Distension discussion

[roxxkatt]

Okay, there's something really messed up with the queue system. There are a bunch of people that can't even get in the game. I've been sitting here for the past 3 hours, and this is what happens every single time the game ends:

DBot> A slot has opened up. Sending you to your army...
(DBot)>Commander STABWOUND authorized as a pilot of PEOPLE'S REPUBLIC OF MISANTHROPY. Returning you to HQ.
DBot> Another player wishes to enter the battle; you have been removed to allow them to play.
(DBot)>STABWOUND leaving hangars of PEOPLE'S REPUBLIC OF MISANTHROPY. Time played today: 147 min.

It's let me into the game and immediately removed me about 7-8 times in a row now. A bunch of other people are having the same issue, too. I played 2 1/2 hours earlier in the day, but I don't see why that should keep me from playing for the rest of the day. I've played longer than that in a single day before, and it never completely kept me out of the game...

I think it should just be put back to a first in, first out queue system again. Either that, or maybe there's something broken with this one that should be fixed?

i played in the morning

this prevented me from playing the night round, 100%, every round

I think we just need multiple distension arenas

also, this
70 ppl in the distension arena tonight...
20v20 is a little laggy, and 2 arenas with 15v15 would be perfect

[Vehicle]

20 v 20 = 40
15 v 15 X 2 = 60
.....

I agree that the current queue set up sucks but I also think play time has to be considered when placing you in a queue. Maybe your number in line should be based on how long you've played that day and how long you've been waiting. Some kind of healthy meadium.

I was thinking earlier today about how the arena is always full with 5-20 people in the queue to play. This is do in large part to popularity and the excitement over it being out of beta, which will eventually wane, so I don't think another arena is the solution. What I was thinking, though, is that maybe we could have Dist run all the time and just have the RP bonuses be extremely small when it isn't the designated hosting times.

There are a few benefits to this. One is that lower ranked players, who have an easier time leveling, would be able to play the "off-peak distension" and gain upgrades while the higher ranked ships would have a harder time because the RP rewards are so small. This could give players who were discouraged by the utter rapage of their low level ships incentive to get higher ranks and therefore join the distension community. You'd probably want to make the cap on players smaller, maybe so that only the top base is ever used.

Another benefit is that it would presumably make the scheduled times less crowded, but probably not by much. The logic here is that people must have some sort of a life and won't play distension all day/every day. So, a player is able to log on and play distension whenever they want. While they may not get high RP, they would get some and they at least get the added playing experience and are more likely to log off before/during the hosted periods.

Or you could just make it so you can leave the arena when you're in line which would solve the waiting problem and maybe even breathe some life into the pub/subarenas.

[Vergilius]

DBot> MOLTENROCK has been promoted to COMMANDER for their commendable efforts!

English is just my 3rd language, but doesnt that have to be ... for his/her... ?

[DankNuggets]

I agree that the current queue set up sucks but I also think play time has to be considered when placing you in a queue. Maybe your number in line should be based on how long you've played that day and how long you've been waiting. Some kind of healthy meadium.

I was thinking earlier today about how the arena is always full with 5-20 people in the queue to play. This is do in large part to popularity and the excitement over it being out of beta, which will eventually wane, so I don't think another arena is the solution. What I was thinking, though, is that maybe we could have Dist run all the time and just have the RP bonuses be extremely small when it isn't the designated hosting times.

There are a few benefits to this. One is that lower ranked players, who have an easier time leveling, would be able to play the "off-peak distension" and gain upgrades while the higher ranked ships would have a harder time because the RP rewards are so small. This could give players who were discouraged by the utter rapage of their low level ships incentive to get higher ranks and therefore join the distension community. You'd probably want to make the cap on players smaller, maybe so that only the top base is ever used.

Another benefit is that it would presumably make the scheduled times less crowded, but probably not by much. The logic here is that people must have some sort of a life and won't play distension all day/every day. So, a player is able to log on and play distension whenever they want. While they may not get high RP, they would get some and they at least get the added playing experience and are more likely to log off before/during the hosted periods.

Or you could just make it so you can leave the arena when you're in line which would solve the waiting problem and maybe even breathe some life into the pub/subarenas.

