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  • GM Saturn & Penske deal fails

    Say goodbye to Saturn! Not that I ever liked Saturns.
    DETROIT - General Motors Co. will shut down Saturn now that a deal with former race car driver and auto dealer magnate Roger Penske has collapsed, marking the end of a brand that was supposed to revolutionize the way small cars were built and sold in America.
    Seems like the dealers are now also SOL.
    "This is very disappointing news and comes after months of hard work by hundreds of dedicated employees and Saturn retailers who tried to make the new Saturn a reality," GM CEO Fritz Henderson said. He said Saturn and its dealership network will be phased out.

    GM is relying heavily on Chevy and Buick. I personally though that Pontiac should have stayed and Buick should have been phased out.

    On a different note, but still focused on GM; looking at the Buicks vs. let's say...Toyota, why would I buy a Buick? For example:

    Buick Enclave: Starting price $35,165.00 16/22 est avg mpg

    Toyota Venza: Starting price $25,975.00 21/29 est avg mpg

    I have driven both of these cars and personally the Toyota drives better hands down as well as it has numerous features that the GM Enclave does not have.

    Re-sale on these two cars is also night and day, considering that Toyota still retains much of its value as the Buicks seem to lose 1/2 their value once you drive it off the dealers lot.

    Even the comparing of the Buick LaCrosse vs. the Toyota Camry is tilted the same way as the Enclave vs. the Venza.

    Why pay out the ass for less? I guess GM still has not learned a lesson and is on track for failure again it would seem. GM should watch how Ford has turned around their product and what they are offering customers.

    GM's comeback seems to be their new campaign: "Drive it for 60 days and if you don't like it, just return it."

    I test drove it at the dealer and returned it in a matter of 20 minutes, I didn't need 60 days.

    I could have compared GM to Ford, but I have not persoanlly test driven any of the new Fords, so this is based solely upon what I experienced. I do like what Ford is doing though!
    May your shit come to life and kiss you on the face.

  • #2
    GM pwn the car industry...

    scrap that Mitsubishi pick-ups do coz in every street in a 3rd world country has one...no idea how they afford it!
    PUNCH SLOW WALKING PEOPLE IN THE BACK OF THE HEAD.

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    • #3
      As long as we've got a current car thread going, let me pick everyone's brain as to what I should do about my car situation.

      I've got a POS Chrysler that has gotten me through college. Sometime in the next year I'm gonna take the plunge and get something else. Probably still used, but in much better condition definitely. Here's the problem, I'm looking for 3 things and so far that I know, no car really delivers all three. These are in no particular order.


      Criteria 1 - I'd really like to drive a beamer. They're flat out fun to drive, and definitely stylish. Used ones can be had for around $10k.


      Criteria 2 - I'd really like something get gets good fuel efficiency. This kind of leads me to a Honda Civic or Insight or Toyota Prius. I really don't want to become a yuppie though, I can't really see myself driving a Prius for any other reason besides getting good gas mileage.


      Criteria 3 - I plan to go skiing a lot. Having a 4-wheel or all-wheel drive option would be nice for going to icy places, but then again that kind of kills the gas mileage thing as the extra weight from a system like that on a typical SUV just detracts from the gas mileage all the rest of the time.

      Right now I'm thinking about a Subaru Outback, but does anyone know of other options I'm overlooking?
      Last edited by Fit of Rage; 10-01-2009, 02:09 PM.
      5:royst> i was junior athlete of the year in my school! then i got a girlfriend
      5:the_paul> calculus is not a girlfriend
      5:royst> i wish it was calculus

      1:royst> did you all gangbang my gf or something

      1:fermata> why dont you get money fuck bitches instead

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Sube View Post
        GM pwn the car industry...

        scrap that Mitsubishi pick-ups do coz in every street in a 3rd world country has one...no idea how they afford it!
        Such a meaningful and relevant reply Sube. I take it that you live or have lived in a third world nation? GM can build a decent work truck, but Buick is an overpriced old mans car. Obviously on a world wide level, Mitsubishi makes a decent car and truck. I owned a Montero years ago that was one of the best cars I had owned. If you read my post though, the comment made is noting how can GM price their cars so high with less to offer. They are no match for Toyota and even Ford in the price and MPG value.
        May your shit come to life and kiss you on the face.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Fit of Rage View Post
          As long as we've got a current car thread going, let me pick everyone's brain as to what I should do about my car situation.

          I've got a POS Chrysler that has gotten me through college. Sometime in the next year I'm gonna take the plunge and get something else. Probably still used, but in much better condition definitely. Here's the problem, I'm looking for 3 things and so far that I know, no car really delivers all three. These are in no particular order.

          Criteria 1 - I'd really like to drive a beamer. They're flat out fun to drive, and definitely stylish. Used ones can be had for around $10k.


          Criteria 2 - I'd really like something get gets good fuel efficiency. This kind of leads me to a Honda Civic or Insight or Toyota Prius. I really don't want to become a yuppie though, I can't really see myself driving a Prius for any other reason besides getting good gas mileage.

          Criteria 3 - I plan to go skiing a lot. Having a 4-wheel or all-wheel drive option would be nice for going to icy places, but then again that kind of kills the gas mileage thing as the extra weight from a system like that on a typical SUV just detracts from the gas mileage all the rest of the time.

