Self

[Astrogirl]

The purpose of atoms, the purpose of cells, the purpose of energy in the universe, the purpose of consciousness;
existence is the unity of these purposes

[Kontrolz]

The purpose of atoms, the purpose of cells, the purpose of energy in the universe, the purpose of consciousness;
existence is the unity of these purposes

What is the purpose of unity? Or the purpose of purpose itself? There is no "end all" answer to existence. That is probably why existence... exists.

Edit:... I tried IRC with telcat, all I got was a bunch of pointless statements and rambling error messages riddled with broken engrish

[Jerome Scuggs]

The reason I have started this thread is because I feel trapped, helpless, because I see no importance of the existence of any individuals. We are only here, as a whole, to prolong the existence of our specie. So that as far as some of us survive, then as far as the big picture is concerned, it is fine.

if you keep thinking of yourself as one part of a whole, then figuring out the whole's "purpose" will, in fact, fuck you up because you'll never figure that out. what good is Beethoven's music to the overall future of society? absolutely zero. the TWforums? zero. and yet they exist, and there are reasons for their existence.

of course, you are also placing alot of weight on the word "important". what do you define as "important"? do you have a mathematical, objective, scientific equation with which to prove something is "important" or "not important"? and just because something isn't important, does that mean it does not deserve existence? why?

i am here to:

1) burn down the government
2) rock n' roll
3) pay for my apartment

i consider these things the most "important" things in the world. how am i wrong?

"survival of the species" is not anywhere on my list of "reasons to keep existing". it is specifically because i am an individual in a particular place at a particular time surrounded by a particular group of individuals, that i think the way i do.

if you've ever been around people on acid, it's the same thing. when i was on LSD, sober people conversations always seemed so 'meaningless' because i was off exploring the great objective questions of life, and these people were discussing what they wanted for lunch. why would they even care? logically, people need food, so logically, they could go whereever. but where? the cheapest place? the closest place? the place with the best food? the closest, cheapest place with the best food? by the time you actually figured that out to the best logical answer... well, those people would have starved to death centuries ago. sometimes, people do things... just 'cause.

to despair because you see no end-all justification is stupid. it's stupid because to suppose that we could ever figure out the end-all truth is stupid. perhaps you should just do what you think is right, see how far it takes you, and make adjustments when you hit philosophical potholes.

you probably won't be changing the world, you won't be saving lives, but hopefully you'll make a decent living for yourself, and die happy. i think that is something that every individual hopes for, and it's interesting to see the six billion different ways it's playing out as we speak. billions of people doing billions of things billions of times a day... and almost all of it, objectively speaking, is not important. and yet.

[T3l Ca7]

Stop trying to get any form of sympathy from any of us, cause most don't care and others are actually going through something similar with their own lives.

I hate to be sympathized, although I would love to share with the few who are actually going through the same thing.

Science tries to answer how we got here,
Spirituality tries to answer why we are here.

The confluence of the two is troubled waters, so why keep going there? Science is definitive, faith-based spirituality often is not. Stop trying to answer spiritual questions with logic or science, the answer you seek is not to be found there. Faith is a perspective that you must simply buy into, trying to ‘prove’ it is a waste of time (let me know if you can prove out any of those miracles).

Arrrgh, I think I have more than once questioned the validity of faith. I don't see the point of 'having faith because I must', being as realistic as I am, I rather being tortured by the harsh truth than living happily in a white lie.

[Ephemeral]

Arrrgh, I think I have more than once questioned the validity of faith. I don't see the point of 'having faith because I must', being as realistic as I am, I rather being tortured by the harsh truth than living happily in a white lie.

If you were a realist, then you wouldn’t be asking questions like 'why are we here', or 'what is the point of life'.

[T3l Ca7]

The purpose of atoms, the purpose of cells, the purpose of energy in the universe, the purpose of consciousness;
existence is the unity of these purposes

Existence for the sake of existence is meaningless.

if you keep thinking of yourself as one part of a whole, then figuring out the whole's "purpose" will, in fact, fuck you up because you'll never figure that out. what good is Beethoven's music to the overall future of society? absolutely zero. the TWforums? zero. and yet they exist, and there are reasons for their existence.

of course, you are also placing alot of weight on the word "important". what do you define as "important"? do you have a mathematical, objective, scientific equation with which to prove something is "important" or "not important"? and just because something isn't important, does that mean it does not deserve existence? why?

i am here to:

1) burn down the government
2) rock n' roll
3) pay for my apartment

i consider these things the most "important" things in the world. how am i wrong?

"survival of the species" is not anywhere on my list of "reasons to keep existing". it is specifically because i am an individual in a particular place at a particular time surrounded by a particular group of individuals, that i think the way i do.

An individual might as well have a will of his/her own, he/she will seek food, affection, recognition or whatever he/she needs at the time, but what ever he/she wants to do has to do with the fact 1)(s)he wants to survival 2)(s)he wants to be a part of the society (and thus the willingness for the society to be well off) 3)(s)he wants a part of him/herself to survive (thus children).

No matter what the ultimate the motivation is, is something needed by the nature: so that some of us would survive.

you probably won't be changing the world, you won't be saving lives, but hopefully you'll make a decent living for yourself, and die happy. i think that is something that every individual hopes for, and it's interesting to see the six billion different ways it's playing out as we speak. billions of people doing billions of things billions of times a day... and almost all of it, objectively speaking, is not important. and yet.

My despair, unfortunately, comes from the fact we are just a part of the statistics, no matter how rich, powerful or famous someone really is. He/she will never escape from the ultimate fate.

Which bring out another question: if there so little meaning in anything we do, what stops me from trying to ruin everyone I dislike. What stop me from trying to destroy the whole human race?

[T3l Ca7]

If you were a realist, then you wouldn’t be asking questions like 'why are we here', or 'what is the point of life'.

I fail to see how they are mutually exclusive. I am realistic, yet I am curious. I don't see how the willingness to seek out truth is preventing me from be truthful.

[D1st0rt]

Telcat I think tone has some of the answers you seek, maybe you should try talking to him.

[Squeezer]

I fail to see how they are mutually exclusive. I am realistic, yet I am curious. I don't see how the willingness to seek out truth is preventing me from be truthful.

Because a realist realizes we're nothing more than animated flesh that will someday rot in the ground. There is no why, you'll probably never know how for sure, and who the hell can be concerned with what happens after you die? Probably the same thing that happens to every other dead object on this planet, it gets recycled into the Earth. No Heaven. No soul. Just lights out.

That's a realist perspective. The fact that you're trying to find meaning in your own existence is contradictory to calling yourself a realist, because realists believe their is no intrinsic meaning to everything. Order is the way it is because....that's the way it is.

I think that's more toward what Eph was getting at.

[Summa]

Talking in general obscure terms and referring to some more modern philosophers who continued Descartes' line of thought:

All one can know with absolute certainty is the self. Meaning can only be found in the self. If you cannot find meaning there, then you will not find meaning anywhere, because you can never know anything else with absolute certainty.

[gran guerrero]

What stop me from trying to destroy the whole human race?

another person

[gran guerrero]

What stop me from trying to destroy the whole human race?

a raccoon

[gran guerrero]

What stop me from trying to destroy the whole human race?

a paperclip

[gran guerrero]

What stop me from trying to destroy the whole human race?

the milf hunter

[gran guerrero]

What stop me from trying to destroy the whole human race?

the leper