My Roof Has Been Ruined

[Rudy]

While it is given TWPS will be a slow process, if however many people it takes feel that universally strongly about a particular setting, then that will be the recommended path to travel to ensure it's success. Although, I would be surpised if many settings change proposals met requirements for TWPS at all, considering the huge variation in opinions when it comes to this topic.

If I was either Arilou or DoCk> I'd be doing the same and disregarding everything anyone says on the matter. You can't please everyone, so it's hardly worth pleasing anyone but yourself (all innuendo aside). There are those that are still going to consistently play pubs through any change, either quite happy about the changes, or not. Nevertheless, there will be someone on the other end of the spectrum to balance their sentiments out. So then you wind up back at square one anyway with one half enjoying it, and the other half loathing it.

In regards to javs losing xradar, I'm not particularly concerned either way but it does seem to me, however little effect it does have on cutting back on the amount of TKs, that there is an effct, and it is a good effect. Therefore I support it. Now that lancs have xradar it has greatly increased the usage of that ship. In the past it was sorely underused because it was never a viable basing tool. But now it is profficient at killing anything, provided sufficient accuracy of course.

[Asmodeus]

I cannot understand most the new settings. I'd rather get blown up by a levter anyday then something i can't see at all.

TW HERE ME NOW!

Go back, Way Back to the old setting.
Possibly,
1. Use the old cloaker settings with a Small cloak ship cuz that cool (mini-cloaker with old settings).
2. Take the Landcaster go back to old settings.
Or Make them so they die easier with the red bullets there almost impossible to kill with a ter, or spider.And there as annyoing as sticking your finger in light socket.
Or Maybe just use old setting but speed the ship up a little, thus thrust or maybe a faster recharge rate. or just add speed .



Wit.

Ps. Talked about this the other night in a chat. Not the only one that feels this way.

I would sign that. As Rudy has mentioned, we have a new system in place; a system that "allows anyone to make a proposal for changes in the Trench Wars zone that will then be considered by members of Trench Wars upper staff (defined as the team of SMods and Sysops)." Here's the address for the forms and documentation: http://www.trenchwars.org/twps/ if you're interested.

[Kolar]

Upper staff will still not go for it and I don't think they'll go for any other changes to publics through TWPS, I would also sign it though so give it a shot.

[1ight]

I think you can still get x-radar from a green? Also you get x-radar radomly? :s

[semenfaze]

Arilou fucked that ship up no doubt, as he always does

[tahkis]

I think you can still get x-radar from a green? Also you get x-radar radomly? :s

Nah. Nowdays you can get full charge with jav.

[Ephemeral]

Kolar,
I appreciate your efforts and trying to make improvements, I have made this point before. Until there is a specific objective to something, the path of improvement can not be well defined.

If the objective is to climb Mountain A, then it is feasible to discuss different paths and seek possible improved paths up Mountain A.

If when the objective isn't defined, or is loosely defined as 'let's just climb some mountains', discussing specific paths up different mountains is pointless and never ending.

My impression of TW is that it is someone's 'sandbox'. It isn't for profit. Growth isn't stated as the objective. TW merely exists.

What is the point in improving a thing that merely exists?

But thanks anyway for caring.

[Asmodeus]

Kolar,
I appreciate your efforts and trying to make improvements, I have made this point before. Until there is a specific objective to something, the path of improvement can not be well defined.

If the objective is to climb Mountain A, then it is feasible to discuss different paths and seek possible improved paths up Mountain A.

If when the objective isn't defined, or is loosely defined as 'let's just climb some mountains', discussing specific paths up different mountains is pointless and never ending.

My impression of TW is that it is someone's 'sandbox'. It isn't for profit. Growth isn't stated as the objective. TW merely exists.

What is the point in improving a thing that merely exists?

But thanks anyway for caring.

Not speaking for Kolar, but why not improve something that 400+ ppl have been playing for MANY years.

[Kolar]

I agree Eph, although it is implied that our goal is to make the game more popular and fun within the existing flaging game, a well defined missions statment like you said would help solidify it. I don't see anyone or any group here to do it or willing to do it so I think a group focused on the issues inside the publics could make one up. I think TWPS is good and might work out well but It is slow and it allows for limited comunication, direction and it lacks the ability for people to challenge the ideas or admend them to any degree needed for publics. My idea would allow for people in this comunity who care enough about it to comunicate ideas, vote on changes or even just offical TWPS proposals and actually make some progress and make the game better because even if you love the weasel, the levi terriers or anything that has some kind of controversial status, why not go for something that will represent the sides in the matter and come up with a solution to please everyone, or at least take a shot at it. I don't see this forum, upper staff or anyone actually comming up with the solutions needed.

