My Roof Has Been Ruined

[Troll King]

Any idea is a step in improving the game. TWPS is a system to possibly bring any idea that one might have into the game. We don't need a "sense of direction" just ideas as to what players think would be good for the game. That's how staff is going about this, as far as my understanding goes anyway.

Yes we do. Take zone population size for example. Someone would say that increasing the zone's population is the best sign of improvement. They would then suggest ideas that would appeal to the lowest common denominator (and for the longest time in TW, that's what we did). Making levis more powerful would be one possible way to do it. On the other hand, some would argue that increasing the population of the zone is a bad thing because we aren't really capable of maintaining a high quality for such a large population. We already see some of the strains to the system today. A lot of the problems the zone has get inflated with a large population. Additionally, the influx of new players don't come to the zone because of the basing and basing suffers. Overall quantity goes up but overall quality goes down. Some would argue that it'd be better to fix the quality first and then focus on popularity, but others would argue that popularity is a sign of quality. Here we have two different views on "sense of direction" and some changes will work for one direction but will actually create more problems for the other direction.

The issue Ephemeral is asking for is what do we actually mean by "improvement"? If you want another example, look at levis. Some people would say that taking levis out of the game (or removing their role as a heavy bomber) would improve the game. On the other hand, many others will say that that would ruin the zone. In their own perspectives, they are both correct, but staff has to decide which way to move.

[Ephemeral]

Any idea is a step in improving the game. TWPS is a system to possibly bring any idea that one might have into the game. We don't need a "sense of direction" just ideas as to what players think would be good for the game. That's how staff is going about this, as far as my understanding goes anyway.

I disagree. This forum works as a method to 'bring any idea that one might have into the game' and it doesn't work.

The reason is as I stated, no objective, no direction, no sense of purpose. TW just exists. Anyone who has been involved with this community for several years knows this, it vacillates back and forth. Staff turns over at too high of rate, none of the ‘mover and shakers’ stay long enough to affect substantial change. Arenas, ships, ideas all simply evolve with no direction and little long-term reason.

Sure, if you take a short-term perspective, you can always find a few examples of ideas and changes that show up on the radar screen. But show me where these changes have impacted long-term substantial growth, for example.

Sitting around throwing ‘good ideas’ into the air, without direction, leads no where. Just like these forums. Go back and sort through all the lame ideas with little or no thought behind them, whining, trash talk, flames, etc. In fact, there are many, many really good ideas posted in this forum, they are just lost among the ‘witty’ dribble.

[Arikel]

Your selling, but I'm not buying.
My opinion is that you have a pretty good idea, but only parts of what it would take to really change TW. The key to positive growth is a well defined objective, a strong leadership structure, and a communication mechanism that allows creative ideas to flow from all angles. The absence of any one of these parts will make it very, very hard to drive real positive change.

Let's look at each one of the three parts I mentioned, objective, leadership structure, and communication mechanism.

First, a well defines objective. This is critical in my opinion, has my previous post pointed out. Your post mentioned that an objective can be used to 'solidify' the efforts. For me, it is much more than that, it is absolutely key since everything that gets done is measured against it. Plus it helps keep things on track, everyone focused, and is used to stops turn over of the 'movers and shakers'. Nothing is more frustrating than to volunteer, pour tons of time and effort into something, and still feel like the purpose is just 'to exist'. Feeling like progress is being made is key to keeping people 'on-board' and working towards the objective. Not all tasks are intrinsically satisfying. Many of the 'grunt' tasks are required to be completed, doing the dirty work is a lot more satisfying if a person feels and sees progress is being made against a goal.

Second, a well organized leadership structure. My opinion is that this could not be done 'by committee'. Leadership by committee is a very hard thing to make work and often results in ideas that are 'watered down' and decisions that take too long to make. Additionally, you end up with diffusion of responsibility. The key is to establish a hierarchy, hold each person responsible for getting things done, and then periodically analyzing how each person is performing. If the performance isn't there, make changes.

