Man one step closer to God?

[Noah]

I just have to correct you on one point Wark. You tend to build up arguments that is based on your many faulty assumptions.

There was no such thing as "Germany thought they were superior". Germany's brilliance in war can mostly be credited to some extremely competent generals. The generals actually advised against going into Russia Hitler ignored his generals and went into Russia because he himself had lost his sense. If the generals of Germany didn't have Hitler to answer to, then Germany could have won the war. This isn't very relevant to the original argument in this thread, I just wanted to prove you wrong on the many faulty points you build up your arguments on.

Also it's a compliment to Obama that you think he is more like Hitler than McCain. Hitler is perhaps the politician that has done the most for Germany when you look at the internal politics. The political system that Germany is based on today is the same system Hitler built up, just without the nazi facism.

[HateTheFake]

I just have to correct you on one point Wark. You tend to build up arguments that is based on your many faulty assumptions.

There was no such thing as "Germany thought they were superior". Germany's brilliance in war can mostly be credited to some extremely competent generals. The generals actually advised against going into Russia Hitler ignored his generals and went into Russia because he himself had lost his sense. If the generals of Germany didn't have Hitler to answer to, then Germany could have won the war. This isn't very relevant to the original argument in this thread, I just wanted to prove you wrong on the many faulty points you build up your arguments on.

Also it's a compliment to Obama that you think he is more like Hitler than McCain. Hitler is perhaps the politician that has done the most for Germany when you look at the internal politics. The political system that Germany is based on today is the same system Hitler built up, just without the nazi facism.

germany did feel they were superior, anyone else remember the holocaust?

[kthx]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54tjbgJmLFg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WqF19Phn0Og



Yeah obviously he has all of the good traits of Hitler and none of the bad ones. Because he doesn't use certain words to sway the minds of ignorant people.

[Noah]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54tjbgJmLFg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WqF19Phn0Og



Yeah obviously he has all of the good traits of Hitler and none of the bad ones. Because he doesn't use certain words to sway the minds of ignorant people.

Swaying the people with certain words in order to get into a certain position of power is pretty much something every politician has to do. Nobody will ever be elected for pure politics alone, they will also need a certain amount of charisma and propaganda. There's nothing saying that you either have to have good politics or good pr, it is possible to have both.

I bet I can also find videos of batshit insane people that isn't really relevant to anything. There's always a crazy minority group of people that supports any cause.

Oh, HTF, this is going to be my only response to you:

[Kolar]

Are you really going to try to argue with me that certain countries fared much better in battle when they thought less about culture, and more about warfare? I know you want to try to prove me wrong but this is an ignorant assumption, of course a warlike civilization is going to dominate a civilization who has so much time to think about what at the time could be said to be useless information.

Could you give some examples?

[kthx]

Athens was a center for the arts, learning and philosophy, home of Plato's Akademia and Aristotle's Lyceum,[1][2] Athens was also the birthplace of Socrates, Pericles, Sophocles, and its many other prominent philosophers, writers and politicians of the ancient world. It is widely referred to as the cradle of Western Civilization, and the birthplace of democracy,[3] largely due to the impact of its cultural and political achievements during the 5th and 4th centuries BC on the rest of the then known European continent.[4]

---------------

ɨˈɡɛməni/ (Brit.))[1] (Greek: ἡγεμονία hēgemonía) is a concept that has been used to describe and explain the dominance of one social group over another, such that the ruling group or hegemon acquires some degree of consent from the subordinate, as opposed to dominance purely by force.[2] It is used broadly to mean any kind of dominance, and narrowly to refer to specifically cultural and non-military dominance, as opposed to the related notions of empire and suzerainty.

In international relations, a hegemon may be defined as a power that can dictate the policies of all other powers in its vicinity, or one that is able to defeat any other power or combination of powers that it might be at war with. An example of a hegemonic state in history is the united Germany that existed from 1871 to 1945,[3] or historically the Spanish and British Empires.

