MOD/S3M/XM/IT music format used in Continuum?

[WiseCherub]

I'am simply amazed that the MOD/S3M/XM/IT music format is
not adopted into SubSpace client.

This music has a rich heritage, back to 1989... back to old SoundTracker.

This music format was used in numerious games.

Very popular in Europe.

Has lots of cool TECHNO/TRANCE...etc music.

1000s of tunes..

Check out www.modplug.com or www.modarchive.com
or do a google search keyword: MOD music

This music format is like this...

midi <------ mod --------> mp3

small med hi --> file size
ok better top --> Sound quality

Just an idea, would be nice to have ambiet background music as you play.

However, it would probably push the client's machine... but its an option...

Thanks for listening...

[ConcreteSchlyrd]

Or, you could just run Winamp in the background. It's just crazy enough to work.

[Worr]

what you do is go into the continuum sound directory and take out hum.wa2. Grab your favorite song and rename it to hum.wa2. Easy as that

Well, you have to convert your mp3(if it is in mp3)to wav...not TOO difficult

[WiseCherub]

MOD/S3M/XM/IT music formats are not like .wav or .mp3 files.

These music formats work like a music sampler/sequencer system.

You have x # of samples, and you have a sequencer.

WINAMP I tried and it sucks bigtime, I like Modplug way better. WINAMP is just one of those bloatwares floating around... Ohya and Sonique sucks bigtime too.

[ConcreteSchlyrd]

Okay, seriously, first of all, it's an MP3 player. And if an MP3 player is putting a tax on your hardware, it's a quarter past upgrade time, Papi.

MODs were cool at the time--like 7 or 8 years ago. I have no clue on God's green earth why anyone would listen to them now. The fact of the matter is, why develop something for a format that is rapidly on it's way out? I haven't seen MODs as a traded format for years. It's like asking Priitk to write a DOS Continuum client.

"Remember back when you had to load things into high memory? That was the shit!"

[Dameon Angell]

Originally posted by ConcreteSchlyrd
"Remember back when you had to load things into high memory? That was the shit!"

Testify oh Schoolyard which is made of Concrete

[WiseCherub]

Then why does www.modarchive.com still exist?

Have you ever thought, sometimes great music can be written in other formats other than MP3.

MP3 is not entirely efficient.

Take this analogy and think about it for once.

Ok.

You have VECTOR/TEXTURE vs BITMAP(RASTER)/PAGE FLIP graphics?

Which is more efficient?

Well of course vector/texture graphics, since we can do all sorts of neat stuff with vectors and saves a whole lot of memory/data.

Well MOD FORMAT is like Vector graphics, so usually you can produce some good music at less space than MP3.

I have upgraded and can listen to MP3...of course, but there is still a rich heritage of great TRANCE/TECHNO tunes in MOD format.

Also you are saying, because of the advances in computer technology; who really cares about how big a MP3 file is.

Well it all still adds up, we still don't have a computer with INFINITE data/memory storage.

Furthermore, if you make a webpage and embed MOD format tunes, they really help if you like have a free webpage with 20 MB limit.

Enough said, if you wana laugh at my suggestion go right ahead..heh.. I can only laugh at your ignorance... oh hum...

Asking Prittk to make DOS continuum.. come on.... (shaking my head)....

[ConcreteSchlyrd]

Originally posted by WiseCherub
Then why does www.modarchive.com still exist?

No idea, really. Like I said, it's a dead/dying format that shares the same fanbase as MIDI, although MIDI generally has a higher industry usage.

Originally posted by WiseCherub
Have you ever thought, sometimes great music can be written in other formats other than MP3.

First of all, you have to come to grips with the fact that MP3 is a codec, not a generation tool. You could just as easily take a MOD and dump it to an MP3 (and yes, I realize the resulting file would be bigger). And yes, I realize that there are hundreds of thousands of ways of writing music.

Originally posted by WiseCherub
MP3 is not entirely efficient.

I could be wrong, but I believe that you're talking out of your ass on this one. How is it "not entirely efficient?" Because the files are bigger? I realize that there are formats that can more accurately represent the original file (things like OGG, etc), or formats that use smaller file sizes, but efficiency? Unless you're talking pure hardware translation efficiency (which would already be a fairly dumb argument), "efficiency" really isn't an issue.

Originally posted by WiseCherub
Take this analogy and think about it for once.

Ok.

You have VECTOR/TEXTURE vs BITMAP(RASTER)/PAGE FLIP graphics?

Which is more efficient?

Well of course vector/texture graphics, since we can do all sorts of neat stuff with vectors and saves a whole lot of memory/data.

Well MOD FORMAT is like Vector graphics, so usually you can produce some good music at less space than MP3.

I don't really understand why you're going after pure efficiency. Shit, making a webpage/application/etc with no graphics at all would be more efficient than a page with even vector graphics. Just because something's smaller and more compact doesn't necessarily mean it's a better route to take.

Originally posted by WiseCherub
I have upgraded and can listen to MP3...of course, but there is still a rich heritage of great TRANCE/TECHNO tunes in MOD format.

A "rich heritage?" Come on, we're not talking about wheel-thrown pottery or anything, we're talking about a 9 or 10 year-old standard for sequencing samples.

