protesting the new settings

[StarKitty]

lmao

I M $0 L337 and can h4x0r J00 a11 |\/|3|-|

That ruins the english language

Btw: I feel obligated to tell you that im drinking Margarita Mix.

hehe Is that an excuse to bitch at someone and then blame it on being drunk later?

Anyway i agree commas, apostraphes (bad spelling lolz) and full words please people

[Mr. Peanuts]

As long as I can understand it, I don't give a shit.

[bloodzombie]

I didn't know the settings got changed, but I really like this jeremy guy, he makes sense.

[Firesprout]

Your logic is sound to a point, however as a pretty much pure terrier/weasel player( I used to flag defense with warbird and lancaster or just played whatever was needed ) I have to confront you on a few things.

1) This is probably the biggest weakness of a weasel, good player or not. Stray shots or just any fire in an enclosed, or even unenclosed area. Weasels are slightly more manueverable, but by no means can they weave in and out of bullets and bombs like pretty much all the other ships can. Most of my weasel deaths are attributed simply to the fact that I ate a bullet for a team member without any attempt to do so. Weasels make up their advantage of stealth/cloak having little energy usage with the fact that any shot, even a single spider bullet, can render it useless, especially if cloaked, which is why so many weasel kills are also weasel deaths. You get the ever present strength of cloak/stealth along with the ever present weakness of pretty much everyone else around you.

2) Weasel's energy was upped a little bit( something like what, an extra 100 - 200 energy ), yet still one stray shot( point 1 leads into this one just to warn you ) can again lead to instant death or energy depletion. If a weasel is within the outer reaches of a Javelin bomb blast radius, it can die while all other ships would simply shrug it off.

3) You stated that Weasels now can fire two shots, well that's all well and good except one thing. You have to be uncloaked to do it, and I think unstealthed as well. That right there takes away the advantage of the Weasel, because it has to get in close to be effective and it's not easy to get in close against a competant opponent with an uncloaked Weasel.

4) You mention that Weasels don't use much energy to cloak/stealth, however you fail to mention that when cloaked and stealthed they gain NO energy, none, zero. Energy refills SLOWLY when unstealthed and quickly when uncloaked, making it a win-lose situation. Because if you get hit by a stray shot when cloaked/stealthed any plan of attack goes out the window because you must go hide and recharge if you don't want to be out in the open, that or hope to pick up a full charge green. Also if you fire and miss, yeah you can recloak, but chances are the missed opponent will turn around and fire in your direction at least once, most likely leading to your death.

5) Banning Weasels is dumb, just because of the basis of "oh I can't see it, I don't have a fighting chance so get rid of it". It's the weakest ship in the game overall, thus why it has cloak/stealth in the first place. Banning it just removes another portion of strategy from the game, just like banning levis did( levis + no private freqs = better than no levis at all ) because Weasels can and have been known to help out games. I have slipped into the flagroom and killed the terr, allowing my team to get into the flag room after getting our asses handed to us so many times that it's almost second nature to look for the openings to attack.

You have to look at this like a war game, because it is a war game. You wouldn't tell your army to stop using covert units that kill without being seen, and you wouldn't tell the enemy to stop using them either, you'd simply hunt them. So please, I mean the utmost respect, stop trying to get the game changed to fit your tastes just because you have no desire to have a bit of fear of a cloaked enemy. Cloaked enemies are what can make a game exciting. Look at Halo, those cloaked Elites pissed me off to the point where I played HARDER and got BETTER just so I could take them down more effectively.