---------------

Resentment by other cities at the hegemony of Athens led to the Peloponnesian War in 431, which pitted Athens and her increasingly rebellious sea empire against a coalition of land-based states led by Sparta. The conflict marked the end of Athenian command of the sea. The war between Athens and the city-state Sparta ended with an Athenian defeat.

The democracy was briefly overthrown by a coup in 411 due to its poor handling of the war, but quickly restored. The war ended with the complete defeat of Athens in 404. Since the defeat was largely blamed on democratic politicians such as Cleon and Cleophon, there was a brief reaction against democracy, aided by the Spartan army (the rule of the Thirty Tyrants). In 403, democracy was restored by Thrasybulus and an amnesty declared.

------------------

By mid century, however, the northern kingdom of Macedon was becoming dominant in Athenian affairs, despite the warnings of the last great statesman of independent Athens, Demosthenes. In 338 BC the armies of Philip II defeated the other Greek cities at the Battle of Chaeronea, effectively ending Athenian independence. Further, the conquests of his son, Alexander the Great, widened Greek horizons and made the traditional Greek city state obsolete. Athens remained a wealthy city with a brilliant cultural life, but ceased to be an independent power. In the 2nd century, after 200 years of Macedonian supremacy, Greece was absorbed into the Roman Republic. (right)

--------------------

So, as you can see, the country that was more interested in cultural things, other than military things, was eventually dominated by more war-like civilizations in part due to jealously of what they had accomplished.

[Noah]

I don't see the relevance.

Back in those days it was perfectly ok to just go and invade other countries, but today it isn't. There isn't anyone who would attack anyone else in the western world because they want their advancements. Science is free to do whatever without having to fear military reactions these days, unless it's science directed towards war and destruction.

It's just a question of time before humanity can do everything any deity could do.

[kthx]

How is it not relevant, I don't think we are talking about only this era.

And it is pretty ridiculous to claim that humans will be able to perform deity like miracles at any time during our existence.


"The Simpsons" Marge Simpson "We can do anything now that science has invented Magic".

[Kolar]

Actually the Athenians took advantage of the Delian League to empower themselves as a naval super-power in the region. This put Sparta and the other city-states at a disadvantage after the invasion by Persia was repelled. Athens went on the offensive against Sparta and its allies at the onset of the war seeking to not directly engage the superior land forces. Ultimately they were defeated due to an outbreak of the plague within the city. While Athens did produce many of the worlds greatest ancient philosophers, artist and writers, it also produced many of the greatest statesmen and generals. Sparta didn't attack Athens because they feared their advancement or were envious, they most likely sought dominance over them for resources, politics and to secure Greece against its enemies wanting to be the primary greek military power in the region.

Edit: Philip II developed the military formation known as the phalanx which is credited with him being able to take leadership of Greece crushing his opposition. An innovation which took thought and practice to become a superior weapon of war. It seems to me that cultures that emphsis innovation, education and technology over brute force, superior in numbers philosophies seem to lead to dominance and greater expansion in the ancient world, not the other way around.

[kthx]

So you going to argue with Wikipedia when you have been using it to prove your Atheistic views the entire thread?

[Kolar]

The Peloponnesian War was lost due to natural disaster, I've read all of this before, I've studied ancient history and references back up what I have said (In 430, however, an outbreak of a plague hit Athens. The plague ravaged the densely packed city, and in the long run, was a significant cause of its final defeat.)

The hoplite formation used by other city states against Macedonia using the superior phalanx resulted in Phillp II taking power over the other cities.

And I didn't push a religious or philosophical point of view using Wikipedia, I tried to clarify the issue of perceived bias Izor saw in the scientific method and a number of theories.

[Exalt]

Very wrong. These are easily explainable phenomena that occur commonly within the core of every star. It's called nuclear fusion, the combination of atoms into an atom with a higher atomic number. It's highly energetically favorable and produces massive energy (hence the heat and light that we get from the sun.. or are you going to deny that too?).

