The Hedonistic Imperative Manifesto

[PaulOakenfold]

I agree with Arikel and disagree with Tone... beauty in the breakdown, silly Atheists.

[Superted]

I suspect tone has been hurt by a loved one recently.

[Tone]

Without pain, we've nothing to compare pleasure to.

a common misconception. if it were true, then depressives and maniacs couldnt exist.. a state of consciousness is a state of consciousness. whatever it is, you experience, regardless of any other state youve experience or not experienced in the past. basically sugar has the same taste and essence no matter what other htings youve eaten

[Saturn V]

a common misconception. if it were true, then depressives and maniacs couldnt exist.. a state of consciousness is a state of consciousness. whatever it is, you experience, regardless of any other state youve experience or not experienced in the past. basically sugar has the same taste and essence no matter what other htings youve eaten

I don't see a misconception. How would I know when to pull my hand out of the fire? How would I know if I'm challenging myself, physically or mentally?

I'll keep my pain, thanks.

And try eating nothing but sugar all your life (good luck with that, by the way).

[PH]

[Tone]

And try eating nothing but sugar all your life (good luck with that, by the way).

it would still have the same exact taste, youd just get sick of it. but youd never get sick of feeling clear headed, euphoric, motivated and content all of the time just like depressives' agony never gets any better over time, theres no 'getting used to it'. be back in a few hours to reply more

[Saturn V]

it would still have the same exact taste, youd just get sick of it. but youd never get sick of feeling clear headed, euphoric, motivated and content all of the time just like depressives' agony never gets any better over time, theres no 'getting used to it'. be back in a few hours to reply more

You'd have no idea you were clear headed or motivated, since you’ve never experienced stress or lack of motivation. You'd be a robot, churning along, not knowing the difference. Sure you may be more productive, but at what cost?

[Theif of Time]

Without pain, many rock (and metal) songs would be pointless.
In fact, many genres of music would be rendered emotionally obsolete.

[ZeUs!!]

I suspect tone has been hurt by a loved one recently.

Fat fucking chance

[Superted]

It didn't have to be mutual.

Although thinking now, tone does strike me as an asexual.

[Fluffz]

...if you were engineered in a particular way, youd actually have deeper and truer feeling that way, ... in the end all existance comes down to pleasure & pain. so theres no other purpose or meaning to life than reducing pain and increasing pleasure.

no, thats ur problem, with that logic even the weirdest shit makes sense. why not create a being that can only feel pain and make it suffer all the time, since it doesnt know the difference it wont be sad. it will be in the same emotional state as an always happy creature (possibly killing itself in the long run or at least not trying to create a new generation)
pain and pleasure, death and life, good or bad, its all the same without its counterpart.

free will is based on the possibility to choose the wrong decission. if you eliminate that way your free will is lost. from the time on you cant decide to cause pain, hate or suffer, be good or bad you cant decide anything anymore. if you only have right ways to choose, your choose doesnt matter anymore.

intelligence as we define it is schooled by its errors. no errors no intelligence. following yur own argument everything comes down to pleasure. and everyone feels pleasure in that bright future of yours, so tell me, how should we decide between success and failure. just like a mainc depressive person can have any sucess and still feel bad in your world you could chop off your fingers and nose and still feel happy about it. yea, id love to see it

if you do something because u can it is worthless. the drive to do results from our want to reach a goal if. once we reach this point everything will stall. there is no reason to raise kids, to work to live anymore. at the point at which you dont worry, dont hope for more you are dead

what if the person you love dies, do you have to be happy. is there a difference between happy because you love and happy because your loved just died. how can you define this difference other than impossible

... and so on ...

[Theif of Time]

It would certainly change the way we think about relationships.
The insulating warmth of rage would be gone.
Hearts would never break, and many girls will commit suicide because of this.

[Vykromond]

You'd have no idea you were clear headed or motivated, since you’ve never experienced stress or lack of motivation. You'd be a robot, churning along, not knowing the difference. Sure you may be more productive, but at what cost?

look, i hate t0ne as much as the next guy (<- this isn't true, i think he makes the trench wars forums worthwhile), but can you at least read the dude's fucking website before you attack him? there's a response to your argument as the first thing on http://www.hedweb.com/hedethic/hedon4.htm#objections

[Ashlee]

(EDIT: I'm waiting for tone to say what so I can post the other sign)

[Theif of Time]

what?
EDIT: is that you?