Sorry for the long post.

good info. some clarfications:

weasels can charge (very slowly) if they have xradar off while cloaked and stealthed
yes they get strayed alot, esp with the new lanc settings
it takes skill to shoot a rapid bullet with the x and hit the target
and correcting what some1 mentioned earlier, YES it is possible to hit things as wbs radar lengths away, the new term in circulation is called a "radar spawn". It's basically like the old lanc shot, fast moving multifire with 1 hit kill. Ive seen weabird and vorf do that in pubs and is very effective at killing slower ships and even xs
and finally xs are there cuz theyr clear all the stupid ships from getting into base and those ever tking levis from reaching their safes for lt

[Fit of Rage]

To everyone bent on fucking up TW settings:

Procedure for talking:

1. Open mouth.
2. Insert foot.

I personally think we should go back to pub settings two years ago, but keep the Pure Pub bots.

[Gemfire]

Is it just me or has there been a recent giant influx of new forum goers?

[Quinn Cairn]

Your logic is sound to a point, however as a pretty much pure terrier/weasel player( I used to flag defense with warbird and lancaster or just played whatever was needed ) I have to confront you on a few things.

Sure, have at it.

1) This is probably the biggest weakness of a weasel, good player or not. Stray shots or just any fire in an enclosed, or even unenclosed area. Weasels are slightly more manueverable, but by no means can they weave in and out of bullets and bombs like pretty much all the other ships can. Most of my weasel deaths are attributed simply to the fact that I ate a bullet for a team member without any attempt to do so. Weasels make up their advantage of stealth/cloak having little energy usage with the fact that any shot, even a single spider bullet, can render it useless, especially if cloaked, which is why so many weasel kills are also weasel deaths. You get the ever present strength of cloak/stealth along with the ever present weakness of pretty much everyone else around you.

Nice try but this is a risk every ship takes. Stray shots can kill any ship. It's not like the weasel is especially vunerable stray shots. I would argue that levis would have a harder time with strays than weasels. As far as spiders are concerned, their rate of fire makes it hard for any ship to return fire without the risk that just one red bullet will do them in. Spiders are tough for any ship to deal with more so than WBs, but atleast they are visible. Weasel kills are not always weasel deaths unless they are in a confined space but then again all ships are limited in their movements in a confined area so this is hardly unique to the weasel.

2) Weasel's energy was upped a little bit( something like what, an extra 100 - 200 energy ), yet still one stray shot( point 1 leads into this one just to warn you ) can again lead to instant death or energy depletion. If a weasel is within the outer reaches of a Javelin bomb blast radius, it can die while all other ships would simply shrug it off.

Once again this is not a unique situation for the weasel, Javs are dangerous even to their own teammates because they kill indescriminately. Besides my main problem with the weasels isn't their energy level, only the cloak + stealth aspect. So let's just keep the discussion focused on that.

3) You stated that Weasels now can fire two shots, well that's all well and good except one thing. You have to be uncloaked to do it, and I think unstealthed as well. That right there takes away the advantage of the Weasel, because it has to get in close to be effective and it's not easy to get in close against a competant opponent with an uncloaked Weasel.

No, no. Nice try again. You can fire cloaked and stealthed but once you fire you become uncloaked. However, it is simple to immediately recloak and therefore evade counterfire as ships fire randomly in the area they last saw the weasel. Meanwhile the weasel gingerly flys to a safe spot to recharge. Happens all the time. It would be nice if the weasel had to manually uncloak before firing. It would be a good I idea, I'm glad you brought it up.

4) You mention that Weasels don't use much energy to cloak/stealth, however you fail to mention that when cloaked and stealthed they gain NO energy, none, zero. Energy refills SLOWLY when unstealthed and quickly when uncloaked, making it a win-lose situation. Because if you get hit by a stray shot when cloaked/stealthed any plan of attack goes out the window because you must go hide and recharge if you don't want to be out in the open, that or hope to pick up a full charge green. Also if you fire and miss, yeah you can recloak, but chances are the missed opponent will turn around and fire in your direction at least once, most likely leading to your death.

All they do, and they do it regularly btw, is move to a safe spot, where ever that happens to be, and recharge. Once again every ship is susceptible to stray shots that can kill, even spidershots depending on the situation. Yes the opponent will shoot RANDOMLY in the area where the weasel WAS, but common sense tells the weasel not to remain there and they don't.

