TWT News

[Mythrandir]

TWT will change into an fully (as far as it goes) automated system. Matches will be completely hosted by TWBots, the first couple of weeks with supervision, later on completely without. Matches can be held at any time of the day, unscheduled, and between any squad that’s signed up to TWT and has enough players rostered. Also the amount of games that a squad plays is not restricted. A rating is calculated per squad, and the ladder will be based on rating. I’m not sure how to calculate the rating yet, but I think a variation of the ELO rating system will fit (used by chess, starcraft bnet ladder and many more ladder systems).



Advantages of this system:

This will be perfect for "newbie" squads and newly formed squads:
- It’s easy to join TWT, they can drop in at any time.
- It's easy to quit TWT, dissolved squads won't leave an 'open spot'.
- New squads are very active but most often not yet well-organized. With this system they can start a TWT game when they have enough players online, without having to schedule in advance and emailing their players about it.
- The practice games of today will be the TWT games of tomorrow. A new squad doesn't prove its skills not just to the squad it's playing against, but also to the whole TW community.
- in this way TWT will not conflict with TWL at all. And this makes it easy for the TWL staff to pick squads who may participate in TWL.
- Every squad, be it in TWL or not, can play TWT games.


The ladder updates automatically, right after a game is finished.
The rules will be more strict than TWL's. i.e. The bot will spec you without warning if you warp in a game.
Most appeals will _not_ be dealt with, since the squad always can play another game. Ofcourse, actions to prevent further appeals to happen will be taken.


The TWT website should contain roster management and the display of the ladder in various ways. Most likely this will be possible in the in twl.org website and/or the tw.org.


The bot is being worked on. First I will create a bot that should be able to host practice games 100% automated. And then I’ll start implementing the database and TWT aspects (roster checking, stat reporting, rating calculation).


Estimated time until completion: 6-8 weeks (mostly depends on the bot).
Might be earlier, but I like to keep a broad margin. Practice bot will be finished earlier.


Thoughts and inputs are more than welcome.


If you have suggestions posted in the topic Post suggestions for TWT here that apply the just announced system as well, then please repost it here and I'll answer it as best as I can.


We are going to change the name 'TWT' into a name that better fits this ladder system, suggestions about this are welcome as well.

[stuckup]

Nice!

[Superted]

Hmm...Sounds alrite so far ^_^

[Mitch]

$
Trench Wars Standing League
Trench Wars Competition League
Trench Wars Premier League
Trench Wars Guilded League
Trench Wars Ranking League

[arrogance]

Sounds splendid! Good stuff Myth!

[skate]

I want to know why Mythrandir wasn't hosting TWL.

[Annux]

Re: TWT News

Originally posted by Mythrandir




- Every squad, be it in TWL or not, can play TWT games.

[Epinephrine]

Myth,

Just a few things, please tell me if you don't understand what I'm asking for and you want me to be more clear.

1) You put that any squad (including TWL squads) can be in TWT right? So does that mean if a squad is in say TWT-D and TWLD, then they are there purely for the automated hosting of practice matches? And when you decide who rises up to TWL obviously these squads are skipped over.

2) Since TWL squads can be in TWT, I suggest a solid roster system. Preferably part of the current TWLeagues.org website. That way you can minimize double squadding, so you don't have some players playing on another squad for TWT (to win games and raise their rankings) for the reason of getting their friends in TWL when that squad really doesn't deserve to get into TWL.

3) To clarify the practice bots:

Basically have 6 bots (2 for each type of league) in practice arenas full time. Something which won't keep record but will let squads run pracs (2on2, 3on3, 4on4, or whatever for TWLB) which might not feature full teams, or even have people from the same squad playing (i.e. a prac of mixed players). This idea would be similar to the practice bots which are in 'SSCE Dueling/League SVS'. This will let squads without mods run pracs without begging for an ER/Mod and wasting staff time. Also it will probably generate a lot of mixed pracs of players from different squads playing together and also, newer (singular) players can show off their goodness by playing with others in a less official environment.

5) There will be a website with full stats listed right? (preferably part of www.twleagues.org).

6) ELO system sounds good. Although perhaps you should have a clear explaination of it before putting it in so that people can at least see it and perhaps complain less when they see that their seeminly good record isn't beating someone with a seemingly worse record (who played harder teams).

-----

Finally, thank you for proposing (and I in 6-8 weeks, implementing) this system which has been badly needed and asked for since the early days of TWDL/TWBL You rock Myth!

-Epi

[Troll King]

I still don't like the initials.

