Bandwagon Atheists and religions

[bloodzombie]

Vitron, you got me all wrong. I'm not interested in "faking" my way into heaven, nor am I interested in claiming to be religious.

Originally posted by Vitron2
It has nothing to do with going to church (don’t hear me wrong, you should go to church, find out more about this, ask the pastor questions). But it’s a personal relationship, and faith. That’s what keeps you out of eternal pain and punishment for turning your back.

This is the part of christianity that I disagree with most (and I'm not so sure about the stories about jesus either). I'm not turning my back on god, I even talk to god sometimes, whether he's really there or not, I don't know, but after 8 years of catholic school, I guess it's sort of habbit.

I just can't imagine that a god of love would create us, give us no proof of him and the free will to believe whatever we want, and then give us eternal pain and punishment if we don't pick the right religion. What about tribal people who have no contact with christians? are they doomed because of where they were born? or people born into a buddhist household, or even jews? who's doomed to eternal pain and punishment?

No god that I believe in would do that.

[Vitron2]

Vitron, you got me all wrong. I'm not interested in "faking" my way into heaven, nor am I interested in claiming to be religious.

I was being general to everyone.

I just can't imagine that a god of love would create us, give us no proof of him

Look around you, everywhere there is proof. What's your idea on how we got created. If you are into science I have alot of books for you to check out. One is called 'the creator and the cosmos' (somthing like that).

free will to believe whatever we want

I don't think you would want to be a mindless zombie forced to believe somthing.

and then give us eternal pain and punishment if we don't pick the right religion. What about tribal people who have no contact with christians? are they doomed because of where they were born? or people born into a buddhist household, or even jews? who's doomed to eternal pain and punishment?

No god that I believe in would do that.

It's a Christian's responsiblility to reach these 'tribal' people and so forth.

Here is the way it is, God is a just God. Therefor he punishes us for sin. But he is also merciful, he gave us a means of exscape from the punishment. --the only thing we have to do is take it--


Vitron

[bloodzombie]

Originally posted by Vitron2
[B]

It's a Christian's responsiblility to reach these 'tribal' people and so forth.

Here is the way it is, God is a just God. Therefor he punishes us for sin. But he is also merciful, he gave us a means of exscape from the punishment. --the only thing we have to do is take it--


Vitron

Well, my question is, what happens to these heathens?


As far as your argument about the proof of gods existence, I can see where you're coming from, but even if you accept that as proof of a divine being, it doesn't prove that a single word of the bible is true.

[sTuPiD-gErBiL]

Originally posted by Vitron2
It's a Christian's responsiblility to reach these 'tribal' people and so forth.

that's the biggest thing i hate about christianity. it's NOT your responsibility to convert anyone. these people have their own set of gods that they've been quite happy worshipping for a very long time (in some cases, longer than christianity has even existed). you should keep your faith, but not force it on anyone else... because it's all the same thing anyways, just in different perspectives. you, as a christian, are no more correct about your set of beliefs as any other person of another religion. instead, you should learn about other cultures/religions and celebrate the similarities between your two religions. then you'll have something in common with those people so you can worship side-by-side with them instead of forcing them to think the way you do.

besides... you might learn something from them.

[bloodzombie]

Think of all the people who have died without ever even meeting a christian... and all of them, straight to hell.

god's an evil bastard, isn't he?

[Vitron2]

Ok, the best way to decide whether God is real or not is to use debate through evidence. Also, Flaming lowers any chance of a productive debate. So lets start on a topic that deals with evidence instead of just yelling at each other at the top of our lungs.

Lets choose a topic (science related, that you believe will prove your point), don't give your view on the subject and then let everyone else have time to bring thought-out replies on the topic.

If you would allow me I will start the first subject, "The creation event" Now lets see if we can get some good responses and don't quote anyone elses reply to argue against it. Just try to prove your point on what you think "The creation event" was and your view on it (Bring evidence).