5) Banning Weasels is dumb, just because of the basis of "oh I can't see it, I don't have a fighting chance so get rid of it". It's the weakest ship in the game overall, thus why it has cloak/stealth in the first place. Banning it just removes another portion of strategy from the game, just like banning levis did( levis + no private freqs = better than no levis at all ) because Weasels can and have been known to help out games. I have slipped into the flagroom and killed the terr, allowing my team to get into the flag room after getting our asses handed to us so many times that it's almost second nature to look for the openings to attack.

I disagree. The levi is not banned from all the pubs just "pure pubs". This means if you want to fly levi you just avoid the few "pure pubs" that are around. Having arenas that ban levis is an acknowledgement by the staff that their settings, no matter what they say otherwise, are not balanced. This doesn't make them dumb, just sensible. Pure pubs give players a chance to play a truly balanced game without having to worry about a ship(levi and hopefully weasels) whose unbalanced settings take away from the game. It also gives players a choice which they can use to avoid this ship or not. Just because a ship may be helpful in the game is not evidence that banning it is right or wrong or "dumb", as you call it. I'm sure the levi is very helpful in taking or retaking base, but it's downsides like large scale massive indiscriminate killing, outweighs it's advantages, in terms of overall gameplay. The levi serves as a precedent that banning a ship (only in certain arenas btw) that unbalances the game, can and does improve gameplay. I don't want the weasel banned from every arena. I just would like to have one, just one arena were I can fly and have a chance against every ship. This simply is not the case with weasels around.

You have to look at this like a war game, because it is a war game. You wouldn't tell your army to stop using covert units that kill without being seen, and you wouldn't tell the enemy to stop using them either, you'd simply hunt them.

I also wouldn't tell my army not to use bombers that inflicted massive damage, but that is being done in "pure pubs".

So please, I mean the utmost respect, stop trying to get the game changed to fit your tastes just because you have no desire to have a bit of fear of a cloaked enemy. Cloaked enemies are what can make a game exciting. Look at Halo, those cloaked Elites pissed me off to the point where I played HARDER and got BETTER just so I could take them down more effectively.

This I find interesting. First, you assume it is just my tastes. Second, you try to prevent me from providing feedback and discussing issues on a forum created for such discussions. Am I trying to change the game or one aspect of the game? The game is still about basing more or less so that will not change is the weasels are changed. Also, people discuss and request changes all the time just look at the levi, the repels are back and it's good those people took the time to discuss and provide feedback as to why the levis should have repels. I really don't understand this adversion to feedback or discussions. It's not like you're being forced at gunpoint to read and respond to my posts. Also, I'm sure I'm not the only that feel this way about the weasels just as there were many people who felt uneasy about levis in the game. I do not think the changes I proposed for the weasel is unreasonable, especially the pure pub changes. I not saying I'm a spokesperson for the weasel is a nuisance squad. But when I speak about the weasels being a nuisance, it simply isn't representative of "[my] tastes" alone.

Sorry for the long post.

Wouldn't be so bad if you didn't try to prevent me from participating in discussions and providing feedback on a PUBLIC forum. But I'll welcome YOUR feedback nonetheless.

PS. Those with an adversion to feedback and a love of censorship please, please, forgive me for posting my feedback and participating in a public discussion.

[SpiderMage]

To Quinn

First, I never meant to come off as stopping you from giving feedback, however it gets tiring to hear the same arguement against weasels over and over, and that arguement is simply "weasels can cloak, I can't see them so it's not fair". It gets old that this statement seems to be the only arguement people have, because look at it from the other side. If weasels had NO cloak or stealth, people would complain about their total weakness in the game, that they have no advantage at all like every other ship does. Warbirds are the all rounders and that's their advantage, Javs their bombs, Spiders their rapid fire, Levis their strength, Terrs their speed/burst, Lancs their spread fire and Sharks their mines, so why do you constantly pick on the weakest ship's only advantage? If weasel had no cloak at all, and you pit it in a duel against pretty much every other ship, weasel would lose at least 75% of the time, this is why weasels have cloak. Now onto your posts...