Originally posted by WiseCherub
Also you are saying, because of the advances in computer technology; who really cares about how big a MP3 file is.

Pretty much. I have yet to meet someone that's feeling oppressed by MP3 file size.

Originally posted by WiseCherub
Well it all still adds up, we still don't have a computer with INFINITE data/memory storage.

Why would you need one? I have 800 full-length albums sitting on a network drive, taking up only around 45 GB. Shit, an 80 GB drive costs $68--I could spend that much in a night out. File size isn't a big deal with music formats anymore.

Originally posted by WiseCherub
Furthermore, if you make a webpage and embed MOD format tunes, they really help if you like have a free webpage with 20 MB limit.

First of all, a curse on anyone who's a dumb enough bastard to embed a MOD/MIDI/whatever sound file into your web page. A fucking pox. Nobody wants to listen to a bleep-bloop version of The Lion King theme song while looking through your page. I don't care if you've got the most kickass MOD of a Paul Oakenfold super-duper-hyper-extendo remix, chances are the people visiting your site already have a CD or MP3 playing--you're just fucking up their music with yours. It's bad page/site design, people.

[WiseCherub]

How do you know it's a dying format? I still see lots of webpages and activity.

Good you atleast acknowledge that there is other ways to write music.. variety is music generation is a good thing I believe. To me MP3 or WAV is just one big raw sample.. of course MP3 probably uses audio compression techniques.

Not entirely efficient... ok say we have a 64k Mod file, sounds great... now translate it to MP3 and it becomes 3 megs...
I don't like that, especially if you have a webpage with limited file space... like my webpage, I only have 20megs limit. So if I put a
3-6 meg file on there, poof goes my space... not smart.

So from your own perspective, it doesn't matter, but from mine it does...

No, mod/s3m/xm file format has a rich heritage... this format has been used in countless demos, intros, and games.

The reason you probably don't meet too many people feeling oppressed by MP3 filesize... is because most computer users after the internet explosion 1995+ are not too smart about computers... they just play on a toy OS windows..heh.. point&click crowd. This also goes for many computer programmers of this generation... bloatware coders...heh.. oh well let them have fun...good....

As for me using it on my site, that is my right to do it, I pay for it. If you can't understand what I'm saying, then I can't help you any further.

I never said the MP3 format is entirely useless, it is good for many applications. But I wouldn't look down on the older formats, they have a rich heritage too...

If you are saying MP3 and nothing else... then that isn't too smart... how do you think some muscians generate the music in the first place.. these cakewalk(midi tools) or modtracker(mod tools)...

If you don't do that, then you need live instruments.. guitar, drums, bass..vocals.. and just sample...

[Lain]

Originally posted by WiseCherub
You have VECTOR/TEXTURE vs BITMAP(RASTER)/PAGE FLIP graphics?

Which is more efficient?

For ss, bitmap graphics. All graphics formats have to be converted to bmp format before directX can load them to a buffer. By using space-hogging bitmap files, you skip a conversion step. You also have a 1:1 correlation between the original graphic and the output on screen in the game.

As for sound, the output from the soundcard is mapped from a wave sample, why bother with lossy compression of mp3 or even samples, when you can get a 1:1 correlation between the sound stored on disk, and the audio outputted by the speakers?

[WiseCherub]

heh.. Lain...

the quote you quoted from me... wasn't literal... it was a ANALOGY..heh.. sorry...

This is my point.... listen....

With Vector Texture map graphics.. you just need 1 model... and to animate.. you can rotate..do whatever.... with very little memory of each frame.. all done IN REALTIME>..

Now with bitmap render anims... they store all frames on disk, only good for 1 shot... and not flexiable....


Well MOD/XM/S3M music is similar when compared with MP3....

MP3... is a compressed raw audio format... so if a tune uses a similiar instrument or riff... repeatable.... it will take un-necessary space...

now with MOD/S3M/XM format...

it only has audio sample banks...and has a music pattern... or sequencer....

Ultimately.. music is produced with MIDI.. sequencer.. samplers or played live...

My arguement is the method or philosophy.... both in graphics and music...

This analogy is far reaching....

SEQUENCER
FUNCTIONS


Music SEQUENCER
INSTRUMENT AUDIO SAMPLES

ANIM SEQUENCER
3D MODEL and TEXTURE MAPS GFXS

SCROLLING MAP
TILESET BANKS/FONT

ASSEMBLY LANGUAGE PROGRAM
OPCODES WITHIN CPU

get it now..heh... thats all I'm saying....

The other dude.. concrete... just told me it all sucks, and I couldn't understand why? If it all sucked and we didn't use this analogy principle.. then we would be f*cked...heh..

[ConcreteSchlyrd]

Are you Neodis? Either way, this topic has been over and done with for ages.

Fact remains, Priit (or anyone, for that matter), is never going to integrate MOD music into Continuum. There's no good reason he should. If people want to listen to music while playing SS, they usually just run Winamp in the background, or (God forbid) turn on their stereo in the same room. MOD music in Continuum is a fruitless empire.

Topic closed because no one cares. - Conc