewed the term that the U.S. is a Democracy quite often in the past 7.5 years.

The U.S. Government is a broad term to make a case about calling the U.S a democracy, but the Decider, George Dumbya Bush clearly has called our government a Democracy and calls for others that he wants to occupy to be a Democracy as well.

The term Democracy to Bush is like saying Amen after a prayer at an Evangelical retreat. Persoanlly, Bush would probably be an ok guy if he had kept drinking and continuing his cocaine binges.

[Kolar]

A Democracy is more of a framework. A lot of different countries which can be considered a Democracy have different forms of Government. In Canada we have a Constitutional Monarchy, a Parliament with an upper and lower house (Members of Parliament being direct representatives of 308 electoral district), a Governor General representing the Crown as a ceremonial position, all of which constitutes the Federal Government.

The US is a Democracy in the sense that (at least traditionally) the rights and wishes of the people are respected, the rights and powers of the majority are limited by a Constitution and everyone is considered equal under the law. How all that is executed may be different but the results should be the same. I would consider a true Democracy to be some form of Direct Democracy but it's not practical today.

Edit: http://www.thestar.com/News/Canada/article/428557

[Jerome Scuggs]

Also, jerome, you are fighting the wrong fight here... you yourself or anyone else on these forums could never change the policies of the US government, it will take a serious (and i mean great depression serious) depression for the US to change anything

I will respectfully disagree. Conceded that I personally will in all likelihood never disassemble the government, but I think discourse in of itself is a very liberating activity. Stemming from my personal philosophy, I do believe that eventually, market activity will contribute to the end of the state. I think this process will stem out of the "underground economy", i.e. illegal goods or services. You can see this effect in one of the most "public" black markets, which is drugs. The profound ignorance and stupidity of the government "war on drugs" has done more for my cause than any libertarian.

At the rate we are going, the government will create new black markets that don't have the stigma associated with them that drugs do. In my city, it's already happening with the local agriculture industry. Alot of local, small farms have been ignoring and outright defying federal laws and regulations, mainly for economic reasons. Around the time the election started getting serious, alot of the farmers wound up coming together to support Ron Paul. Maybe they all just happened to be libertarian farmers in the middle of Louisiana, but I have a feeling that their economic situation at least contributed to their recent disillusionment with our country's government.

Actually the Idiot President has spewed the term that the U.S. is a Democracy quite often in the past 7.5 years.

The U.S. Government is a broad term to make a case about calling the U.S a democracy, but the Decider, George Dumbya Bush clearly has called our government a Democracy and calls for others that he wants to occupy to be a Democracy as well.

If you want an interesting perspective on Democracy, check out Hoppe's Democracy: The God That Failed. He presents a very lucid case against democracy, explaining how it's contradictory in theory and fails in practice.

That being said, I think our government ended as a 'democracy' the second they passed the income tax. The moment the government gained a shred of coercion against its populace (the ability to use violence against tax evaders), we really stopped participating in the government that the Constitution outlined.

[Jerome Scuggs]

The US is a Democracy in the sense that (at least traditionally) the rights and wishes of the people are respected, the rights and powers of the majority are limited by a Constitution and everyone is considered equal under the law.

Heh :P I wish.

The rights of the people are being trimmed and destroyed at an alarmingly rapid pace, which is a direct result of the rights and powers of the majority being expanded. As for everyone being equal, you should ask homosexuals and "illegal" immigrants.

The constitution reminds me of my efforts to quit smoking. It got off to a great start, and then the second I encountered a stressful situation, I would let myself slip a little, by having a cigarette. Having one wasn't so bad, so later I figured one more wouldn't hurt... and now I smoke a pack a day, again.

[DankNuggets]

i think the term "Democratic Republic" lost some of it's o-so-patriotic flavor when countries like China and the Congo decided to use the term to suit there means

[Kolar]

All world Governments self identify as democratic except for one or two. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy#History

[Tone]

All world Governments self identify as democratic except for one or two. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy#History

Democracy is an illusion. all the voting machiens are rigged. false flag operations are carried out. You are a programmed drone.

[Kolar]

I'm programmed to keep your "truth" off the forum. So keep it up, please.