Nice try but this is a risk every ship takes. Stray shots can kill any ship. It's not like the weasel is especially vunerable stray shots. I would argue that levis would have a harder time with strays than weasels. As far as spiders are concerned, their rate of fire makes it hard for any ship to return fire without the risk that just one red bullet will do them in. Spiders are tough for any ship to deal with more so than WBs, but atleast they are visible. Weasel kills are not always weasel deaths unless they are in a confined space but then again all ships are limited in their movements in a confined area so this is hardly unique to the weasel.

Yes, stray fire is a problem for all ships, BUT you seemed to have failed to grasp the biggest point. Any fully charged ship but weasel can survive a stray shot( save for a jav/shark bomb ) long enough to shake it off and counter attack or fly for cover. A fully charged warbird can survive a single or multiple stray spider bullets, stray Lanc bullets, stray terr shots, etc. A fully charged weasel however, cloaked or not, dies from a single stray Lanc shot and gets crippled by a single spider/terr bullet with NO recharge if fully cloaked, stealthed and has xradar on. That was the point. Yes stray fire is dangerous for all, but is the most dangerous for weasels.

No, no. Nice try again. You can fire cloaked and stealthed but once you fire you become uncloaked. However, it is simple to immediately recloak and therefore evade counterfire as ships fire randomly in the area they last saw the weasel. Meanwhile the weasel gingerly flys to a safe spot to recharge. Happens all the time. It would be nice if the weasel had to manually uncloak before firing. It would be a good I idea, I'm glad you brought it up.

Yeah ok, they can immediatly recloak... now saw there is a terr nearby that saw you miss... or a jav... or a lanc( I was told they have xradar now, could be miss informed ), if you are spotted, hit or miss, by anyone with xradar, most likely the weasel is done, no questions asked. So being able to recloak after a miss isn't that big of an advantage, because watch or play any stealth game or movie, if an assassin misses his target, at least half the time he is done for. Why do you think governments always disavow any knowledge of spies if they mess up? Because there is no hope of getting them back.

All they do, and they do it regularly btw, is move to a safe spot, where ever that happens to be, and recharge. Once again every ship is susceptible to stray shots that can kill, even spidershots depending on the situation. Yes the opponent will shoot RANDOMLY in the area where the weasel WAS, but common sense tells the weasel not to remain there and they don't.

Now forgive me if 'm wrong, but 'm starting to form the opinion that you don't play as a weasel much, if ever. As I said earlier, yeah the weasel can try to get away, but if it is spotted, it's most likely dead.

I disagree. The levi is not banned from all the pubs just "pure pubs". This means if you want to fly levi you just avoid the few "pure pubs" that are around. Having arenas that ban levis is an acknowledgement by the staff that their settings, no matter what they say otherwise, are not balanced. This doesn't make them dumb, just sensible. Pure pubs give players a chance to play a truly balanced game without having to worry about a ship(levi and hopefully weasels) whose unbalanced settings take away from the game. It also gives players a choice which they can use to avoid this ship or not. Just because a ship may be helpful in the game is not evidence that banning it is right or wrong or "dumb", as you call it. I'm sure the levi is very helpful in taking or retaking base, but it's downsides like large scale massive indiscriminate killing, outweighs it's advantages, in terms of overall gameplay. The levi serves as a precedent that banning a ship (only in certain arenas btw) that unbalances the game, can and does improve gameplay. I don't want the weasel banned from every arena. I just would like to have one, just one arena were I can fly and have a chance against every ship. This simply is not the case with weasels around.

