[TW MAFIA] Western Chronicles

[Voth]

It is becoming increasingly apparent that someone needs to take the bull by the horns to avoid a disaster of having a scum player elected to one or more of these roles. While this may mean I do not make it to the end of the game, and I may end up as a sacrificial lamb, I do think that I may have the perfect role to come out in the open with to help town navigate this sticky situation.

Why roleclaim day 1, voth? Super scummy. I know. But here is the long and short of it:

I have a role where I am literally only a help to myself. I am not a role blocker, a cop, or any other roles that may give us direct information from my night action. I can literally only help myself at night.

I am the Town Commuter. I have the ability to get out of town for the night. This protects me from all night actions directed at me. I will not go into the specifics of the duration of this ability for self preservation.

So why am I claiming this now? Because someone has to step up, and it should not be a powerful role putting themselves out there. We do not have the option of everyone analyzing half baked campaign statements and then entrusting people with the power coming from these elections. Knowing that this puts a target on me, if I am elected, I have some protection at night and if the bodyguard is eventually gone, I have my own ability to fall back on. By the time I am worried about that though, the game will be advanced enough that mafia will
be somewhat exposed and they probably are not going to be worried about a town commuter. But if I do die later on, it will have been worth it to ensure town come out of day 1 without a huge disadvantage.

Know this. I am totally pissing the mafia off right now by pulling this. They want everyone to stay scared and they want people to vote with no information so that they can worm into being elected. Now you have someone putting concrete information out there. We cannot allow mafia to get any of these elected roles.

What else to say? Oh right...

vote voth

[RoDNeY]

man this is tough, I want to put my vote on an experienced player that can lead town to victory but I DONT TRUST ANY ONE OF YOU. The risk in giving one of these roles to scum is far too large, this leads me to an easy option as i already have one town player confirmed without a doubt

Vote: Rodney

[the_paul]

Yeah, I wasn't sure what he was getting at with 3 cops. But if we all revealed, how do we pick between a doctor, cop, roleblocker? Because the odd-man out would be night killed real quick

Because in a game of 13 it?s pretty unlikely we?ll have 3 cops. If we have 3 people claim cop, who do we pick to give one of the roles to, knowing at least 1 person is lying? Same with extra doctors or whatever. We?ll basically have to pick one of the power roles claiming and hope they?re telling the truth, while the ones that aren?t getting picked are exposed. The mafia will know which one is lying, so there?s a good chance the real power role who doesn?t get chosen ends up getting killed at night. It?s day 1, we could have 13 cop claims, how would anyone be able to prove that they really ARE the cop? That?s the point I was trying to get at.

[WillBy]

if we suddenly have 3 cop claims you already have narrowed the field to those players. but thats also why i proposed an orderly reveal. you know when youre up and everyone is waiting for you to claim or lie about your role that someone else can counter claim later. like i said, safe claims would bust this strategy up, but would bet that those werent provided at the start of the game.

Yeah, I wasn't sure what he was getting at with 3 cops. But if we all revealed, how do we pick between a doctor, cop, roleblocker? Because the odd-man out would be night killed real quick

[Zeebu]

I'm not sure I'd disagree out of principle, one of the only principle things I have is people sharing screenshots of their roles. I hate that shit (yes I know its illegal in the rules, but we all know it still happens). But we'd end up with like 3 cop claims or something and all kinds of claims, because the mafia would have to pick something to claim in order to hide. Which cop are we going to give one of the roles to? Or which doctor, or whatever role you want to plug in. Now all of our power roles (theoretically) are exposed, and all of them who are honestly claiming town power roles have to try to prove their innocence. And if we pick wrong, one of these mafia guys masquerading as a town power role has a free lynch on an exposed town PR. I'm with you, in a perfect world or in a vacuum its a great idea, but I feel like it would end badly for us quickly.

if we suddenly have 3 cop claims you already have narrowed the field to those players. but thats also why i proposed an orderly reveal. you know when youre up and everyone is waiting for you to claim or lie about your role that someone else can counter claim later. like i said, safe claims would bust this strategy up, but would bet that those werent provided at the start of the game.

[fiS]

Oh wow this topic skyrocketed during the day (love it, and love the day 1 twist).
Basically... I'm not a fan of a mass role claim. We don't know how much PRs are out there etc, although field as a host is known for powerroles.