[Mythrandir]

Originally posted by Epinephrine
Myth,

Just a few things, please tell me if you don't understand what I'm asking for and you want me to be more clear.

1) You put that any squad (including TWL squads) can be in TWT right? So does that mean if a squad is in say TWT-D and TWLD, then they are there purely for the automated hosting of practice matches? And when you decide who rises up to TWL obviously these squads are skipped over.

Yes, every squad may participate. And for the TWL squads it will mainly be for practices indeed. I'm thinking of showing 2 ladders, 1 without the TWL squads, 1 with the TWL squads.
Ofcourse it's up to the TWL staff to pick the squads who can participate, but it's no more than fair that they should pick the top TWT, non TWL, squads.

2) Since TWL squads can be in TWT, I suggest a solid roster system. Preferably part of the current TWLeagues.org website. That way you can minimize double squadding, so you don't have some players playing on another squad for TWT (to win games and raise their rankings) for the reason of getting their friends in TWL when that squad really doesn't deserve to get into TWL.

TWT and TWL will share the same roster system. I see no reason why not. The eligibility time of TWL and TWT might be different though. So TWL squads signed up now, don't have to re-signup for TWT.

3) To clarify the practice bots:

Basically have 6 bots (2 for each type of league) in practice arenas full time. Something which won't keep record but will let squads run pracs (2on2, 3on3, 4on4, or whatever for TWLB) which might not feature full teams, or even have people from the same squad playing (i.e. a prac of mixed players). This idea would be similar to the practice bots which are in 'SSCE Dueling/League SVS'. This will let squads without mods run pracs without begging for an ER/Mod and wasting staff time. Also it will probably generate a lot of mixed pracs of players from different squads playing together and also, newer (singular) players can show off their goodness by playing with others in a less official environment.

There are some issues with this.
1. (at least) the first week the practice bot can only be activated by staff. This is to make sure that the bot is running well. We don't want a bug that the tw community can exploit to crash all TWBots, do we?
2. The practice bot can run in 2 modes: one where one squad plays versus another and one where the host specifies the captains of a team, and the captains pick the rest of their team. The problem with the latter one is that the captains might want to piss eachother off, and pick players which were meant to be picked by the first captain. But I have yet to find out whether this is really a problem for us, or that it just wastes available playing time for other squads.

5) There will be a website with full stats listed right? (preferably part of www.twleagues.org).

yes, I have no idea when it will be completely finished. Because 100% detailed stat listings isn't a top priority. Ofcourse it will show ladder scores, and recently played games + outcomes.

6) ELO system sounds good. Although perhaps you should have a clear explaination of it before putting it in so that people can at least see it and perhaps complain less when they see that their seeminly good record isn't beating someone with a seemingly worse record (who played harder teams).

Good idea. When we've figured out a good rating system, it will be published, preferredly on a separate page at the website.

Finally, thank you for proposing (and I in 6-8 weeks, implementing) this system which has been badly needed and asked for since the early days of TWDL/TWBL You rock Myth!
-Epi

Thanks
It's a rather short time, 6-8 weeks. But if I keep continue working on it at the speed I do know (3-4 hours a day), then I will finish it in time.

[Witness]

um one comment

Hows this going to keep people from double squading?

And can i keep a name on twl squad.
and use a different name for twt?

OOOoooo..

Witty

[Tobe]

Chat

There should be a chat with say, 2 reps from each squad. That way if they have enough on for a base match they can go "Any squad got enough for a base match?" on the chat.

[stuckup]

Re: Chat

Originally posted by Tobe
There should be a chat with say, 2 reps from each squad. That way if they have enough on for a base match they can go "Any squad got enough for a base match?" on the chat.

That whould be tight as hell!

[Epinephrine]

Originally posted by Mythrandir

Yes, every squad may participate. And for the TWL squads it will mainly be for practices indeed. I'm thinking of showing 2 ladders, 1 without the TWL squads, 1 with the TWL squads.
Ofcourse it's up to the TWL staff to pick the squads who can participate, but it's no more than fair that they should pick the top TWT, non TWL, squads.

Eeek I don't think I was too clear cause I forgot some details.

For instance, if say uh.. whiterabbits wanted to play in jav league. They are not in TWLJ so they would have to qualify for it from TWT-J. Then whiterabbits (a TWL squad) manages to place as #1. Would they get the first spot to join TWLJ or would the next squad down (which wasn't involved in TWL at all) be bumped up to TWLJ?

Basically I'm asking how will it work for squads which aren't already part of the other TWL leagues (but are in at least one of them) to join the others.

Thanks,
-Epi

[Tobe]

And stuckup u need a colon b4 ur name in ur sig.