Your comment about weasels and levis not being balanced to me is just well... 'm sorry but I think it's stupid. How are Levis not balanced? Slow yet powerful, HORRIBLE recharge rate, HORRIBLE rotation, the only strength they have is that powerful bomb, that's IT. Play any game, any first person shooter, any fighting game, big and strong characters and completely balanced by their low speed and even lower manueverability. It is my opinion that people wanted Levis banned from "pure pub" because they just didn't want to do the extra work and were upset about massive TKs. I hate TKs as much as the next person and there's a way to deal with that, yet no one seems to like it. Team damage adds realism to the game but also instills frustration and TKs could be dealt with by removing it, but 'm getting off topic. Back to weasels, 'm sorry I just cannot agree with you. Weasels have cloak/stealth to balance out their weakness, tweaking with cloak/stealth to make to harder for weasels to kill just puts the advantage into your hands. Having to manually uncloak and then fire, why? Seriously, just, why? No other ship has to pause before firing, why should weasels have to? Banning weasels from "pure pub" is just a cop out, 'm sorry. Every ship has an advantage over at least one other ship in different situations. Warbirds dominate pretty much every ship out in the open, Spiders dominate in flagroom as do Javs and Lancasters, Terrs dominate weasels to a point, sharks dominate with mines, so... why are Weasels not allowed dominion over some ships? Giving the excuse of "well I just want a fighting chance against all the ships", who says you are supposed to have a fighting chance against all ships? Where would the tension come from( save for a good battle for the flagroom ) if you didn't have to worry about a ship killing you out of no where. I don't know if you play other online games( First Person Shooters ) but this arguement reminds me too much of the sniper arguement I heard in Tribes and CounterStrike far too often. It's always "I can't see them when they shoot me so it's not fair". Well let me say it again. This is a war game, not everything is fair. Adapt. If you don't like weasels, instead of ruining it for the pure pubers who like to weasel by banning them, hunt them, it's that simple.

[Quinn Cairn]

First, I never meant to come off as stopping you from giving feedback, however it gets tiring to hear the same arguement against weasels over and over, and that arguement is simply "weasels can cloak, I can't see them so it's not fair". It gets old that this statement seems to be the only arguement people have, because look at it from the other side. If weasels had NO cloak or stealth, people would complain about their total weakness in the game, that they have no advantage at all like every other ship does. Warbirds are the all rounders and that's their advantage, Javs their bombs, Spiders their rapid fire, Levis their strength, Terrs their speed/burst, Lancs their spread fire and Sharks their mines, so why do you constantly pick on the weakest ship's only advantage? If weasel had no cloak at all, and you pit it in a duel against pretty much every other ship, weasel would lose at least 75% of the time, this is why weasels have cloak. Now onto your posts...

What you view as "pick[ing] on", is in actually called critiquing and offering up constructive criticisms. However, this act seems to disperportionally bother you. BTW, I have no problem with weasels cloaking. I critiquing the wisdom in allowing them to cloak AND stealth, looking at the ramifications of the current situation and offering up potential solutions including "pure pub" banishment. I have never advocated removing cloak from the weasel, so please, respond to my actual words and not phantoms of your own creation.

Yes, stray fire is a problem for all ships, BUT you seemed to have failed to grasp the biggest point. Any fully charged ship but weasel can survive a stray shot( save for a jav/shark bomb ) long enough to shake it off and counter attack or fly for cover. A fully charged warbird can survive a single or multiple stray spider bullets, stray Lanc bullets, stray terr shots, etc. A fully charged weasel however, cloaked or not, dies from a single stray Lanc shot and gets crippled by a single spider/terr bullet with NO recharge if fully cloaked, stealthed and has xradar on. That was the point. Yes stray fire is dangerous for all, but is the most dangerous for weasels.

How often are ships, especially those in the heat of battle fully charged? I've died from single spider shots often enough. Strays are a problem for all ships and are not a unique hazard for the weasel.

