John McCain vs Barack Obama Mega-Politic-Thread of super fun awesomeness.

[kthx]

Lets just duke it out here.

[HateTheFake]

Voting for McCain

[kthx]

Same here obviously, I don't want someone being the President of the United States that sat at a church for 20 years listening to racists comments about how white people are the true evil in the world, and listening to anti-american comments like "The United States of KKK" and "Not god bless America, god damn America". Or someone who wants to be the president of the United States that funneled money to Rezko to build low income housing that constantly failed to meet building code inspections. Obama wanted to funnel 14 million dollars to this slum lord who is now in jail, and was once one of Obama's friends. I don't want the next president to be friends with known terrorists, who thought that September 11'th happening was what America deserved because we try to save other countries from being controlled by dictators. I don't want our next president to be the candidate that leaders like Chavez and Putin want to be in control of America, because they know that he will basically destroy the military through lack of funding, and not actually be able to stop the expansion of terrorism and communism once again in the world, it is a weakness that many countries at odd with us have been waiting to happen. I don't want a president who changes his make-up depending on what kind of crowd he is talking to, darker make-up for black crowds, and lightening make-up for white crowds. I don't understand how people think that he is going to change anything, he changes his stance on pretty much every issue nearly every time he opens his mouth. He is running on a completely different platform in the election than he did in the democratic primaries, and his idea for change is making his VP pick Biden, a 65 year old white guy who has been a senator for over 20 years?

I hope everyone is ready for the Obama United States, the one where we can't say what we want (the fairness doctrine) the one where we lose the right to have guns (Supreme court decided it was ok by one vote, but Obama can appoint two judges of his choosing) the one where the people become so weak, and insignificant that they are afraid of everything, and actually want the government to intervene in their lives and livelihoods. This won't be good for America, it isn't the direction that will make this country stronger or better. I have heard my entire life the speech by democrat John F Kennedy in which he said "ask not what your country can do for you - ask what you can do for your country. "
.. Where did this become twisted and mutated into "Ask not what you can do for your country -ask what your country can do for you."

[Pandagirl!]

I don't like either of the candidates. But since it's the first election that I can vote in, and I'm not a fan of not exercising my right to vote, I'm going to vote for the lesser of two evils (McCain).

[404 Not Found]

If McCain does win I only hope that what he wants will come to be reality and that would be to force women who become pregnant to have children regardless of it being rape and incest. We need more of this frankly. It's kind of cool to know that a woman will have to carry and care for that unborn rape-incest child.

I honestly want the draft to come back!!! Everyone from the age of 18 - 28 should be forced to serve at least two years in the military without a say!!! God knows we may actually be able to get some of the lazy ass ppl that do nothing in life contribute to this country rather than out tax dollars going up to support such useless individuals!

If you cant get into college then you should be forced into serving in the military for a 4 year stint!!

Privatize Social Security already and let idiots that can't manage their funds be responsible for living in a cardboard box in their senior yrs. I am financially set and for those that can’t make ends meet...f'm, it's their problem and should not be mine!!!

Take away money from education in public schools, as it would be best for children to be educated in home schooling & finally get rid of this evolution crap and make everyone know about creationism and the lord Jesus Christ, as all other religions and backgrounds of faith are wrong...end of discussion! This world is only 5000 yrs old and god put the bones of dinosaurs and cavemen in the ground. There is no such thing as evolution!!!

Force school prayer amongst all and only use voucher funds to pay for parochial schooling and not public or any other private schooling.

End the debate on global warming and dissolve the EPA! Allow for companies to decide on if they want to police themselves. LoveCanal in NY was the problem of the homeowners and not the responsibility of the companies who dumped toxins prior to the housing being built there...it's the home owners fault for not researching the land prior to buying the houses.

Get rid of the background checks on purchasing guns and allow for all guns to be sold over the counter.

If your overweight and or smoke, then you should not be eligible for any insurance coverage by any company, as you created your own problems and we should not have to pay for it. Let smokers and fat people die from their lifestyle.

Government should not be in charge of watching out for you, you yourself should be solely responsible for that.

[kthx]

404 is right on about 70% of that! Wow.

Government should not be in charge of watching out for you, you yourself should be solely responsible for that.- 404. gg

[404 Not Found]

404 is right on about 70% of that! Wow.

Government should not be in charge of watching out for you, you yourself should be solely responsible for that.- 404. gg

What was the 30% you disagree with and it better not be the preganancy abortion issue! If your a woman and get raped, by whoever, it's your own fault and not the males fault even if it was rape or incest by your brother or father as most likely the woman created the situation that caused it.

[HateTheFake]

We can all vote for obama, a man who doesnt awnser direct questions, but instead tip toes around them. A distant future wear we kill more people by abortion per day then ww2 did in its entirity. I want a president whos loose on morals and looser on foreign policy, a president who rather enjoy the spotlight then have to deal with americas problems. A president with plans to raise taxes from an already struggling economy. Yes i think obama is that man....

