Next League

[mean gene]

5k towards a dev team to switch us to assssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss

[PrOnEsSim]

So Top 10 makes money? how will it work?

[Poseidon]

Along Capes suggestion... similar to pub, the only way this TSL seems like it could be any fun is if it uses... **ATTACH MODE**

btw my idea of people making new maps and then playing real base games in then, ie. not pub games, sounds much better than this TSL

[Poseidon]

also i just saw MEAN GENES post and I agree 10000000% with it

unless Poid's QuantumSpace is going to be making its grand debut this millennium, ASSS should be the priority if someone most wants to help the zone with financial resources. So so many good things could come from it. Its that or throw $5k away on a league which half of its own participants (ie the basers) dislike

[warbirdmaster#1]

If someone wants to put up $5000 USD for the game, it's their choice what they want to spend it on. I personally have not played TSL so I don't know what flaws you guys encountered in previous seasons. I'm sure whoever is hosting will have a decent plan on doing this. It is going to be very exciting to see many older players come back for this. TW BACK 2020

[Gkyde1234]

the only people who complain about tsl are scrubs who can't carry 6*s

[qan]

For TSL to work, we need to carefully rethink the algorithms and their intent.

S1 and 2 worked because they produced high-quality matchups most of the time (despite not running on a more advanced algorithm for picking basing teams, such as Rab's).

I think we need to focus less on creating even teams, which was the intent in later seasons, and which worked to the detriment of high-level play. A certain threshold can be established to allow somewhat unbalanced teams with the focus of grouping the highest level players together.

The success of that approach depends greatly on having accurate ratings. Ratings can adjust somewhat on the fly based on personal performance but more importantly, team performance. But we'd need to have a team of reasonably objective raters working on it, manually adjusting, and starting ratings would need to be as accurate as possible from the first game played. For base to work, we'd also probably need to go back to having ratings in all three basing ships.

For scoring, it seems that winning as a team needs to be prioritized far more than personal performance. Arguably, the only thing that should really matter is how often your team wins. If you post strong personal stats but your team consistently loses, that style of play should not be rewarded. The biggest flaw in TSL seems to have been in focusing so heavily on personal stats, which skews how one plays quite a bit. Something to consider: if your team loses, should you be able to count that score? A possible solution is to require all scores only to count if they are also team wins. And then reducing the number of games that count toward your score.

Monitoring for and removing game-throwing trolls is also necessary. Perhaps best to be quite proactive there and not so cautious. Toxic players need to be removed quickly.

Base is another thing entirely, and needs careful consideration and testing. I think implementing Rab's algorithm or something similar to it would be key to making sure that base is successful. The algorithm needs to properly emulate how real captains would make strategic picks based on the other cap's choices. Selecting a basing team is a game in and of itself. Delaying running TSL basing games until this is properly implemented may be wise.

[viop11]

"On a personal note I also need a break, I was lucky to be on really good twdt games in back2back seasons, so made a lot of deep playoff runs, then decided to start praccing for twlb after I was convinced to join a very 'serious' contender, which means as euro a lot of night games during my regular workweek (no corona effect for me). So I fully agree with Rab, let's do something a bit more 'chill'. A TSL or twdt league would be perfect for me."

do u realize how incredibly soft needing a break becuz twl is 2 intense for u is? if u cant stay up cuz of wirk thats 1 thing, but if twl is stressing u out/too srs to the point you need a fkin break thats fkd. THE FK IS THAT? ALLOW TESTICILS! I DUNNO HOW GROWN MEN LET FREE VIDEO GAME COMPETITION ONCE A WEEK EFFECT THEM TO THE POINT THAT THEY NEED A FKIN BREAK OR A "CHILL" LEAGUE. CILM THE FK DIWN

[Jessup]

For TSL to work, we need to carefully rethink the algorithms and their intent.

S1 and 2 worked because they produced high-quality matchups most of the time (despite not running on a more advanced algorithm for picking basing teams, such as Rab's).

I think we need to focus less on creating even teams, which was the intent in later seasons, and which worked to the detriment of high-level play. A certain threshold can be established to allow somewhat unbalanced teams with the focus of grouping the highest level players together.

The success of that approach depends greatly on having accurate ratings. Ratings can adjust somewhat on the fly based on personal performance but more importantly, team performance. But we'd need to have a team of reasonably objective raters working on it, manually adjusting, and starting ratings would need to be as accurate as possible from the first game played. For base to work, we'd also probably need to go back to having ratings in all three basing ships.

For scoring, it seems that winning as a team needs to be prioritized far more than personal performance. Arguably, the only thing that should really matter is how often your team wins. If you post strong personal stats but your team consistently loses, that style of play should not be rewarded. The biggest flaw in TSL seems to have been in focusing so heavily on personal stats, which skews how one plays quite a bit. Something to consider: if your team loses, should you be able to count that score? A possible solution is to require all scores only to count if they are also team wins. And then reducing the number of games that count toward your score.

Monitoring for and removing game-throwing trolls is also necessary. Perhaps best to be quite proactive there and not so cautious. Toxic players need to be removed quickly.

Base is another thing entirely, and needs careful consideration and testing. I think implementing Rab's algorithm or something similar to it would be key to making sure that base is successful. The algorithm needs to properly emulate how real captains would make strategic picks based on the other cap's choices. Selecting a basing team is a game in and of itself. Delaying running TSL basing games until this is properly implemented may be wise.

Please just make it fair and transparent with all the ratings at the start and throughout the season to be reviewable for everyone to see. Also a huge part of making a good algorithm imo is a real time flexible rating change system that rewards wins AND stats together as the season progresses. The better a player does within this season should impact their rating. Making players stuck with a certain rating the entire season one person or a small group determines is too rigid and can be unfair. If a player is proving during the course of the season that they are having much bigger impacts on games than their rating shows by the stats they are putting up ..account and adjust for this. This is VERY important and how any human Captain would be reacting too.

Also the keeping the "Was Benched" feature prioritizing those who were benched the last game to be added in the following game is really important to keep things fair when it comes to participation. TSL's charm is its spirit of inclusiveness and making the best possible teams amongst EVERYONE who is involved,

Definitely monitor any game throwing trolls . Rage quitting being and purposely dying and throwing games should be the top priority to stop with sever penalties if anyone were to sadly do this type thing. A fresh set of rules being posted defining this and all other things related to this season would be great to see so everyone can be on the same page.

[Grasps]

I just feel TSL is a lot of work for minimal gain when there are so many other leagues that can be ran that require less work, are more balanced and most importantly; fun. TWD Cup, Basing Cup, TWDT, TWEL, TWL, ect.

[Spezza]

TSL brings out the worst in a lot of people (hk mentioned trolls but there was alot of ass behaviour from vets too). It's like when people are tryharding in elim, very few ppl are going to return for money from a league they don't know. There are so many better ways to waste 5k.

[SNOOPiE]

Add twbf to this League and it will be a instant success!

[Beast]

My vote is still on TWAL

[Nipple Nibbler]

Poseidon might be on to something with home and away games, maybe not for TSL but it would be kinda cool to try it in a DT or maybe even TWL.

[Poseidon]

i am just riffing on a "Gimmick League" HZ just finished or is still playing

They had 8 teams in a draft league and let each captain create custom rinks and use custom settings. this was mayb a lot easier with ASSS i dunno. Applying the idea to TW, i imagined it being a lot less "gimmicky" and keeping the same settings, but trying new maps for CTF style basing. Someone could even end up creating something that is more fun than TWs current 25 year old map, imagine that.