Yeah ok, they can immediatly recloak... now saw there is a terr nearby that saw you miss... or a jav... or a lanc( I was told they have xradar now, could be miss informed ), if you are spotted, hit or miss, by anyone with xradar, most likely the weasel is done, no questions asked. So being able to recloak after a miss isn't that big of an advantage, because watch or play any stealth game or movie, if an assassin misses his target, at least half the time he is done for. Why do you think governments always disavow any knowledge of spies if they mess up? Because there is no hope of getting them back.

No, Lancasters do not have X-Radar. Weasels now have it with no energy consumption penalty. Lancasters, WBs, Spiders, and Levis are at the complete mercy of the weasels. Not all X-Radar ships can respond to a weasel threat. Terrs can but they always could since X-Radar does not carry a energy consumption penalty. Jav's and Shark's X-Radar has a substantial energy penalty. Javs with X-Radar on has a limited amount of time to fire a bomb before it's energy is too low. Then it has to resort to it's rear guns which are weak. Then there is always the possibility of the jav TKing you. Sharks have very limited offensive capability and are also a TK threat. That leaves another weasel to take on the opposition's weasel, if in fact another weasel is even around or off preying on a blind, unsuspecting opponent at the time. Besides, with X-Radar a weasel would have to be a fool to attack a ship on the rare occasion when there is another weasel around.

Now forgive me if 'm wrong, but 'm starting to form the opinion that you don't play as a weasel much, if ever. As I said earlier, yeah the weasel can try to get away, but if it is spotted, it's most likely dead.

No, no. But nice try anyway. I fly weasel enough to know its flaws and its advantages. Spotted weasel most likely dead? No, no. I weasel is only "spotted" by X-Radar. I've already gone into detail about the ships with X-Radar. This is not a big Hazard for weasels. And certainly not one that will make it "most likely dead" when it is spotted.

Your comment about weasels and levis not being balanced to me is just well... 'm sorry but I think it's stupid.

You know that personal attacks are a sign of weakness in your argument. When you let it degrade to that level, you've conceded your intellect and principles can't stand on their own. And I know you wouldn't want to do that.

How are Levis not balanced? Slow yet powerful, HORRIBLE recharge rate, HORRIBLE rotation, the only strength they have is that powerful bomb, that's IT. Play any game, any first person shooter, any fighting game, big and strong characters and completely balanced by their low speed and even lower manueverability. It is my opinion that people wanted Levis banned from "pure pub" because they just didn't want to do the extra work and were upset about massive TKs. I hate TKs as much as the next person and there's a way to deal with that, yet no one seems to like it. Team damage adds realism to the game but also instills frustration and TKs could be dealt with by removing it, but 'm getting off topic.

Ahh, but you're forgetting a quality that helps make the levi unbalanced, and that's the phenomenon we know as the Levi-Terr. Fast moving and hard to catch. The only ship that can catch it (with antiwarp) is too weak to do anything when it does. It is the Levi-Terr along with massive indescriminant killing power that is responsible for "pure pub" banishment of the levi. Thank goodness for that ban.

Now having said that, I meant unbalanced in relation to gameplay, specifically the Levi-Terr. The current settings of the levi unbalances the gameplay, the staff realized this (no matter what they may say) and banned it in pure pub. The result is hard to argue with, although you obviously do.

Back to weasels, 'm sorry I just cannot agree with you. Weasels have cloak/stealth to balance out their weakness, tweaking with cloak/stealth to make to harder for weasels to kill just puts the advantage into your hands.

As opposed to having the advantage in the weasels hands. But hey, read my posts and comprehend that one of the ideas I'm advocating is adding weasels to the "pure pub" ban list. This way the weasels settings stay unchanged but people adverse to unfair competition can avoid weasels. Win-Win.

Having to manually uncloak and then fire, why? Seriously, just, why? No other ship has to pause before firing, why should weasels have to?

Hey, in a way it was your idea. You originally thought the weasel had uncloak before firing. And to answer your question, no other ship has cloak and stealth, that's why.

