MMR Matchmaking Planning Thread. Nerds welcome.

[Geio]

I just love trolling you because I actually used to fawks with you. Now you are just a fucking cornball 🤣🤣

[Riverside]

Imagine signing up for MMR test game. The bot has no clue what to even do with you and it just makes you a sub. (Riverside)

You've been a sub for a number of TWL seasons and games, haven't you champ?

I guess being a sub is something you can relate to.

Bench buddies!! Gr8est 2d spaceships teammate (geio) alert!!!

[Rab]

Dare = most games, last place.
Seems correct to me

[daresound]

I hacked a barebones rating ladder site together in 15 minutes from the TSL site (credit to Rab for original site design). Currently showing top 20 but that can be easily adjusted: https://trenchwars.org/mmr/

.

According to this site, 'Best' is the top wb and 'Ravage' is the top Jav. Ratings clearly need more time to calibrate.

[Geio]

Imagine signing up for MMR test game. The bot has no clue what to even do with you and it just makes you a sub. (Riverside)

[qan]

This took you 15 minutes?

Im impressed with how interactive that tsl front end code is

and fuking appreciative of ur time n greatness my gudness.

Oh, just to be clear, the site hack took 15 minutes. I literally copied over Rab's site and edited the queries a bit. Definitely just a temp thing while we figure out what to do, and so that people don't have to post top scores regularly.

Thanks for the kind words, though!

[Riverside]

This took you 15 minutes?

Im impressed with how interactive that tsl front end code is

and fuking appreciative of ur time n greatness my gudness.

[qan]

I hacked a barebones rating ladder site together in 15 minutes from the TSL site (credit to Rab for original site design). Currently showing top 20 but that can be easily adjusted: https://trenchwars.org/mmr/



Right now there's no clear list of the staffers who are willing to host, other than Dwopple. We're in the very early stages. But I think you could maybe get some interested during active times with a ?help start MMR call.

Also, as you all may have seen, there's a new forum to make it clear that MMR is its own thing not attached to TSL. The goal is to expand this out to many parts of the zone. It's not strictly tied to any particular league and can be implemented just about anything that uses a MatchBot.

[Riverside]

My objective is to increase the short and medium term usage of ?go mmr and ?go twd3, during mmr testing. This is because I think it can systemically increase TWs activity, individually and collectively. This is also especially after a lot of costly work that qan, BIET, Wirah and Rab have put in... for free (coding can and is often financially $).

I acknowledge UI is still early.

Is there anyone with access who has time and is able, and willing, to post the top 15-30 players?

Maybe once a week?

Top players of each week, or top players overall. Whatever is easier to access.

I also think public access to the changing list of staffers who can and are willing to host (and post weekly top scores?) would result in more mmr games.

Ty 2 the rest of the volunteer operators rolling this out (dwoppil n any1 else), as qan say in new thread... MMR HYPE.

[Dwopple]

1) nice, wud b gr8 if the eventual road map also led to twd integration
2) naice
3) my feedback as a person who isn't looking to volunteer rn: If theres enough volunteer staff for existing League OPs to not pick something else up, I believe scheduled games increases recurring population activity, regardless of the leagues that are happening (somewhat announced timings often help). I think there's an opportunity for the coming TWL and TWDT schedule to work with this testing. It can be earlier, ie 7pm EST weeknights (i like sat 1pm for the international pop), so that there isn't a conflict with twds that practice for TWL & TWDT. I see this as a vehicle to meet the wants of players who prefer late and early games, and increase activity during times that are range in activity (high to low).

Monday, Wed, Friday:
7pm-7:30pm EST (mmr)
Twd palooza during / after

Sat:
1pm-2pm (mmr)

Maybe. We may try to get a handful of staffers trained up now that qan has this in a good spot. Currently, it's about the same level of effort to host as TSL was, except we don't have an easy way to show ratings or the ladder. That will come in time. I for sure cannot commit to any saturday hosting schedule, but may be open to a weekday one to start!

Also, see below for a good summary of what matchmaking for TWD is... TWMD HYPE, ANYONE?

Everyone starts w/ a 3000 rating (for simplicity there are no qualification match requirements right now)
Ratings changes are based on W/L, not K/D

My latest score from tonight:
MatchBot7> MMR Testing ... Rating: 2940 -> 3053 Change: +113 Games played: 5

 product> so how does this work?
product> how can i sub in?
Dwopple> did you !signup w/ MMR bot?
product> or apply to play?
product> i already did that
Dwopple> kk
product> it auto picks or something?
Dwopple> so a staffer will open matchmaker for jd or dd
Dwopple> then you will type !p (in ?go MMR) to queue up
Dwopple> and yes, bot will auto create teams based on your rating
product> oh ok
Dwopple> your rating goes up / down based on W/L
product> so its first come first serve auto pick
Dwopple> mine is currently: MatchBot7> MMR Testing ... Rating: 2940 -> 3053 Change: +113 Games played: 5
Dwopple> ye, you can run 4v4 or 5v5... nad have as many games as possible going at one time
Dwopple> when this gets going we'll have 3-4 games running at a time lol
product> right so the first 10 ppl who !p play that rd
product> rest go on sub?
Dwopple> eh there is a randomized roll for all ppl signing up i believe
Dwopple> so even if you're #11 you have a chance
Dwopple> but yes, there is a sub list
product> ok
Dwopple> however... bot interface / messages / commands aren't super userfriendly atm
Dwopple> that will take some time from qan & BIET to refine

BIG THANKS TO QAN FOR HIS TIME AND EFFORT TO GETTING THIS UP!!!! hype.