[404 Not Found]

You all know I am being a devils advocate in my prior posts, as I am not a McCain fan or Right Wing lover in the least.

All politicians, be it Obama or McCain are going to make promises that they will never uphold. That's just a fact and part of the job as a politician...to be a liar and a crook.

Bush Sr. ran on the "Read my lips, NO NEW Taxes" and in the 1st month of his presidency he raised taxes on all levels, be it personal income tax to corporate tax. Reagan cut taxes initially but created and expanded more government programs, of which he capaigned against doing, noting he was for eliminating government from the nation and increased overall taxation and government in our lives 10 fold.

McCain is no different on what he tells the people of America, as he himslef says only what is best for McCain in the setting of where and who he is speaking to.

Personally I could care less about abortion, as to me, the human race is disgusting to begin with and it's our race of which is the plague amongst this world. If life was of such importance, it wouldn't matter if it was an unborn child or a death row inmate...or even a soldier on the front lines to an unjust and illegal war. It would only be fitting for some plague to sweep this world of 90% of its population.

I personally hate organized relegion of all denominations. As soon as one can say it's organized, it's a business of which should be taxed IMHO. Relegion and faith should be personal and not forced on anyone, be it school or politics!

As for Obama blowing hot air in his address, look at McCain as well....they both really are typical of a professional politician in noting McCain:

The old McCain didn’t want an amendment and didn’t want Roe overturned. The new McCain completely disagrees with the old McCain.

It’s worth noting that politicians’ opinions on abortion can, and often do, “evolve” over time. Dick Gephardt and Al Gore, for example, both opposed abortion rights before eventually becoming pro-choice. With this in mind, McCain’s unexpected shift may simply reflect yet another pol whose thinking has changed over time.

Or, far more likely, McCain is once again abandoning any pretense of consistency and integrity, and is now willing to say literally anything to win.

Let’s return, once again, to McCain’s flourishing flip-flop list, which is now a Top 11 list.

* McCain criticized TV preacher Jerry Falwell as “an agent of intolerance” in 2002, but has since decided to cozy up to the man who said Americans “deserved” the 9/11 attacks. (Indeed, McCain has now hired Falwell’s debate coach.)

* McCain used to oppose Bush’s tax cuts for the very wealthy, but he reversed course in February.

* In 2000, McCain accused Texas businessmen Sam and Charles Wyly of being corrupt, spending “dirty money” to help finance Bush’s presidential campaign. McCain not only filed a complaint against the Wylys for allegedly violating campaign finance law, he also lashed out at them publicly. In April, McCain reached out to the Wylys for support.

* McCain supported a major campaign-finance reform measure that bore his name. In June, he abandoned his own legislation.

* McCain used to think that Grover Norquist was a crook and a corrupt shill for dictators. Then McCain got serious about running for president and began to reconcile with Norquist.

* McCain took a firm line in opposition to torture, and then caved to White House demands.

* McCain gave up on his signature policy issue, campaign-finance reform, and won’t back the same provision he sponsored just a couple of years ago.

* McCain was against presidential candidates campaigning at Bob Jones University before he was for it.

* McCain was anti-ethanol. Now he’s pro-ethanol.

* McCain was both for and against state promotion of the Confederate flag.

* And now he’s both for and against overturning Roe v. Wade.

It’s not exactly a newsflash that McCain is veering ridiculously to the right in a rather shameless attempt to reinvent himself, but Dems should take advantage of the situation and help establish the narrative now. Despite his rather embarrassing record of late, we still have major media figures telling the public that “no one would accuse McCain of equivocating on anything.”

Now is the time to begin characterizing McCain — accurately — as a man with no principle beliefs. Dems should not only criticize McCain’s constantly evolving opinions on nearly everything, they should openly mock him for it now, so that the storyline becomes second nature (like the GOP did with “serial exaggerator” Al Gore).

I hope I didn't upset anyone in my prior posts, but I was just messing around being a devils advocate on the issues.

I do think that the draft would be fitting though for so many of the youth in our nation that do absolutely nothing.

[Izor]

you're going back 8 years to pull up shit on mccain. 8 years ago I thought a lot of stuff that I dont think now. This is different than Obama/Kerry/other retarded libs that flip flop in a few short months. I'd love to go that far back on Obama but he was a child 8 years ago lol.

your sarcasm about forced military service and the return of the draft is at best pushing it. Unless we go to a major war we have more than enough people willing to join. Our country has no place for forced service. We're not Europe. Its very hard to take someone and give them a rifle that has no desire to be there, especially with wars as unpopular as the one(s) we're in. Again, if we went to war with Russia/China/someone that mattered public opinion would change much

Yes, obese people that dont have anything wrong with them genetically to make them that way, as well as people who smoke, should not have insurance. Lets face it, its 2008. You know the risk you're taking on when you start smoking, or when you go to mcdonalds/bk/fast food joints every day (admittedly I am guilty of this, but i at least work out to stay in shape ). This will never happen in my lifetime, but shit normal, healthy people would pay considerably less on insurance if we just threw those people to the wolves.