Banning weasels from "pure pub" is just a cop out, 'm sorry. Every ship has an advantage over at least one other ship in different situations. Warbirds dominate pretty much every ship out in the open, Spiders dominate in flagroom as do Javs and Lancasters, Terrs dominate weasels to a point, sharks dominate with mines, so... why are Weasels not allowed dominion over some ships? Giving the excuse of "well I just want a fighting chance against all the ships", who says you are supposed to have a fighting chance against all ships? Where would the tension come from( save for a good battle for the flagroom ) if you didn't have to worry about a ship killing you out of no where. I don't know if you play other online games( First Person Shooters ) but this arguement reminds me too much of the sniper arguement I heard in Tribes and CounterStrike far too often. It's always "I can't see them when they shoot me so it's not fair". Well let me say it again. This is a war game, not everything is fair. Adapt. If you don't like weasels, instead of ruining it for the pure pubers who like to weasel by banning them, hunt them, it's that simple.

That last one came off a little angry. Calm down. "Ruin it for pure pubers that like to weasel"? Like it is ruined for pure pubers that like to levi. Weak argument. They can still weasel in non-pure pubs. Just like they can levi in non-pure pubs. And, yeah, yeah all ships have advantages over another ship, but weasel has a total advantage over ships without X-Radar. That is unseen in the list of ships you listed as having advantages over some other ship. A fighting chance means it is still possible, no matter how outclassed a ship may be to kill the ship that outclasses them. This is not present in even minute amounts leading into a weasel vs. non-X-Radar ship battle. If it misses you might have a shot at killing it, but initially you're at it's mercy. Wouldn't be if the weasel didn't have stealth or if it had some sort of consumption penalty for using cloak and stealth at the same time. But since the thought of changing ship settings cause some people undue pain, pure pub seems the be a way around that.

Once again to people emotionally harmed by my posts and weary of reading them, I apologize for my participation in a discussion on a public forum. I can only imagine the distress caused by being forced, under penalty of death, to read my posts.

[SpiderMage]

Y'know, you're starting to amuse me with attempting to evaluate me psychologically. Angry? I was never angry in any post so you can end that right there. That and you saying I am "personally attacking you", in my opinion anyone who says levis/weasels are unbalanced has a flawed or stupid opinion. Maybe stupid is the wrong word, but flawed is definate.

Now, you also went on to say "respond to my actual words", take a lil time to practice what you preach... because:

Where did I say you were advocating removing just cloak in any of my posts? I gave an example, note and EXAMPLE of what weasel would be like without cloak and stealth, that without either of those things they would be fully useless.

I never said strays were a unique hazard for weasels, for unique implies that they are the only ones that have to worry. Yes all ships have to worry about stray, but stray is more deadly to a weasel than a warbird because of energy differences and recharge rates.

Lancs, warbirds, spiders and levis are all at the mercy of weasels, ok and? Javs, spiders, terrs, lancs, levis and sharks are all at the mercy of warbirds, all you need is enough distance and manueverability and any ship can die to the hands of a warbird. So far, your only arguement is still only "weasels can cloak/stealth with no penalty so I can't see them so it's not fair". There are some games in this world that want some opponents to be blind to certain things...

And ok, Lev-Terr, insane speed with insane power, unbalanced, but we are talking about single ships, not union of ships. Because Lanc-Terr is deadly, so is Warbird-Terr, Shark-Terr, Spider-Terr... Levi in itself is not unbalanced

Correct me if 'm wrong... but isn't the whole idea of cloak/stealth to be the weasel's advantage? They are supposed to have that advantage over "blind" opponents, just like Spiders have the rapid fire advantage over a warbird...

You keep pressing with the "unfair" arguement, it's weak 'm sorry. You never touch on my comment about everything is not meant to be fair... so it's ONE ship that has an "unfair" advantage over the main ships, get over it. And when did I ever say I thought weasels had to uncloak before firing?