Basic astronomy students learn about how elements up to iron are produced in stars. Why haven't you?

and students learn in high school that natural selection is how they became humans and they are descendants of monkeys, of course the rest of science already proved this old theory false, but it's still taught in schools as a way to differ from any type of creationism

[Kolar]

Why is it then if I, HandofDeath or anyone else explains something you ask, in this case cosmology, you immediately jump to another subject then make some asinine comment about something like evolution?

[Summa]

Why is it then if I, HandofDeath or anyone else explains something you ask, in this case cosmology, you immediately jump to another subject then make some asinine comment about something like evolution?

Because those who are ignorant hide behind something they know.

I do agree with hand on the fact that this was a bit glorified, but nonetheless this is a huge ass deal. Even someone with a mere high school education in biology and genetics can understand how creating RNA is a significant advancement. While HoG downplays the actual difficulty of converting DNA to RNA, he actually has some grounds in doing so. Considering the rate at which science is advancing, it probably won't be all too long before they do pull this off.

[Exalt]

There was no such thing as "Germany thought they were superior". Germany's brilliance in war can mostly be credited to some extremely competent generals. The generals actually advised against going into Russia Hitler ignored his generals and went into Russia because he himself had lost his sense. If the generals of Germany didn't have Hitler to answer to, then Germany could have won the war. This isn't very relevant to the original argument in this thread, I just wanted to prove you wrong on the many faulty points you build up your arguments on.

Also it's a compliment to Obama that you think he is more like Hitler than McCain. Hitler is perhaps the politician that has done the most for Germany when you look at the internal politics. The political system that Germany is based on today is the same system Hitler built up, just without the nazi facism.

Stop trying to dissuade History majors of the truth and twist your ignorant opinions as the 'real' truth, even when its completely false by every measure.

Hitler did nothing special for Germany except for amazing public speaking and propaganda towards a very weak minded group of people still reeling from the Great Depression and the Treaty of Versailles and stirring up nationalism. Hitler did nothing for Germany in terms of politics except for create a dictatorship. Hitler's Nazi party was completely socialist and had no traces of democracy or of a republic whatsoever. Apparently you enjoy communism and socialism, being that you are probably from an eastern European country Noah, but the western world does not. The Soviet Union, China, Cuba, North Korea, etc all have terrible standards of living and all have dictators. That is not a good political model of government, sorry.

As far as Hitler's Germany not thinking they were "superior," you must be on crack. Not only the Mein Kampf but also the anti-semitic Der Stürmer were published by the Nazi party. Himmler's holocaust clearly didn't show they thought they were superior. Clearly. I mean the typical views of militant nationalists of time, such as opposing the Treaty of Versailles, having anti-Semitic views, and believing in the superiority of Germans who claimed to be part of the Aryan "master race" surely doesn't show them as thinking they were "superior." Surely.

I mean Hitler's whole rise to power was due to illegal activity, not because he was voted in on good conscious. He may have been popular but he never won more than 50% of any vote at any time in history. After a 50-50 tie between the Nazi Party and the KPD, another vote was held, and the Nazi's won only 30% of the vote. After that, on 27 February 1933, the Reichstag building was set on fire. This Reichstag fire was blamed on a communist conspiracy and the KPD's offices were closed, its press banned and leaders were arrested. Hitler had pushed forth the "Reichstag Fire Decree", suspending most of the human rights provided for by the 1919 constitution of the Weimar Republic. A further decree enabled preventive detention of all communist leaders, amongst many thousands of others. Clearly this shows great democracy at work, and a wonderful political environment as told to us by Noah the all knowing.

With the communists then gone, Hitler's Nazi party won 43.9% of the vote, and then started the "enabling act" which allowed the cabinet, aka hitler, complete control of all legislative powers. Not far from that did Hitler change every law he saw fit to place the Nazi's in permanent control of the government. Clearly that is democracy at its finest Noah.

I think you have a very small mind in things such as WW2, as your country clearly taught you half-truths and molded it toward your own nationalistic pride. Please refrain from speaking ever again on the subject Noah, as you don't know what your talking about.