Third, a effective communication mechanism that allows creative ideas to become implemented. This is where the 'democracy' part comes in. Everyone should feel like they have a way to provide input that gets heard. The TW community has always bitched about this, just look in these forums how people try to use them as a 'suggestion box', or how everyone feels that sending a email to ban@whatever.com doesn't work. It is like calling into your local cable company and not being able to actually talk to a real person, stuck in some endless loop from support system hell.

Just my opinion IF the TW community wants to move away from the current system of 'it's just a game, who gives a fuck'.

Whoa! you look like my management teacher speaking ^-^ ! Ok jokes aside i don't think a hierarchical structure might have all the nice stuff that you point out because you cannot forget that tw is not a corporation... people that are here are using their free times and have no obligation towards no one... a hierarchical structure implies that whoever sits at the top has the strenght and the responsability for those below and a structure like that is rigid and does not allow the swift changes that are bound to happen on a spaceship game staff since people can come and go as they please...
On the other comment about the objective i understand and agree with what you say... long term objectives help the team to focus and to get something to measure their performance... although i think that we could add some things in there, for exampe measuring the quality of service with polls and actually involving the comunnity in the aspects of how tw is faring might have a added bonus "if preocupation with the players and meeting their expectations is actually a concern".
About the communication between the whole chain of command thingy i think i don't have no comment to add as i think it is of utmost importance to have a easy way to communicate between all staff...

About TWPS! It is a nice step towards the community participation in the development of the game... although some parts of it do not seem to be quite what i expected... for example the part where they actually imply that the players who propose the change MUST have the most active part in it... i didn't fully understood what it meant...

[404 Not Found]

I like the new settings...guess I am one of a few, but my suggestion is to get rid of the stealth on a weasel. When play in a weasel, I could care less to stealth. Being that the size of the weasel is as small as it is, why do we need to stealth it anymore? every other ship is displayed, and if need be they thrust away from oncoming fire or simply dodge them....so why not make the playing field even and get rid of all stealth. If stealth was to remain for the weasel, I would recommend making it full size again.

Not many of the weasels I see in pub use there stealth capabilities....some do, but for the most part I see alot that do not.

[Ephemeral]

i don't think a hierarchical structure might have all the nice stuff that you point out because you cannot forget that tw is not a corporation... people that are here are using their free times and have no obligation towards no one... a hierarchical structure implies that whoever sits at the top has the strenght and the responsability for those below and a structure like that is rigid and does not allow the swift changes that are bound to happen on a spaceship game staff since people can come and go as they please....

So you are saying that just because people aren't paid, a leadership structure doesn't work or isn't needed? I disagree, there are many examples of volunteer organizations with a structured leadership approach.
In fact, there is already a leadership structure in place with TW (staff hierarchy), so it isn't a reach at all. Even at the squad level there are captains and Assistant Captains.

No, simply put I am saying that if people are really interested in changing TW, they need to look at it from the 'top down'. Trying to make things better by pulling on all the little things that might be done better is a stupid way to approach it.

I am trying to share some of my experience here, that's all. It has only been in the last 10-15 years that I learned to do many things from the 'top down' and with well thought through objective.

Additionally, I simply don't buy into the whole 'it's just a game' line. First, ask the people who say that what there ?usage is (time is money). Second, go try to be captain of a community softball team. Recruit some players who are there to win at any cost, then recruit some players who just want to have fun. Then come back and tell me;
- how well the team did that season
- that having an pre-defined objective isn't important
- it's just game
- whether or not you would ever like to be captain again

[Arikel]

So you are saying that just because people aren't paid, a leadership structure doesn't work or isn't needed? I disagree, there are many examples of volunteer organizations with a structured leadership approach.
In fact, there is already a leadership structure in place with TW (staff hierarchy), so it isn't a reach at all. Even at the squad level there are captains and Assistant Captains.