Vitron

[bloodzombie]

I wasn't yelling at all, I'm really curious about how you feel about the fact that throughout history, millions, maybe billions of people have died without ever being exposed to christianity. Do you really believe that god sent all those people to hell?

[bloodzombie]

It's like you're trying to force an argument that nobody's making, because it fits the books you've read. nobody's arguing the existence of god (at least not in the past few posts).

[brookus]

Originally posted by Vitron2
Just try to prove your point on what you think "The creation event" was and your view on it (Bring evidence).

The creation event was a fat boy that used a packet of "Make your own Universe!" mix. He poured it in a jar and applied a little heat and poof... universe. My proof is that I sometimes look up and see a huge eyeball looking down from the sky. Also, I have this book that tells me this is the truth (actually, it's more of a post-it note than a book. But the first line reads "This is the Truth", so it must be the truth.).

My fear is the day that the jar holding us will fall and break and our universe will float along in his universe. Very scary.

llater,
Tony

[za gophar]

i would agree with the movie dogma in its stance that all that matters is that you are "out there trying." this still leaves millions of questions and doubts in my mind, but then i see someone who i look up to in real life and their firm belief that there god exists, it evens out the doubts and questions. i feel the same way bz does, pretty much.

[Mandagorian]

Re: Bandwagon Atheists and religions

Originally posted by Liquid Blue
Hello all, I just wanted to get your opinion/gripes on any of the major religions (Judaism, Christianity, Atheism) and about bandwagon Atheists. For all you atheists out there, don't get your panties in a bunch. I don't mean you, because you all haven't given me a reason to think your a bandwagon atheist. I mean those people you see on forums that act like atheism is all high and mighty and then when you try to get into a religion debate they just basically say " God doesn't exist I'm awesome ". No evidence, no thought out responses, just condescending rabble mixed with a pinch of sarcasm. To me they seem like they became Atheists just because it seemed cool to do. Go with the internet flow and all that.So discuss and I'll post my own later on.

I think you have it backwards, the religous debate well the most frequent one was where people we hiding behind their beliefs when they were asked a question of some debate. It's been run through the ground and this thread was a bad idea.

[stark]

Originally posted by bloodzombie
Think of all the people who have died without ever even meeting a christian... and all of them, straight to hell.

god's an evil bastard, isn't he?

the way i learned it is that as long as you have faith in your religion and stay faithful, you can still go to heaven... not that only christians go to heaven

[Vitron2]

Ok, nm, It is very hard to argue anything productivly on a BB. (Oh, and yes I would have liked to taken it to the scientific point of view because that is an area that I greatly enjoy)


Vitron

[CrvenBan]

How can you argue about a thing that most likely is a product of human imagination ?

What is the scientific point of view in non- or existence of God ? There is absolutley ZERO proof for either. It's just empty talk where one party is trying to convert other party into believing same thing as them. Belive in what you wish, let everyone else belive in what they want. We are sacks of water and probably gonna get "turned off" when we die, but it would be nice if this isn't everything (does afterlife counts for all the animals that have ever lived too?).

Stark, what about if your religion does not have a heaven ?


True story: an older man (in his 40s) that I know (he's dad of 2 girls that are my friends), had gotten poisoned one day. He ended up in ER, where doctors were fighting to save his life. He lived, but when he was in critical condition, he claims that he had seen the God who told him that his time is not in yet, and that had sent him back. He is Catholic that goes to church and practices his religion, and that event influenced him in a great way.
Only problem: he got poisoned by eating some sort of mushroom, a halucinogenic one, and most likely, he had been tripping all that time. And the shroom was working cuz he had SEEN THE GOD !! HAH! That kills me every time.


Btw, I am muslim, and Bracco, fuck you too.

[Liquid Blue]

And the shroom was working cuz he had SEEN THE GOD !! HAH! That kills me every time

So you're trying to say that because 1 man tripped off of a shroom and saw God, he must be fake? There is as much evidence to prove God is real as there is to prove that he is not real. I think he wanted it that way and yes, I do believe in God and Heaven/Hell.