And the whole "it ruined it for levis in pure pub", first of all, pure pub = no levis, so there's no way pure pub can ruin it for levis since levis don't exist in pure pub. Weasels however ARE in pure pub, and sometimes weasels don't want to have to deal with the deaths caused by levis, yet you seem to want them to be forced to play where levis play...

And one thing you still never, ever touch on save for "going to hide". You keep saying Weasels have no penalty for having cloak and stealth on at the sametime. You never touch the fact that it does not regain any energy, none. In a battle outside the base, a weasel one on one, if it misses, if it is not immediatly killed it has to retreat and recover while the opponent can simply fly off and be left alone.

This is how the game has been broken down for Weasels:

Before the new settings this is how it was...
Weasels only had an advantage over Warbirds, Spiders and Lancasters( not counting Levis and it's not that hard to flash x radar on and off, I do it all the time in jav )
Weasels were pretty much easy fodder for Terrs and Javs, and it was no trouble for a Shark to lure a Weasel in and then drop a mine.

The new settings...
Weasels now can put up a decent fight against Terrs while their advantage over Warbirds, Spiders and Lancasters remain the same, so nothing has really changed.

When the game was created, long long ago, Weasels were given cloak/stealth to be their advantage over other ships. And for as long as I can remember, and maybe as long as this game has been around, Weasels have never had a penalty for cloak/stealth, so why now?

Also you have to take into account how much their bullet costs in energy, if you put an energy penalty on using cloak and stealth at the same time, how is a weasel going to fire a shot?

Again, this all simply boils down to the arguement "I can't see them and that's not fair".

One other thing 'd like to know, do you dislike it when some of your teammates are Weasels and score kills for you? Say taking out the Spider that is firing at you or the Warbird that is chasing you?

EDIT: One last thing I thought of... you keep saying that Lancasters, Spiders and Warbirds are all at the mercy of Weasels... what about Warbirds, Javs, Spiders, Terrs and Lancasters all being at the mercy of mines? Mines at the entrance of the flagroom with no one willing to Shark is a bothersome situation, sometimes even more annoying than being killed by a Weasel, especially if the enemy Shark keeps being fed repels and simply pushes you back and relays mines when someone sacrifices a life to clear a mine. What about that advantage Sharks have over every other ship, and that's not just some ships, that's every other ship save for Weasels that can slip inbetween the mines.

[1ight]

I think I'lle just leave this thread as it is. I mean thats alot of text, not even I have the energy to read all that. I know I make long posts some times, but wow.. just look at em go! :P

[SpiderMage]

I think I'lle just leave this thread as it is. I mean thats alot of text, not even I have the energy to read all that. I know I make long posts some times, but wow.. just look at em go! :P

1ight my friend, it happens when you have 8 hours of nothing to do at work... graveyard shifts sure are boring >< 3 hours and 20 minutes to go!

[SpiderMage]

One more thing to Quinn

I just thought of this in terms of why Weasels should not be banned...

Levis were banned because people disliked their ability as a single unit or Levi-Terr to take an entire flagroom defense down, and keep it shut down.

Weasels have NO such potential, as they can only kill one at a time, and not for very long of a time( I mean consistant chain killing, not flying off and staying in safe areas even after you have full energy ) I myself haven't gotten over 60 bounty in a Weasel as best as I can recall, and Vorf, who I deem a VERY good weasel player, 'm not sure if 've ever seen him get over 60, I may be mistaken. Weasels in my opinion are a "5 minute ship", where your life expectancy is on average only around five minutes, cloaked or not, while other ships can easily out live this. So banning it from pure pub just because it can get a few kills now and then is flawed logic.

[Malladrin]

Oh my holy, it's the return of the ENFORCER's!! (or whatever his name was)

[1ight]

1ight my friend, it happens when you have 8 hours of nothing to do at work... graveyard shifts sure are boring >< 3 hours and 20 minutes to go!

No wonder, I totally feel you..
You know, why not make some art at the same time, have you tried out Open Canvas? Painter IX/9, both great programs.