          Right now I'm thinking about a Subaru Outback, but does anyone know of other options I'm overlooking?
          You have a couple options. BMW's are real nice and yes you can get a used one for a decent price, but the bad side is that the service can be a financial burden. BMW does offer a great lease deal. You would have a 3 year lease with everything covered, such as oil changes, tires, inspection and so on bumper to bumper. VW also offers such a deal as well, and personally, I think that the VW drives great in the snow. Good deals on VW leases as well (Jetta's, Passat & Beetles).

          Suaru's are ok, however I always felt cramped when I drove one. They are great for people 5'8" and under...but maybe that was just me.

          If you have a full time job, I would personally look at a lease over buying the car. After 3 years you give it back and everything, if anything had gone wrong, would have been covered. Always seems to me that when you buy a car, as soon as it is paid off, something goes wrong and you get nickeled and dimed.

          My lease on my Honda Pilot is coming to an end, so I have been having fun hitting the dealers and test driving everything. Buying is such a pain in the ass today...and this is just me, I always am ready to drive something different after 3 years.
          May your shit come to life and kiss you on the face.

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          • #6
            Bimmers are good if you can afford them, but plan on spending a decent amount to drive in style. Sure you can get a used 3-Series relatively cheap but then what's the point of getting a luxury car? I'd say try to find a used M3 - E36 (a model of the M3 during the better part of the 90s) is a slick version that I don't think has been topped since. E46 is what you're more likely to find with a usable amount of miles on it and they're nice too.

            Subaru Outbacks are nice, an easy drive, and have plenty of space compared to sedans. If you're serious about the snow and stuff but don't want an SUV I think the Outback is your best bet. Almost an SUV but with relatively good gas mileage for its size and AWD feature.

            Hybrids suck, I won't say anymore on that.

            I agree with 404 that a Passat or Jetta could also be good for what you want. I haven't driven any VWs newer than 2005 but I've always enjoyed them. I guess you've already ruled out a truck but that's what I'd get if I were you.

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            • #7
              Get a honda pilot or a Golf.
              Originally posted by Tone
              Women who smoke cigarettes are sexy, not repulsive. It depends on the number smoked. less is better

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              • #8
                http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ggrNz...ayer_embedded#
                sigpic
                All good things must come to an end.

                Comment


                • #9
                  I would say Volvo!
                  Maybe God was the first suicide bomber and the Big Bang was his moment of Glory.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Galleleo View Post
                    I would say Volvo!
                    Maybe in Europe, but here in the States Volvo's get horrible gas mileage, always are flunking the emissions tests and are costly to maintain.

                    My kid has a 1990 240 that will not die. They are great for that aspect! However, he is putting money into that hunk of crap every month it seems. If it rains, it won't start & they are notorious for the engine mounts to break. Old and or used Volvo's IMHO are crap. Better off with a used Honda, Toyota or Nissan.

                    Oddly enough for a new car, the C60 only gets 16 MPG City...horrible for a NEW car. The C30, which is nice in design, gets decent mileage at 21 City and 30 Hwy. At $24-26,000.00 price range and limited space, you're paying for a name and not much more. You would be better of with a VW GTI Diesel loaded at less costs in terms of mileage, overall interior space, performance, price & warranty.

                    BTW...Volvo only gives a 3 year free maintenance overall warranty up to 30,000 miles solely for maintenance and 4 years 50,000 basic. Most give 3 years bumper to bumper or 100,000 miles whichever comes first. Does not say much for the manufacturers backing of this car.

                    Nice design though...looks like the old Toyota Tercel from the late 70's
                    May your shit come to life and kiss you on the face.

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                    • #11
                      Hmm, Volvo is pretty good and dependable over here. We have been driving second hand Volvo all my life, never had any problems.
                      Maybe God was the first suicide bomber and the Big Bang was his moment of Glory.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Galleleo View Post
                        Hmm, Volvo is pretty good and dependable over here. We have been driving second hand Volvo all my life, never had any problems.
                        They do last forever, but as noted, can nickle and dime you to death....at least in the States. I had liked the old old Volvo's before they added all the electronics to the engines. Back when anyone could pop the hood and work on it without a computer hookup.

                        What year Volvo do you have and is it the Volvo before they became part of the Ford ownership?

                        Emissions is my biggest gripe with the 240. They are one of the worst emission car on the road, outside of the India made Tata which has no emission control whatsoever.
                        May your shit come to life and kiss you on the face.

                        Comment


                        • #13


                          Had a F-150 Quad Cab XLT for 3 years, never one problem at all, 80k miles.

                          Brakes, Engine, Transmission, AC, Belts, Alternator, Battery, Suspension, nothing except for the tires has ever been changed out of it. And I get at least 15-20 mpg, which is great since I only pay 1.95 for gas here in Houston.

                          Who the fuck wants to drive a shitty mini or hybrid that looks and sounds gay and that you have to squeeze into and bend your knees to touch the petals. Fuck that.
                          Rabble Rabble Rabble

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                          • #14
                            Except mine doesn't have the running boards, not that I need them, Other than that, same color and everything.
                            Rabble Rabble Rabble

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by 404 Not Found View Post
                              GM is relying heavily on Chevy and Buick. I personally though that Pontiac should have stayed and Buick should have been phased out.
                              While Buicks suck in North America, in some parts of the world Buicks are really nice. In China, they are definitely considered more luxury cars, and they actually LOOK at lot nicer, leather seats, European styling, etc. Actually I think Buick in China is one of the biggest sectors for GM right now and the fastest growing.
                              Epinephrine's History of Trench Wars:
                              www.geocities.com/epinephrine.rm

                              My anime blog:
                              www.animeslice.com

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