The idea about the queue using playing time and wait time is spot-on. The problem comes in assigning weights to each and making a formula that's fair, at both the extreme # of playing time and extreme # of wait time. Could be done though, and it should.

FYI, even in beta distension had a pretty full arena with a long queue. It hasn't waned in popularity since it was scheduled properly again. It might eventually, but in that scenario, the second arena would just be unused, and it could be left alone or removed. People are going to want to play the packed arena for the most part though, so you probably won't see an even split between the two arenas. A benefit to this is that the less populated arena could be a haven for the lower rank ships, as the higher ranked ships will want the bigger bonuses awarded in the larger game.

I'm glad someone realizes that if ran 24/7, people will eventually play it a healthy amount, instead of assuming they'll all play non-stop until they eventually stop playing altogether.

[roxxkatt]

DBot> MOLTENROCK has been promoted to COMMANDER for their commendable efforts!

is 100% correct, and only political idiots disagree

[meddi]

At least there are still SOME people that know traditional grammar.

[gdugwyler]

is 100% correct

Oh, it's certainly not correct... though it may be considered that way in about 20-30 years. I consciously used their because saying "his or her" is just too damned awkward. Interestingly enough, sometimes using technically incorrect grammatical structures is the most eloquent way to get the point across. I do use his/her rather than their in actual writing -- except, of course, if a character's speaking colloquially, as we all do in person -- but in something like a casual video game, their is sufficient and comfortable...



For those waiting to hear about the queue, I'm trying to find a way to make it work. Unfortunately, as our playerbase grows, we have more people waiting in spec wanting to play, and it's not the people who haven't played at all on a particular that will be doing the most waiting. I don't want to make it completely time-based, but then again, is it really fair any other way? If you've played 2 hours earlier that day, and there are 15 other people waiting to play who haven't been able to play at all, why should you be able to play instead of them, regardless of how long you wait? In the end, the solution to this problem is going to come with some added restrictions, and increased uptime. If Distension is offered more freely, like elim, it will begin to fade. And I hate to say it, but if players know they get X time in a day, they'll be less likely to obsess over catching it every single time it runs up. Really, if you're playing more than 2 hours a day, you need to find something else to do anyhow... you'll eventually ruin the fun for yourself -- just like the grinding WoWHeads.

However, it's definitely a bug if it's still putting you in and then removing you immediately. It's meant so that if you ever get put in, you're guaranteed at least 1 round of play. I'll have to doublecheck that. But regardless, we're never going back to a FIFO queue -- it's more important to be fair to those who haven't yet played today than those who've gotten in 2-3 hours already... go play league or pub, or go read a book. My sympathy is rather limited for those in that situation, and the code will reflect that disposition.

Other thing: I'll begin reworking armies over the next few weeks so that permanent assignments go by the wayside. I may also just have to reduce end round bonuses, while also reducing somewhat the to-rank amounts for some of the support ships. Armies will exist on a daily basis, shuffled at each daily time reset; an auto-assist system will come in that will work by permanently reassigning players for that day rather than just sending them to assist; and armies will be randomized if one is dominating the other. Just a taste of what's to come, as clearly the conscience of Distension players cannot be relied upon...

[Vergilius]

Oh, it's certainly not correct...

... technically incorrect grammatical ....

kiss my ass, meddi and cheese :P
Yea i know his/her sounds weird, i was just wondering.

[404 Not Found]

I downloaded and installed Continuum again just to see what the talk was about this game. Sat in spec and watched for awhile and personally I just didn't get it as to all the excitement. Seems like it should be an EG event IMHO and not TW. If TW, it should be a hosted event and not a full time arena. But hey....whatever brings the population up is a plus. I was shocked to see how Continuum's arenas & population overall have diminshed.

GL with it.

[DankNuggets]

I downloaded and installed Continuum again just to see what the talk was about this game. Sat in spec and watched for awhile and personally I just didn't get it as to all the excitement. Seems like it should be an EG event IMHO and not TW. If TW, it should be a hosted event and not a full time arena. But hey....whatever brings the population up is a plus. I was shocked to see how Continuum's arenas & population overall have diminshed.

GL with it.

This is not a flame, I'm curious.

