TWDT Star Caps: Discussion

[Pressure]

Opening the floor for discussion regarding * caps.

The argument for keeping star caps would be to give newer players a chance. My argument against this is that every season semi-elite players end up flying under the radar and/or on aliases and play for good teams as a 6* or 7*, so captains who are lucky enough to draft these underrated players tend to see more success for their team than those who do not. We seldom see true "newbs" get their shot in TWDT. Star caps are also extremely subjective and those deciding them are human and make mistakes. This human error can lead to a 10* playing as a 9* or vice versa, and skew the draft/season. This introduces too much human error for a season that Wirah is putting money on.

In my opinion, star caps should be removed for this season as it would be more reflective of the "old" TWDT and would make the season more competitive.

[Rab]

I agree. There are more aliasers and stuck 10/9/8 stars than there are legitimate low star players trying to break through. Also sorta deals with the ship-specific rating thing. As long as the number of teams is correctly judged based on the number of signups, the distribution of talent should produce a fair outcome. The problem will be FA imbalancing things, perhaps there should be no FA.

[Vys]

The star rating system worked when there was a lot of 6* rated players was playing. But there isnt many of those now, this is what stops a lot of 10 star players, playing. I'll rather see a lineup field their best line, than better players riding the pine because of a rule implemented. We've had star ratings for a while now, we should try this.

The only rule which should be added in the rules (please ensure this is in bold, italic, underlined and size 72 font: Tiny is banned from capping a twdt squad.

[Poseidon]

i vote no star cap and hopefully there will be more than 8 teams to help even out playtime ... 9 teams still better than 8 if not 10; if 9, could do a single elim play-in game for each league for wildcard, like 4th vs 5th or whatev.

[ogron]

It depends what people want. Players at different star levels have opposing incentives, as do players of similiar skill level with different goals. TWDT-B, for example:



If you're an elite player and want the easiest possible chance at a title with the least challenge, then obviously you prefer no star cap.

If you're looking to prove yourself and carry then obviously you want a star cap and to win within the hardest possible environment.

If you're a 7* then you've been riding nothing but the gravy train for the past 10 seasons and praying nothing changes. If you're a 6* the star cap hasn't been good because caps don't like to go below 7* in this system, and you probably want something different. A no star cap system would be the worst possible outcome.

There's no question that 7* and 8*s have, in general, been the biggest beneficiaries the past six seasons.

I think the 66* cap is too hard to win in and should definitely not return, you had multiple 10*s benched, it was ridiculous. 67* is already a really tough environment and I think that should be the absolute max if going that route.

The upside of a star cap is you can draft for multiple leagues and know you can still win. Anything with 5 to 8 unrestricted basing slots requires a gigantic investment early in the draft to contend.

The star cap also provides a built-in anti-stack mechanism -- the games have been incredibly competitive the past four seasons.

I like the idea of the star cap system being a great challenge for elite players, but I also like that no cap or limited cap is just more chill and more fun for me if I play. Low-stars have also had it really good and become really entitled, so going to a more elite-friendly system is 100% fine.

I'm not advocating any outcome, just trying to point out the strengths and weaknesses of each system.

[Nipple Nibbler]

The 66* cap was only a problem because in the last DT a ton of players signed up last minute. What about raising the * cap to something on the higher end? It feels like 6* don't get much play time either way, however we do get 7's in with a star cap, and if 7s get enough playtime with good players they can easily become 8's. I personally don't care much, I lean a little towards having a star cap.

[Poseidon]

How about trying for 12 teams and no star cap... lots of ptime available for lots of ppl...

It appears we have enough ppl willing to cap?

Attendance issues could be resolved by allowing up to 1 borrow of equal or less Stars during regular season... no borrows playoffs

[Poseidon]

Also, if there were to not be a star cap, why not have three separate leagues? caps having 3 teams sounds mayb a lil absurd but wouldnt it ultimately give all the players of any given league the best league experience? So 3 drafts.... Captains could compose each team individually and select for the best composition for any one league instead of the best 3-league value picks and such. *shrug* i tink itd be worth the extra effort

[Spezza]

The star cap the way it is allows captains who are on different skill levels to have a more equal chance at winning (in theory - in reality the better players seem to be able to evaluate value better so far). I'm pretty against nostar cap as I think it's pretty obvious this gives pro caps unfair advantage as well as it will be pretty easy to stack a league when you only need 5 good players.Some cap needs to be there to have an equal playing field which is what DT is supposed to be for. I would focus on conversation about which star cap you want rather than having a no cap.

[Turban]

star cap should depend on the quality of players that signed up relative to the numbers of teams we have.

as an example last season 40-stars in TWDT-J did not work and essentially all teams had to bench several top-tier players while being forced to play with low-stars who, at times, can be impossible to carry. in hindsight we would've had a much better season with 41-star limit given how many good players signed up.

both of the dueling leagues are notoriously difficult to win as 10-stars -- almost twice as difficult than it is to win in basing as a high-star, at least in my honest opinion. this is because 10-stars in in dueling leagues take up 25% of your star cap where as being 10-star in basing takes ~13% of your star cap.

one thing worth considering is maybe lowering value of terriers (50% of current ratings) as they aren't as impactful and adjusting overall basing limit according to it.

[Pressure]

The star cap the way it is allows captains who are on different skill levels to have a more equal chance at winning (in theory - in reality the better players seem to be able to evaluate value better so far). I'm pretty against nostar cap as I think it's pretty obvious this gives pro caps unfair advantage as well as it will be pretty easy to stack a league when you only need 5 good players.Some cap needs to be there to have an equal playing field which is what DT is supposed to be for. I would focus on conversation about which star cap you want rather than having a no cap.

Good point. This is the best argument I've seen in favor of star caps.

[Poseidon]

nowon makes good point but if you look at the cap list as it currently is, all the players are 10* in either 1 or 2 leagues, aside from viop. if there was ever a group of captains to go with no-star cap, this seems to be the one

[viop11]

xcuse me? am 10* shirk and cud fk ne othir 7* wirbirt/jiflin 0 effirt

[Zeebu]

The summer league thing was the most exclusive piece of hot garbage that ever existed. Anything the goes away from that would be preferable

[beam]

Based on the responses in this thread and feedback I've received in game, I am strongly leaning towards having some kind of star cap unless somebody can present a strong case for no cap. It may be more productive to discuss what you guys think the caps should be instead of whether we should have one