TWL 7 squads

[bloodzombie]

Originally posted by Nickname
But don't even pretend i'm wrong. What did Light do? they broguht a bunch of guys who didn't know jack and stuck them in spiders, got a well trained guy in terr (so he didn't need to train anymore) and took possibly the laggiest person in the zone (second laggiest) and stuck him in shark. They actually stuck the laggiest person in a jav, but this is all precram days.

You're insane..

look at lights roster, the only people who weren't hardcore basers were their spiders. Mitch in terr, fireballz and hannes in sharks and 2d in jav... that's a far fucking cry from 7 random guys from chaos zone.

And I will agree on one thing.. putting together the team is definitely the hardest part. try finding 7 guys in chaos zone willing to be trained for shit. or even in tw for that matter. go to pub and try to tell someone how to shark, they'll tell you to fuck off like they're already the best in the world.

a few days? it'd probably take more than a few days just to get one guy willing to try with you.

[Randedl]

Originally posted by geekbot
I know this is pointless but I couldn't resist. 5 things you need to know in basing that you don't in duelling:

1. Shark's rep width
2. Shark's splash damage
3. Jav's splash damage and effect on many different kinds of ships
4. Spider's rate of recharge/cost of bullets (managing energy)
5. Flying a terrier (bursts/portals/moving a team)

Javing in base is very different because of the close proximity (not TKing) and knowing the recharge rates of all the different ships (will you kill/TK that ship at the rate they are firing, etc).

All of these things can be found in svs but it will take time to adjust to TW settings and using specialized ships in our maps.

in my experience base warbirding, most basers still don't know a warbirds recharge rate

[Randedl]

Originally posted by Zerzera
But Spastic and Mambo didn't, (I didn't see a dissolving coming, and I thought the games we played were worth it) Paladen had to drop out because they couldn't compete, and NS couldn't compete at all. And don't forget Cripples.
It is unlikely this season, but even squads that made playoffs can fall back into a worthless squad.
Cutting down spots if there are enough squads to fill them -even if you don't think they're competative enough is, in my opinion, not needed. First of all because it's hard to judge other squads (again, some people didn't think Spastic would make leagues, yet they won it) Let more people enjoy leagues if it's possible.
You just have more games, and some of them will be a walkover.



Squads form easily, basingsquads seem more stabile than duelsquads. But if you would make pure 3-league squads, a lot of squads now will dissolve and new ones will form.
If your only argument for 3 league squads is that you like to compete in all 3, shut up.
I see no need in playing in 3 leagues, and at the moment I see no reason why I would have to squad up with (or recruit) duelists or javelins. Every sport has his own teams.



Just because 5 spiders are most of the time stronger than 4 spiders, doesn't mean 4 v 4 spiders and a different ship will make such an upset. I bet RB can bring 4 more than solid spiders and a reasonable jav or warbird to match.
Or in other words, I don't think that bringing the number of spiders down will make much of a difference to most squads.

i don't remember what i was saying 2 months ago when i wrote the message you are quoting, and i'm not gonna look, but here goes. . .

1. i have nothing against shitty squads being in twl, in the current format there are always going to be a best and a worst. if tw can support 20 squads, i say go to 20 squads - it depends on the players and mostly on the captains. 16 seems to work now.

2. okay. . . say most pure-wb or pure-base or pure-jav squads dissolve with my proposed all-3 leagues squad system. the players now go to new squads that have captains who know how to focus on all 3 leagues. squads still have a 30-35 ppl max, they now have to have javs wbs and basers in those 35. so, a squad no longer can pile up 35 wbs, or 35 javs or 35 basers, they need a balance, the others go to other squads and the talent is spread out amongst more than just the top 3 squads. maybe somebody who would be a 6th or 7th wb on a top squad would now go to a lower one and make them better.

next, who does spastic really have a rivalry with? i don't see it going to a diso/pallies level of rivalry just cuz spastic only plays 1 league, there isn't that level of intensity y'know? or maybe you don't, depending on if you've ever given wbs or javs a try.

further, i'm not a jav, i try, but i'm not, doesn't mean i'm not interested in seeing my squad to the best it can in all 3 leagues. grapevine will be in twld, twlj and twlb i get no benefit out of making the rest of the squads do the same. like i said, everybody would become more competative.

3. i won't pretend i know about rb's lineup or really care, but last i saw them in a bd they had hockeydude in wb? no knock on him, he's canadian, but if that's their best wb option compared to a base bird somebody else might have? and if they'd rather play him instead of a jav it's not sayin alot for their jav talent. . .

if a 4 spid max won't make much of a difference at all, why are all the people saying so shouting out "DON'T DO IT"? a squad isn't going to win with "a reasonable" amount of skill. if that's what you think you are sorely understimating the level of skill that now exists in this game.

[Sufficient]

In my opinion, basing and jav are just 10 times more fun than wb. Simple as that.

[Mattey]

That same squad in all 3 leagues idea will never work. So many more squads will dissolve and finding a proper replacement (have to be decent in all 3 leagues will be nigh impossible).

[Nickname]

Originally posted by bloodzombie
You're insane..

look at lights roster, the only people who weren't hardcore basers were their spiders. Mitch in terr, fireballz and hannes in sharks and 2d in jav... that's a far fucking cry from 7 random guys from chaos zone.