The only thing I can say about watching rather than playing, is that yes, it might look like EG. However, if you were to play it (hard to do with queue) you would have realized that most of the TW settings were there, just tweaked a bit.

• For example, although wbs start with lvl 2 bullets, there still mainly a one-hit-kill ship. They maneuver about the same.
• Javs still shoot a bomb that bounces once, and bullets from the rear. Still has a rocket available to it.
• Spiders still shoot a spray of lvl 1 bullets. They can shoot many more, but it doesn't' necessarily take a lot of them to kill anyone. An average ranked enemy will probably die from 3-4 shots in a row, just like in normal TW.
• Levis have changed a lot, that's one aspect that may not fit in the TW mold.
• Terrs are essentially the same, just with increased bullet speed, and a much higher top energy at high levels. Still uses portals, still uses bursts, still the only ship you can attach to.
• Weasels still the main cloaking ship. They're small, and shoot lvl 2's (one-hit ko's for the most part).
• Lancs are the same, except that they can now shoot a bomb at high levels (so can wb). Gets a burst at very high levels too.
• Sharks are the same except they now have a little bullet. Only ship that can repel, and still the main mine laying ship (wb can when it gets bombs, levis still can mine)
• The main style of game play is a TW themed base with a flag you have to keep for a set time, just like the bread and butter of TW.
• You don't have to 'green' up your ship to make it better like some zones, you start off with all your upgrades when you 'rearm' after spawning.

Really there are many more similarities to trenchwars than any other zone. No, it's not completely the same, which is why it's being called an event, but it's still closer to TW than anything else.

I'm wondering what made you decide on "it should be an EG event IMHO and not TW. If TW, it should be a hosted event and not a full time arena."

It's kind of hard to figure out how something should be hosted, and where it should belong if you haven't played it. I'm ecstatic that someone re-downloaded and intalled continuum because of distension, I just hope that you give it a fair shot, and maybe even try playing it (if you can get in the queue) before you decide it should be a hosted event only - especially when it doesn't need a host.

[404 Not Found]

This is not a flame, I'm curious.

The only thing I can say about watching rather than playing, is that yes, it might look like EG. However, if you were to play it (hard to do with queue) you would have realized that most of the TW settings were there, just tweaked a bit.

• For example, although wbs start with lvl 2 bullets, there still mainly a one-hit-kill ship. They maneuver about the same.
• Javs still shoot a bomb that bounces once, and bullets from the rear. Still has a rocket available to it.
• Spiders still shoot a spray of lvl 1 bullets. They can shoot many more, but it doesn't' necessarily take a lot of them to kill anyone. An average ranked enemy will probably die from 3-4 shots in a row, just like in normal TW.
• Levis have changed a lot, that's one aspect that may not fit in the TW mold.
• Terrs are essentially the same, just with increased bullet speed, and a much higher top energy at high levels. Still uses portals, still uses bursts, still the only ship you can attach to.
• Weasels still the main cloaking ship. They're small, and shoot lvl 2's (one-hit ko's for the most part).
• Lancs are the same, except that they can now shoot a bomb at high levels (so can wb). Gets a burst at very high levels too.
• Sharks are the same except they now have a little bullet. Only ship that can repel, and still the main mine laying ship (wb can when it gets bombs, levis still can mine)
• The main style of game play is a TW themed base with a flag you have to keep for a set time, just like the bread and butter of TW.
• You don't have to 'green' up your ship to make it better like some zones, you start off with all your upgrades when you 'rearm' after spawning.

Really there are many more similarities to trenchwars than any other zone. No, it's not completely the same, which is why it's being called an event, but it's still closer to TW than anything else.

I'm wondering what made you decide on "it should be an EG event IMHO and not TW. If TW, it should be a hosted event and not a full time arena."

It's kind of hard to figure out how something should be hosted, and where it should belong if you haven't played it. I'm ecstatic that someone re-downloaded and intalled continuum because of distension, I just hope that you give it a fair shot, and maybe even try playing it (if you can get in the queue) before you decide it should be a hosted event only - especially when it doesn't need a host.

DK, I did sit in spec and watch. I watched for awhile too, just taking in the aspects of the game itself. I noted that in the base, too many ships would just sit there doing nothing but waiting for a flag (looks like a ball from PB or old Strikeball to me) be shot onto the base and then shot into what looks like a goal. That in itself looks like a ball game and not a flag game to me.