No, simply put I am saying that if people are really interested in changing TW, they need to look at it from the 'top down'. Trying to make things better by pulling on all the little things that might be done better is a stupid way to approach it.

I am trying to share some of my experience here, that's all. It has only been in the last 10-15 years that I learned to do many things from the 'top down' and with well thought through objective.

Additionally, I simply don't buy into the whole 'it's just a game' line. First, ask the people who say that what there ?usage is (time is money). Second, go try to be captain of a community softball team. Recruit some players who are there to win at any cost, then recruit some players who just want to have fun. Then come back and tell me;
- how well the team did that season
- that having an pre-defined objective isn't important
- it's just game
- whether or not you would ever like to be captain again

Oh... what i meant to say... and didn't managed to write... was that tw's structure cannot work in a hierarquy the same way you do in a company... i tryed to say was that tw's structure must be more flexible because of tw's own nature.. wich is people are here doing free work and are not always available to do their work... has oposite to a company where you expect everything is working perfectly and you can have a rigid structure and hierarchy... basicly what i'm trying to say is that staff as a whole need's to have some shortcut's available to them and cannot expect to depend on other upper staffers to be available... so that in order to do something you need to do it tiny bit's at once... it sucks to have to be that way but i don't think there's any other way, if there is i guess it would be better but i don't think it's feasible to be applyed.

[Ephemeral]

I agree very much, I only advocate more structure than a two tier organization (for example, players and a committee).

[Jeenyuss]

I think the jav needs it's X Radar back as well.

[Asmodeus]

Okay okay, so we do need a "sense of direction" but the fact remains, it's all going to have to happen through TWPS. So if anyone feels they have an idea to improve the game, no matter what direction it might take the game, TWPS is the best way to go.

[RoDNeY]

hmmm is it just me or did anyone else notice that zabuza's sig is all about rape

[Ephemeral]

Okay okay, so we do need a "sense of direction" but the fact remains, it's all going to have to happen through TWPS. So if anyone feels they have an idea to improve the game, no matter what direction it might take the game, TWPS is the best way to go.

Asmo,
After rereading my posts above, I am sorry I came across so negative. I DO think that any work and effort towards making TW better is a good thing. It just bothers me to see people pour their time and effort into something, get frustrated, and then quit staff.
I am very glad that the people care enough to try, it is just a shame that with just it a little more work, things would probably improve greatly.

But hey, everyone has their own agendas and priorities in life, and I try not to judge them. My wife works for a guy who has no interest in growing his business. He just maintains it to keep busy.

[Kolar]

Well I'm not going to give up staff because my idea was rejected but I think a lot of staffers are put off by the lack of motivation and want to make this zone better by everyone here. I don't think this zone merely exist, why paid close to 1000 $ a month for it, why spend all your time on TW Dev, on staff, working on TWsites, on projects, and on squads if you didn't want to make it better?

I think during the creation of TWPS it was found that committees for everything... just wouldn't work, we don't have the population for it. I'm not even sure about all the changes you've suggested Eph, I think you've got a better mind for this kind of stuff but realisticly, upper staff will allow for little change until the zone dies. I think if we want something to be made better, we need the support of uppers then we can work together like I said on an issue, even if all that's done is sending in a proposal.

[1338 - 1]

I don't play Javs much, but when I do it does suck not having xradar anymore. We can't expect terrs to do EVERYTHING in the base.

[bubbles19518]

I agree with Vehicle, give the javs back thier x-radar. Make it so the x's can cloak as long as they want. Keep them small. Keep new lance. Thats just my opinion. I think that would make pub most fun.

[Kuukunen]

I think every ship should have x radar. Or actually x should be removed altogether. Not just so that javs could roof, because I think roofing should be prevented too. For example putting a bot there automatically banning people who go roof. (Or just put some blocks in their way.)

This thread is stupid.