And I will agree on one thing.. putting together the team is definitely the hardest part. try finding 7 guys in chaos zone willing to be trained for shit. or even in tw for that matter. go to pub and try to tell someone how to shark, they'll tell you to fuck off like they're already the best in the world.

a few days? it'd probably take more than a few days just to get one guy willing to try with you.

I wasn't counting the finding part in the few days.

And i wouldn't call fbz a hardcore shark, even back then.

Want a better example though, look at rampage last season. Ignore the choking in playoffs. Ripper and Horror in sharks (2 brand new sharks) 5 random guys ins pider (some we're so random as blood more than knows what he's doing, but others really didn't) and they took someone who knew nothing about terr (nether) and made him terr. If nether had practiced a bit more and they actually tried, they would have been a contender - heading into playoffs they were a contender.

[Nickname]

Originally posted by Sufficient
In my opinion, basing and jav are just 10 times more fun than wb. Simple as that.

i sort of agree. I never really liked wbs, theres not a lot of finesse to them, you just kidna sit there and shoot at each other. You generally die from a lot more spawns - which also doesn't appeal to me.

Basing did appeal to me, the wild fr fights, the fun of using a jav with all the different options it brings, thats why i played jav, i enjoy'd the finesse of it, the fact that i can be a threat by doing any 1 of a bunch of things. Then the cram came, and basing got laggier (it was and will always be laggy, but the cram is uber laggy) and basing turned into dueling. All you do is sit in a little hole and fire down at guys who are sitting in a smalla rea firing up at guys. granted fr fights are still organised chaos which is great, but theres so much cramming it's brutal. I hate playing go base now because even if i win i lose, no matter if my terr or the nme terr dies i'm gonna get stuck on a side of the cram, which is horribly boring.

I think javs is where it's at. You've got the ufn aspect of wbs and the fun aspect of base and put them in one.

[Sufficient]

The great thing about basing though is there are new ideas and changes that CAN be made when things get stale or when new problems come up. In wb there is basically nothing fresh you can add ... and even in jav, basically the only thing you can change is the map. But yeah basing and jav have the potential to be really really fun.

[K2Grey]

Originally posted by Randedl
i don't remember what i was saying 2 months ago when i wrote the message you are quoting, and i'm not gonna look, but here goes. . .
3. i won't pretend i know about rb's lineup or really care, but last i saw them in a bd they had hockeydude in wb? no knock on him, he's canadian, but if that's their best wb option compared to a base bird somebody else might have? and if they'd rather play him instead of a jav it's not sayin alot for their jav talent. . .

We try to be really active, so generally we play a ton of BDs without any warbirds or javelins on. Anyway it's not really important, but we have a few jav & wb players that are either quite decent or quite laggy, depending on who you ask (cough, a certain known terrier).

Anyway, in reply to Nickname on the chaos zone recruiting thingie, I don't really know if it'd work. For one thing you can't just pull any dumbass out of Chaos, it's not as if the average quality of SVS players is _that_ much better. I admit that in general SVS players would be good at spider, but not so much as shark, terrier, sharks, or wb/jav. Same thing can be said of DSB players. Still, it'd be frightening to see Tunahead in jav or something ;P

[Cig Smoke]

NN i couldnt agree more with u, if u got 7 guyus from DSB it would work also. Those zones basic ships are like our spider, so they are naturaly talented in it. The terr/sharks are the hard part.

Rampage is a good example, but those sharks wernt all that new, Horror(killup) was a crip back in the days they were good, he knows how to base. Ripper was also a shark back in the day, they arent hardcore basers or even consistant basers at that but they do know the ship. And Rampage had Eeks in terr for awhile. After he left they seemed to be weaker. But basicaly they did throw 8 duelers together.

Elusive also did the same, got a terr in 2d, 5 dueling spiders, and 2 guys in sahrk who jsut knew the basics of the ship, got them some practice together and wallah. U havta remember most squads who are good at dueling they came from pub just like u basers did. Just they turned to a different league once they got noticed. They arent all random noobs to spider and so on. They also rely on aim much more then basers, WB's especialy rely on aim so much that they use eveyr spider bullet to tehre advantage where some basing spiders just random spladder.

Light also had Spybreak back in the day. And there spiders were on basing squads. jack/destroy/dark! and so on were all on squads that based.

[Nickname]

Thats because although basing requires the most teamwork, it's the easiest teamwork because it's more or less common sense. Basing is all basically textbook until the fr, at which point a lot of people just kill whatever moves - not the smartest idea but it works too.

I love fr fights though, this is why i'm such a fan of the earwarp.

[Cig Smoke]

Ya + basing is more compact into 1 area like demon said. U are natrualy closer to ur team and if u have any experience at all u can probably team half witted with him. The sharks are where the real techincal teaming is at.

i agree earwarp

[Da1andonly]

Originally posted by demonfaze
In jav you gotta be careful with tks and getting your teammates 2ferd or even 3ferd.

I never got to know, who caught the bomb?

[demonfaze]

Mr. Spam I believe.

[NaiLed]

please stop using the word "basing". "cramming" is the proper term for it.