[kthx]

"[McCain] was in a panel the other day with me, Rick Warren, some of you may have seen it -- and Rick Warren asked him -- how do you define rich? He said, maybe he was joking, he said, “$5 million.” Obama added, "Which I guess if you're making $3 million a year, you’re middle class. But that’s reflected in his policies -- where, you know, for people making more than $2.5 million, he’s giving folks a $500,000 tax break. And so this is a fundamental difference in this election. What I've said is we're gonna give 95% of working families a tax break, but it's gonna be ordinary folks."

Funny, the stage Obama gave his speech on cost 5 million dollars to build.

[404 Not Found]

No sarcasm intended on the draft. To serve would be a benefit to the infrastructure of our country, when one considers how the deterioration of our waterways, highways, rails and bridges are degrading. Serving in the military, based upon a draft and working to make this country a better place does not have to be pointed only at wartime.

The one problem I see is that the sub-contracted work to private corporations takes away from the soldiers trained to do more than cleaning a gun and being on watch. KP duty is now of the past, as this is contracted private labor that provides for the military, electronics, construction/engineering, mechanics and so on...

The military of the past was responsible for all aspects and training of our soldiers and prepared them with that training and a chance to further themseves with education once they leave the service.

Is it expansion of government or the military? Are they different? No, but we have downsized ourselves and have removed what once was an integral aspect of experience and training that is not as abundant today as it once was.

A draft would also effect the nation as a whole and not leave out such a large percentage of the population, due to no family members in the military and it not having any direct lifestyle impact...I mean, come on, there is more interest in Dancing with the Stars and American Idol than there is for the kid you barely know 10 houses down that just got shipped off. If it would impact a larger percentage of this countries population, then you would see more of an impact on the country as whole. Be it good or bad, depending if it is wartime or peace. It could also sway how one as president can declare war or use diplomacy.

The draft could be a large help to the economy and our overall mood in this nation.

When people mention the draft, all I can think of as well as many I know is the legacy of Vietnam. It doesn't have to be that way though.

[Kolar]

I don't like the idea of compulsory military service but as 404 said it doesn't have to be specific to wartime or even include active service on the ground in a conflict. If a not so insignificant percentage of the American public felt the effects of war directly on their family, stop loss and all... then maybe things would be better.

[HateTheFake]

I don't like the idea of compulsory military service but as 404 said it doesn't have to be specific to wartime or even include active service on the ground in a conflict. If a not so insignificant percentage of the American public felt the effects of war directly on their family, stop loss and all... then maybe things would be better.

i dont want to start a debate by any means, but now that we're in iraq we have given more people freedom/life then they would have if we werent there. Woman were being raped and killed on a whim. Men if they disagreed with sadaam were being killed if they were found out by their secret police. We gave a fearful country new life. Lives that would never have had a say. We lost lives, its true, but we are preventing more deaths by being there.

anyone else see the video of sadaam in a room full of people, calling out names and then killing that person?

[Jerome Scuggs]

since everyone is obviously like, super-pissed at having these 2 candidates

why do you not realize that there is a third option

i mean this is perhaps one of the first times that enough people are pissed that if you actually voted third party - who knows. a significant independent vote could send a signal to both major parties.

i'm gonna vote bob barr so i can vote but not have to vote for mccain and obama. barr's pretty much a d-bag but he's not obama or mccain.

obama mccain isn't about like fascism vs freedom or anything like that. they will both limit our liberties and freedoms siginificantly, and it's just a matter of which liberties and how. mccain wants a draft and obama wants universal-that-which-should-not-be-named as well as his stuff with the environment, nafta, education etc.

what i am hoping for (and im making alot of assumptions here) is that neither candidate will do shit in fulfilling their campaign promises. it's just that right now, they don't have the money or the cred or the legal room. they can make plans and goals but they will be vastly limited and small and won't do much. assuming the economy follows what i am predicting (which up until this point has been fairly correct imo), the president whoever he is will have a very tough job and i'm sure they will have enough political capital (a combination of initial cred plus "you're not bush" cred + immediate need cred) to pass alot of relatively extreme measures to take a stab at fixing the economy or other problems. this concerns me.

obama though for all his faults does have the gift of patience and the foresight of economic wisdom (mccain openly admits he knows jack-all about economics so why should he fucking legislate economic decisions? stupid) so he has a tendency to advocate alot of "long-term" goals which is slightly less irresponsible than what i think mccain would want.

hopefully the american people are obviously a bit more attentive and watchful of whoever the new president is and sees to it that iraq is dealt with and the bureaucracy is cleaned up and "de-politicized" (what a weird and ironic word). (edit: this is assuming that i am wrong about democracy and the "people" can in fact change government. anyone want to make a 4-year bet?)

but more than anything man... january 2009. everyone will remember where they were on that historic day when bush gets the fuck out. man. my parents voted in the one guy who might be considered worse than jimmy carter and in fact is the reason jimmy carter even speaks in public anymore. this upsets me.