[Riverside]

Great questions!

1. This won't be possible "soon", as the current state requires some pretty heavy manual bot management. However, in the future this could be doable, but that depends on how we want to utilize this new system. The first two possibilities I can see are 1) a new league variant to run in between TWDTs & cups with defined start and end dates, and 2) elim/base/wbduel/javduel style where you can ?go MMR and send zoners out when a queue starts.
2. Yes, right now MMR is still very much in a TESTING phase. Anyone can play, and ratings won't be reset constantly barring any significant bugs where the ratings aren't adjusting as intended. Players need to be signed up using !signup w/ the MMRBot in ?go mmr. Then, when matchmaking is opened (automated arena msg) by a staffer players can type !p to be queued up, then when matchmaking is closed (automated arena msg) the bot will sort everyone into the most balanced teams. This is exactly like TSL, except player ratings aren't humanized fixed ratings, but are instead dynamic based on player's WINNING or LOSING. K/D has nothing to do with their rating.
3. Yes this is what I have in mind, however I'd like to get a bit more testing done until we get to this point for 2 reasons... 1) the user experience needs some refinement, and qan is looking to ensure the system is working as intended before he directs his attention to improving UX while working around his limited availability (trips!), and 2) I'm noticing TWL teams / participants are focusing their activity toward normal TWD matches since they can select their squadmates and I don't think it's wise to try and compete with that given our current population. Instead, we can certainly test as much as possible to aid qan in his development progress, but I'm open to suggestions on how to go about that

1) nice, wud b gr8 if the eventual road map also led to twd integration
2) naice
3) my feedback as a person who isn't looking to volunteer rn: If theres enough volunteer staff for existing League OPs to not pick something else up, I believe scheduled games increases recurring population activity, regardless of the leagues that are happening (somewhat announced timings often help). I think there's an opportunity for the coming TWL and TWDT schedule to work with this testing. It can be earlier, ie 7pm EST weeknights (i like sat 1pm for the international pop), so that there isn't a conflict with twds that practice for TWL & TWDT. I see this as a vehicle to meet the wants of players who prefer late and early games, and increase activity during times that are range in activity (high to low).

Monday, Wed, Friday:
7pm-7:30pm EST (mmr)
Twd palooza during / after

Sat:
1pm-2pm (mmr)

[Dwopple]

Is there an easy way for players without staff access to:

• Prepare/set up and host games for mmr testing (wb and jav)
• Play in games with mmr testing
• Host or play in scheduled games for mmr: weeknights at 8pm, Saturdays at 1pm EST

Great questions!

1. This won't be possible "soon", as the current state requires some pretty heavy manual bot management. However, in the future this could be doable, but that depends on how we want to utilize this new system. The first two possibilities I can see are 1) a new league variant to run in between TWDTs & cups with defined start and end dates, and 2) elim/base/wbduel/javduel style where you can ?go MMR and send zoners out when a queue starts.
2. Yes, right now MMR is still very much in a TESTING phase. Anyone can play, and ratings won't be reset constantly barring any significant bugs where the ratings aren't adjusting as intended. Players need to be signed up using !signup w/ the MMRBot in ?go mmr. Then, when matchmaking is opened (automated arena msg) by a staffer players can type !p to be queued up, then when matchmaking is closed (automated arena msg) the bot will sort everyone into the most balanced teams. This is exactly like TSL, except player ratings aren't humanized fixed ratings, but are instead dynamic based on player's WINNING or LOSING. K/D has nothing to do with their rating.
3. Yes this is what I have in mind, however I'd like to get a bit more testing done until we get to this point for 2 reasons... 1) the user experience needs some refinement, and qan is looking to ensure the system is working as intended before he directs his attention to improving UX while working around his limited availability (trips!), and 2) I'm noticing TWL teams / participants are focusing their activity toward normal TWD matches since they can select their squadmates and I don't think it's wise to try and compete with that given our current population. Instead, we can certainly test as much as possible to aid qan in his development progress, but I'm open to suggestions on how to go about that

[Riverside]

Is there an easy way for players without staff access to:

• Prepare/set up and host games for mmr testing (wb and jav)
• Play in games with mmr testing
• Host or play in scheduled games for mmr: weeknights at 8pm, Saturdays at 1pm EST

[Dwopple]

Posting here since it's related, but qan has gotten MMR (matchmaking) w/ TSL style team creation to a testing point for javs & wbs. There's still a few bugs to workout and things to refine, but it's playable. qan is going to work towards getting the player rating changes to a solid point where we don't need to reset until the end of 'testing'.

As more players play more matches and win / lose, their rating (MMR) will adjust up and down. This is purely based on winning and losing and NOT k/d. The more testing we can get in for player ratings, the quicker we can get the data back to qan to make any adjustments

[Cape]

I have nothing to contribute other than my interest.
God speed sir.