I have seen Strikeball fail, as well as many other hosted events. It seems that the timed base game in pub died as well. Having a timed event in itself is somewhat of a flawed game considering the bot problems that have plagued TW for too many years...no offense to the bot developers.

The one common thing I am seeing in the forum as well as in spec on the game was the amount of complaints regarding the "queue". It really makes for a crap game if it is in public play and its not working. Suggestion? Remove the arena if "queue" is to remain a problem or remove and allow for a free for all entry. If so many people want to play, why restrict it? If you want to restrict it, then fix the "queue" problem before making it public access.

If it was to be a full time arena, just make sure it works and everyone that wants in can enter the game without waiting 3 hours only to complain that the "queue" is f'ed up.

DK, I guess my doubtfulness is summed up to years of seeing decent games that would have helped this server in population increases fail. I would love to see it work, but all in all it is not TW and not a replacement for what "Base" is. It is a glorified PB/EG looking/SB arena that deserves a spot most likely on the arena list, but as other games that have deserved this, they fade and the bots fail and then they vanish from the arena listings.

The real EG aspect I see is based upon the spawing and the additional weapons as you clearly noted. Why change the weapons at all? With all the hanging out at the base were I noted the many ships just hanging out there, one weapon that would be a great addition...and maybe it is there and I missed it, is to add multiple "Thor's" to break up that loitering in base.

I am a purest when it comes to TW and Base...am old school in this game and is most likely why I removed continuum once again from my O.S. I just had to see what this game was about and that is why I re-loaded it to my computer.

If it is fun, increases the population and is free of bot breakdowns, then push it to the max...I am all for the population of the game increasing. Was not meant to be a forum post to say this game should be removed...was just stating an unbiased opinion from an outside view in a sense.

I think I answered your questions...and no offense taken by your post!

[DankNuggets]

DK, I did sit in spec and watch. I watched for awhile too, just taking in the aspects of the game itself. I noted that in the base, too many ships would just sit there doing nothing but waiting for a flag (looks like a ball from PB or old Strikeball to me) be shot onto the base and then shot into what looks like a goal. That in itself looks like a ball game and not a flag game to me.

I have seen Strikeball fail, as well as many other hosted events. It seems that the timed base game in pub died as well. Having a timed event in itself is somewhat of a flawed game considering the bot problems that have plagued TW for too many years...no offense to the bot developers.

The one common thing I am seeing in the forum as well as in spec on the game was the amount of complaints regarding the "queue". It really makes for a crap game if it is in public play and its not working. Suggestion? Remove the arena if "queue" is to remain a problem or remove and allow for a free for all entry. If so many people want to play, why restrict it? If you want to restrict it, then fix the "queue" problem before making it public access.

If it was to be a full time arena, just make sure it works and everyone that wants in can enter the game without waiting 3 hours only to complain that the "queue" is f'ed up.

DK, I guess my doubtfulness is summed up to years of seeing decent games that would have helped this server in population increases fail. I would love to see it work, but all in all it is not TW and not a replacement for what "Base" is. It is a glorified PB/EG looking/SB arena that deserves a spot most likely on the arena list, but as other games that have deserved this, they fade and the bots fail and then they vanish from the arena listings.

The real EG aspect I see is based upon the spawing and the additional weapons as you clearly noted. Why change the weapons at all? With all the hanging out at the base were I noted the many ships just hanging out there, one weapon that would be a great addition...and maybe it is there and I missed it, is to add multiple "Thor's" to break up that loitering in base.

I am a purest when it comes to TW and Base...am old school in this game and is most likely why I removed continuum once again from my O.S. I just had to see what this game was about and that is why I re-loaded it to my computer.

If it is fun, increases the population and is free of bot breakdowns, then push it to the max...I am all for the population of the game increasing. Was not meant to be a forum post to say this game should be removed...was just stating an unbiased opinion from an outside view in a sense.

I think I answered your questions...and no offense taken by your post!

I think you answered more than just my questions. You only saw the ball game that goes on between basing games. You say you watched for awhile, but the ball game (yes it is like strikeball) is only on for like 5 mins in between the 5-30 minute rounds.