[Troll King]

Not speaking for Kolar, but why not improve something that 400+ ppl have been playing for MANY years.

His point was that before we can improve we need to first decide what we want to improve into. If the goal is to promote pub basing for example, any "improvements" may be different than if the goal was to increase the zone's population. The word "improvement" can mean many things, but we need to define a direction to move in first.

[za gophar]

I agree that javs need x radar back.

for christ's sake. i had 220 bounty in jav a couple nights ago, and someone i kept on killing decided to get in a cloaker just to hunt me and kill me, and then change back. what do i call that? abuse.

the ship still sucks, in my opinion. in the pure basing timed pub, i do not mind it so much because everyone is all in the game, and it can actually make things interesting by slipping into the fr and getting the flag to reset the flagtime. everywhere else beside the timed basing pub.. it blows.

you wanna know what i say? i say let it keep cloak, boost up it's energy to 1500+, and take away its stealth. that way it still serves its current role, but in a less lame way.

[Fit of Rage]

http://www.kettlerroofing.com/ -- We'll fix that roof for ya.

[1ight]

Nah. Nowdays you can get full charge with jav.

I haven't noticed, haven't playied that much since I quited playing WoW and GW betas. Got myself GTA:SA, I'll keep that full charge thing in mind when playing with javelin. : )

[Ephemeral]

I agree Eph, although it is implied that our goal is to make the game more popular and fun within the existing flaging game, a well defined missions statment like you said would help solidify it. I don't see anyone or any group here to do it or willing to do it so I think a group focused on the issues inside the publics could make one up. I think TWPS is good and might work out well but It is slow and it allows for limited comunication, direction and it lacks the ability for people to challenge the ideas or admend them to any degree needed for publics. My idea would allow for people in this comunity who care enough about it to comunicate ideas, vote on changes or even just offical TWPS proposals and actually make some progress and make the game better because even if you love the weasel, the levi terriers or anything that has some kind of controversial status, why not go for something that will represent the sides in the matter and come up with a solution to please everyone, or at least take a shot at it. I don't see this forum, upper staff or anyone actually comming up with the solutions needed.

Your selling, but I'm not buying.
My opinion is that you have a pretty good idea, but only parts of what it would take to really change TW. The key to positive growth is a well defined objective, a strong leadership structure, and a communication mechanism that allows creative ideas to flow from all angles. The absence of any one of these parts will make it very, very hard to drive real positive change.

Let's look at each one of the three parts I mentioned, objective, leadership structure, and communication mechanism.

First, a well defines objective. This is critical in my opinion, has my previous post pointed out. Your post mentioned that an objective can be used to 'solidify' the efforts. For me, it is much more than that, it is absolutely key since everything that gets done is measured against it. Plus it helps keep things on track, everyone focused, and is used to stops turn over of the 'movers and shakers'. Nothing is more frustrating than to volunteer, pour tons of time and effort into something, and still feel like the purpose is just 'to exist'. Feeling like progress is being made is key to keeping people 'on-board' and working towards the objective. Not all tasks are intrinsically satisfying. Many of the 'grunt' tasks are required to be completed, doing the dirty work is a lot more satisfying if a person feels and sees progress is being made against a goal.

Second, a well organized leadership structure. My opinion is that this could not be done 'by committee'. Leadership by committee is a very hard thing to make work and often results in ideas that are 'watered down' and decisions that take too long to make. Additionally, you end up with diffusion of responsibility. The key is to establish a hierarchy, hold each person responsible for getting things done, and then periodically analyzing how each person is performing. If the performance isn't there, make changes.

Third, a effective communication mechanism that allows creative ideas to become implemented. This is where the 'democracy' part comes in. Everyone should feel like they have a way to provide input that gets heard. The TW community has always bitched about this, just look in these forums how people try to use them as a 'suggestion box', or how everyone feels that sending a email to ban@whatever.com doesn't work. It is like calling into your local cable company and not being able to actually talk to a real person, stuck in some endless loop from support system hell.

Just my opinion IF the TW community wants to move away from the current system of 'it's just a game, who gives a fuck'.

[Asmodeus]

His point was that before we can improve we need to first decide what we want to improve into. If the goal is to promote pub basing for example, any "improvements" may be different than if the goal was to increase the zone's population. The word "improvement" can mean many things, but we need to define a direction to move in first.

Any idea is a step in improving the game. TWPS is a system to possibly bring any idea that one might have into the game. We don't need a "sense of direction" just ideas as to what players think would be good for the game. That's how staff is going about this, as far as my understanding goes anyway.