And damn, I shouldn't have brought the statistic factor into here. It wasn't overly serious and yes, the logic is flawed.

I'll tell you all that I don't want Marshall/Mayor too desperately. Until now, even considering how ixt is changing is playstyle and working on it, I'd probably still lynch him.
Basically it would fit my role pretty well, though. I'm a man you can put your faith in.
My concern: activity wise, you shouldn't count too much on me. I will certainly have my ups and downs, lots going on in real life. Overall my activity level will be as good as in WillBy's game I recently played (at least I hope so). And yes, I would hate making a false decision. But I'd rather do it than seeing these roles in scum hands.

[the_paul]

I'm not sure I'd disagree out of principle, one of the only principle things I have is people sharing screenshots of their roles. I hate that shit (yes I know its illegal in the rules, but we all know it still happens). But we'd end up with like 3 cop claims or something and all kinds of claims, because the mafia would have to pick something to claim in order to hide. Which cop are we going to give one of the roles to? Or which doctor, or whatever role you want to plug in. Now all of our power roles (theoretically) are exposed, and all of them who are honestly claiming town power roles have to try to prove their innocence. And if we pick wrong, one of these mafia guys masquerading as a town power role has a free lynch on an exposed town PR. I'm with you, in a perfect world or in a vacuum its a great idea, but I feel like it would end badly for us quickly.

[WillBy]

assuming scum wasnt given safe claims, it would be interesting.

i already said some would object probably out of principle. whether that is scum indicative or not... do you see it as scum indicative?

you already said that you helped out with balance questions in this. did you ever discuss scum getting safe-claims? would you mind sharing some of the rest of hte balance discussion you had?

I think saying "I want to do that but what I really want is to stick with public opinion" is scummy.

the extent of my balance tips was reaffirming some of fields thoughts. Making marshal 1 shot, not 2. Mayor gets +1 vote, not +2. Besides that, I have no more information about setup or anything than what is on page 1.

[Zeebu]

also i am aware i am totally derailing the actual gameplay and posturing for votes and all of that.

[Zeebu]

The problem with a mass role claim and a day 1 election is that nobody can trust each other, as paul says. If we could all roleclaim, determine things from night actions, then elect, I think that would work better.

And out of principle I dont really support mass roleclaims. It can really spoil a cool set up (as a host). If everyone goes for it, I would play along, but u dont want to do it. Does that sound scummy enough?

assuming scum wasnt given safe claims, it would be interesting.

i already said some would object probably out of principle. whether that is scum indicative or not... do you see it as scum indicative?

you already said that you helped out with balance questions in this. did you ever discuss scum getting safe-claims? would you mind sharing some of the rest of hte balance discussion you had?

[Missa]

Undercut and Voth beef 2019.

Does seem out of nowhere and forced, like Paul said Setting up appearances?

[Zeebu]

i am very shifty eyed and such

[WillBy]

The problem with a mass role claim and a day 1 election is that nobody can trust each other, as paul says. If we could all roleclaim, determine things from night actions, then elect, I think that would work better.

And out of principle I dont really support mass roleclaims. It can really spoil a cool set up (as a host). If everyone goes for it, I would play along, but u dont want to do it. Does that sound scummy enough?

[Zeebu]

its risky, but it seems like a way to more assuredly get the marshall and mayor roles into the correct hands. the bodyguard mechanic should last long enough for us to get time to analyze results and find inconsistencies. if field already gave out safe claims along with the scum roles, this idea is no longer good. i dont think field would give out safe claims after the game started, that would be pretty shady.

oh well, just an idea

[the_paul]

call me scum, but this setup seems to scream for a mass role claim. especially an organized one. start at the top of the list and one by one claim, dont just scattershot it out there. start at the bottom of the list if you like as well. or, we can use a randon number generator and get a claim order and do it that way. whichever way is fine with me. this seems like the easiest way to sort out who to vote for day 1. its almost certainly not what field intended and mafia should shoot it down immediately. hell, others may shoot it down immediately as well, just out of principle. just an idea though.

i propose this, how about a vote of yes or no on whether you all would like toy see a day 1 mass role claim.

I suggested this earlier too, kind of. I mentioned it as an option anyway. In a perfect world, this is a slam dunk victory. However, I don't trust any of you, and nobody should trust me either, so I don't know how much good it would do. I'd like to see Willby go for back to back JOAT claims though, that would be good