A third solution to the 'queue problems' would be to have another arena for people to spill over into, just like we do for pubs and twd.

One thing you can't observer though is the satisfaction you get from actually earning something for each kill. After you kill enough people, you can custumize your ship! That's what keeps people coming back, the satisfaction from earning RP that's actually useful. Think of it as being able to buy permanent, useful stuff from the safeties in pub.


To address the people sitting around doing nothing: The ball game is just meant to be a diversion between the actual basing game. In fact, it was just a normal goal until the small base was added to appeal to more ship types. You earn the equivalent of 4-5 kills (more or less) for each goal, so there's a bigger incentive to score and defend against them. That's why they're in the base. The reason they're not doing anything is because it's technically the break between rounds, where you can go get a drink or upgrade your ship. You can't spec to do this because it will remove you from teh game and put you in that dreaded queue.

[dako]

OK, so someone said there was supposed to be a shuffle daily now, at 2PM. Yay.

Unfortunately, this didn't happen. Un-yay.

The teams are 14v19 at 2:15 PM EST (now), no one is assissting, and we're still losing every single game within 10 minutes. I'm losing faith in whoever is hosting this arena anymore, that they would sit on their team with +5 people, not assist and horde the RP as the people on the team with -5 people struggle to get their team of 1 terr 1 shark 1 lanc 11 wbs to do something productive.

[404 Not Found]

I think you answered more than just my questions. You only saw the ball game that goes on between basing games. You say you watched for awhile, but the ball game (yes it is like strikeball) is only on for like 5 mins in between the 5-30 minute rounds.

A third solution to the 'queue problems' would be to have another arena for people to spill over into, just like we do for pubs and twd.

One thing you can't observer though is the satisfaction you get from actually earning something for each kill. After you kill enough people, you can custumize your ship! That's what keeps people coming back, the satisfaction from earning RP that's actually useful. Think of it as being able to buy permanent, useful stuff from the safeties in pub.


To address the people sitting around doing nothing: The ball game is just meant to be a diversion between the actual basing game. In fact, it was just a normal goal until the small base was added to appeal to more ship types. You earn the equivalent of 4-5 kills (more or less) for each goal, so there's a bigger incentive to score and defend against them. That's why they're in the base. The reason they're not doing anything is because it's technically the break between rounds, where you can go get a drink or upgrade your ship. You can't spec to do this because it will remove you from teh game and put you in that dreaded queue.

So from the viewpoint of someone coming in cold to play, as I would be. When you enter and are up against players that have aquired mods to the ship, like in guns & bombs...what is the insentive other than getting killed easily and taking the time to try and catch up to those with the superior bombs and bullets?

I assume this would be reset and not something that you would keep as far as ship modification for more than perhaps a weeks time at most?

As an old TWB purest, I am not for the mod's so to say in most apsects of TW. But in reading what you have noted I will give it another look sometime when I re-load continuum. Are there Thor's? and if not in noting all the other mod's in weapons, it sounds like it should be added, especially since what I caught was not the actaul game, but as you noted the in-between game.

No matter what happens...as an old TWB purest, I will most likely avoid it all together....one reason why I deleted the game entirely. I just use the forums these days. Plus I am an old man in the ranks of players still involved...let the game evolve. I am all for that as well as others enjoying it as I did years ago.

[Vehicle]

If it is fun, increases the population and is free of bot breakdowns, then push it to the max...

Oh the irony. Hi 404, NS for life.

The queue is in place so that the arena, those who are actually playing, doesn’t get too crowded. You noted how it’s pretty much a shit show during flagroom battles and if you eliminate all player restrictions it’s only going to get worse.

Dugwyler, are you alinea or qan in game?, your updates are clutch! I think you’re exactly right that it isn’t fair to let players in based purely on their place on line. I also think that changing the armies on a daily basis is a great idea because I really don’t think people care about their team and the auto-assist utility will make for more even games, good looks. And it’s worth noting that a lot of players, myself included, have been put into the game and then immediately re-docked more than once so if you make that fix the queue problem will lessen as well.

A couple things I would like to see:
-New goals
-Have the bot automatically switch to 2 base distension when enough players enter