Time for another pub map vote.

[wadi]

It's been 6-12 months since trench last voted on the pub map. I know I feel the map's a little stale; maybe it's time for another vote? Might need to get a few maps together before then, but boki, 2dbase, fatbase, and the other preview bases are still up. could also use the forum's nifty poll function to find out if people want a new map.

[Jonas]

No use trashing the old maps, but they were downvoted the last time, and will be again. There's no use voting on the same maps again. Back to the drawingboard, make some new maps, put them up, then we can vote again.

[Ruby]

Originally posted by Jonas
No use trashing the old maps, but they were downvoted the last time, and will be again. There's no use voting on the same maps again. Back to the drawingboard, make some new maps, put them up, then we can vote again.

Agreed, even though I think you're a man-whore

[Troll King]

Originally posted by Jonas
No use trashing the old maps, but they were downvoted the last time, and will be again. There's no use voting on the same maps again. Back to the drawingboard, make some new maps, put them up, then we can vote again.

It was a while ago so I may be mistaken on this. Someone correct me if I'm wrong:


Didn't the poll end with the current old map receiving the most votes out of any of the maps but much lower than a 50% + 1 majority? As in, even though it received the most votes, didn't more people vote for the other maps than for the current one? Doesn't that mean that more people want change than not?

[Dantax]

I want change too. But that doesn't mean I want a crappy map.

I think someone brought this up before, but the main things we need are some new candidates, and a runoff system, so we end up with the most popular new map versus the old map, rather than a free for all.

[wadi]

Personally, I'd like to see the Boki map back in the running. It's a favorite amongst many basers, and Boki put a really nice polish on it that uses the .lvz stuff in a nice clean way. It'd be a shame just to trash it.

Another thing to mention is that it'd be nice to see either fewer candidates or a run off amongst top candidates if a new map vote is taken. Last time there were 5 new maps so the "change" votes where spread much to thin to win against the people who voted for the current map just because it was what they knew and didn't want to learn. That's not to say that a good number of people don't like the current map, but I think they're outnumbered by the people that are lazy.

[Eeks]

I think the current map is fine. Just needs some colours into it

[THE PUSHER]

Originally posted by Eeks
I think the current map is fine. Just needs some colours into it

Agreed! Give it some flair! Give it some style! Outside of that.. leave it the hell alone. If you are going to do a vote, make it one popular base against the current pub. You cant truly vote for a change of that magnitude if you have 650 choices to choose from.


Person 1> well we have 345 bases tied with one vote , 304 bases with 2... and fatbase with 3 somehow

Person 2> welcome to TW! check out our fatbase! (I'm going back to EG)

Person 3> sigh

[Adman]

Why in the middle of the season. That's what the main problem as last time.

Wait until the end so that in the off season the squad can learn new angles and such.

[THE PUSHER]

Originally posted by Troll King



It was a while ago so I may be mistaken on this. Someone correct me if I'm wrong:


Didn't the poll end with the current old map receiving the most votes out of any of the maps but much lower than a 50% + 1 majority? As in, even though it received the most votes, didn't more people vote for the other maps than for the current one? Doesn't that mean that more people want change than not?

Boy.. you'll make a fine democrat someday. Your logic is flawed. More people may have wanted change, but there was still a majority united to vote for one map. Not a bunch of people all voting for different maps simply because they were offered an option that looked pretty.

EXAMPLE:

30 voters

5 choices

13 vote for current pub <--this is often referred to as the majority

4 vote for design 1

6 vote for design 2

2 vote for design 3

5 vote for design 4


Majority voting is not about how many people voted for different things. Majority voting refers to the largest amount of people voting for the same candidate or choice. 13 people uniting to vote for one map is the majority, regardless of the fact that 17 people combined to vote for different maps.

[Mythrandir]

I think it's a good idea to let a player set the maps in the order which he likes best.

So give him a first pick, second pick, third pick etc.

This allows the voter to express opinions like "I like ?go boki best, or do ?go 2dbase otherwise. If neither gets picked, then rather stick to the current map."

[Mitch]

i like the 1 we have now

[Latrine]

I think it would be cool to have multipile, like four or so, maps approved for league play. And the map is just randomly chosen for each match. You know what they say, variety is the spice of life. And I don't think there is a single game multiplayer other than Subspace that plays on one map and one map only. Or at least the alternatives are more popular although not as much as the most popular map, obviously.

[Cig Smoke]

i liek the one we got now also like sed tho colors would spice it up a lil bit and why do we got them blocks there to prevent Lt's from more kills they just found new angles into the base to get them anyway :x

[Troll King]

Originally posted by THE PUSHER


Boy.. you'll make a fine democrat someday. Your logic is flawed. More people may have wanted change, but there was still a majority united to vote for one map. Not a bunch of people all voting for different maps simply because they were offered an option that looked pretty.

EXAMPLE:

30 voters

5 choices

13 vote for current pub <--this is often referred to as the majority

4 vote for design 1

6 vote for design 2

2 vote for design 3

5 vote for design 4


Majority voting is not about how many people voted for different things. Majority voting refers to the largest amount of people voting for the same candidate or choice. 13 people uniting to vote for one map is the majority, regardless of the fact that 17 people combined to vote for different maps.

That's not a majority. Look up "majority" in the dictionary before you lecture me on my logic. You have 13 people voting for while a total of 17 voted against. A "majority" is considered to be anything more than 50% and 13 out of 17 is not. What we have instead was a minority winner.

Because of the way the vote was set up there was an inherent bias towards the old map. My point was that more people wanted change than not. Sticking with the old map because there was no clear cut replacement was the only option they could take, BUT, it also calls for further follow up action because it was clear that a majority wanted some kind of change. What happened instead was that 6 months went by with the status quo.

If you take a look at countries that use the parliamentry system of government, a party that gets the most seats wins but is what is called a minority government. That means that they won the election but in theory cannot do things because any laws they try to pass will be voted down in parliament by the other seats unless they can manage to get another party to support them. The result is usually another election if that doesn't work out.

In our case, we have a minority map but there was no real public concensus to stay with the current map.

What if, for example, the results were as follows:

Out of 30 votes:

10 for map 1

8 for map 2

7 for map 3

5 for map 4


The map that received the most votes is map 1 (this is, by the way NOT considered to be a majority) but a total of 20 to 10 voted against map 1. Can you successfully argue that map 1 won a clear majority?



Now, as far as how to run the voting procedure, instead of using a playoff style voting where maps are eliminated after each round, why don't we use the system used by most sports leagues to vote for MVP awards or for Hall of Fame inductions?


What they do is, instead of having a straight vote, give the voters a ballot to vote for their first, second, and third choices. For example, a basketball voter might place Tim Duncan first, Jason Kidd second and Shaq O'Neill third. In the NBA method, a first place vote gets 10 points, second gets 7 points, 5 for third, and so on. When the ballots are counted they add the total number of points earned per player. For example, if Tim Duncan received 30 first place votes, 10 second place votes and 5 third place votes, he would get:

30 * 10 + 10 * 7 + 5 * 5 = 395 points.

The player with the most points would win.


Now, applying this to TW maps, we could set up a ballot to vote for first, second (and third, depending on how many candidates there are) choice. With 4 or 5 candidates, it would make sense just to have 2 spots. A first place vote would receive 3 points and a second place vote would receives 2 points. When voting, players would select their number 1 choice and then their number 2 choice. This wouldn't be very difficult to calculate a winner and be the easiest method to run, because you'd only have to vote once while a playoff style vote would have multiple rounds where people have to log in several times to vote.