TWL 7 squads

[bloodzombie]

Originally posted by destroy
Uh, no?

It was proven by Light that any dueling/jav squad can win TWLB (that is, if they actually care enough for the league like fireballz did with Light). .

Everyone always seems to forget that light started as a dueling squad, but their top basing line was all old-school basers.

[apt]

The point is, basing is fucking easy. But, so is every other TW League.

TWLZ TRENCH WARS LEAGE ZOMBIES. THATS SKILL.

[demonfaze]

It's kinda hard not to team in base when you've got 16 people packed in a tiny flag room. Even if you're fighting in lower, everyone is pretty much going after the same thing, trying to kill the terr or killing whichever enemy is in the way. Even if one of your spiders happens to go stray off and gets teamed by a few enemies, it won't make any kind of impact on the game, he'll probably reattach right when the other spiders are getting back into the battle.

Also the sharks in the cram repping then dying, taking turns again and again, that doesn't take a lot of teamwork. You learn how to do it in a few seconds, then its just repetitive after that. Just as long as you don't die with all your reps. Protecting the terr is basic for sharks with reps or any ship, you basically detach from the terr and right then you're already protecting it by repping and killing whats infront of you. It's all just repetive, the craming, the fighting in lower, the flag room battles, you don't even really have to focus on teaming, its more about common sense. You're so packed together all the time that you're teaming whether you like it or not.

In TWLD and TWLJ its much easier to stray off from your teammates whether it be you weren't paying attention to where your teammates were, you went off chasing an enemy, or your teammates died around you and left you by yourself. In that case it actually does make a difference since every death matters in a wb or jav match (since you only get 10 of course). Also there is no attaching in both leagues, so in a jav match you have to fly your way back to base, while the teammates you left in base can be getting outnumbered, same as a wb match, you have to go thrust back to them to provide back up.

Not only that, in wb and jav matches you can lure for your teammates or use yourself as bait for your teammates. You can't just suicide by yourself because you can cost your team the win by dying out early. Also its not so very often that one person carries the entire team in a match, although it does happen at times. But its usually most of the team or at least 2-3 people carrying their own weight or over their own weight for the few people that may have choked, but not likely that 4 people will choke and 1 person goes 23-8 or something. WB and Jav you always have to keep any eye on your teammates to see if you can back them up in some way if they're in trouble or even help them chase an enemy who is scattered from his teammates. In jav you gotta be careful with tks and getting your teammates 2ferd or even 3ferd. In both wb and jav when your teammate is being chased around the map your team has to know where he is and help him as fast as they can before he dies. I can just keep going on...

I think TWLB teamwork is more of just a repetitive routine that you do over and over. TWLD and TWLJ involve much more chemistry, teamwork, and individual skill to win (against a skillful opponent of course)

Also about Light winning TWLB, and people saying they're old school basers and experienced. Just remember that most of that team were duelers first and still are, they never turned into pure basers or ever were. They all just happened to become really good at basing without having to put as much effort into it as pure basing squads do, because they were already talented duelers, an easy transfer over.

[Kim]

So for basing if...

-Your terr stays alive
-Sharks get off their reps without dying loaded with them
-Spiders are hitting stuff
-Javs and wbs are hitting stuff

You got yourself a winning game for basing.

Comparing strategies between basing and jav/wb, there is no question that the amount of fluctuation and almost instant strategy changes, as well as movement and aim, are all integral in dueling games rather than in basing. Sure basing requires teaming, but how hard is it to team with 7 other attack ships (granted your terr isn't aggressive). If you lose a flagroom fight, it's probably because a shark didn't use its reps, or some spiders were spawned, or someone tk'd. It's very mechanical if you ask me. You're most likely to take out the sharks first in a typical base fight, then go after the other ships. So ultimately, all your teammates will be shooting at the same people, and there's nothing the enemy can do about it. It's not like you can dodge away and regroup in that compact room (Not to mention its not too beneficial to fall back while your energy is low for spiders, rather than to do your all pushing forward). Plus in basing, you can't really tell who's doing the work for the team, as a player with low kills may have made extrodinary plays, while an MVP may have tk's or just camps for kills. In dueling, you either pull your weight or you don't, and it certainly shows. There is no avoiding it. Pull your weight or get subbed, its that simple. Aside from worrying about your own survival, you have to make sure your team has an edge on the teaming aspect, ensuring no one is outnumbered.

To add, I've always considered jav dueling having more in-depth gameplay than wbs just because teaming is seen more effective in javs.

The End.

[Stabwound]

Wow, can we not fucking talk about this again?

[Melufa]

SECONDED IN BIG TEXT BOLD

[Cig Smoke]

Demon they did start out as duelers, but they had experienced basers. The squad was named a "dueling" squad but they had guys who were pure basing. All mitch did was terr, all hannes did was shark. i can almost garentee there were more, but i dont know there roster offhand.

[Kim]

Demon was bringing up points, and wrote an essay, and somehow I HAD THE URGE for herbal

[death row]

Originally posted by Da1andonly
"LIGHT 4 TWL-D-J-B CHAMPIONS"

How did it go? Ahahaha.

Hi, Da1. Correct me if I'm wrong, but has Disoblige ever beaten Light in any league match before? I believe Light beat Diso in base and jav it's first season, then beat Diso in wb last season. I'm not trying to fight, just curious.

[Verthanthi]

whiterabbits was never beaten by light in base in a league match.

[Nickname]

I beat Siege in base 100k-0k (so easily too)

Demon is 100% right guys, no sense getting mad. Basing is the simplest league. To make a "good team" that could be in the fight for the title all you need is 5 duelers with good aim (spiders - perferably with svs experience) 2 really laggy guys (sharks, give them 15 minutes and they should be working perfectly together) and 1 guy who also lags but is smart and can dodge (your terrier).

not particularily hard. Go into chaos and find 7 guys who would be dedicated and you could train them into a title winning team within a few days, stick yourself in the terr and practice a bit. Cha-ching.

[Zerzera]

Originally posted by Randedl
you also dropped out of the league before it ended and made the first round or two of the playoffs alot less exciting.

But Spastic and Mambo didn't, (I didn't see a dissolving coming, and I thought the games we played were worth it) Paladen had to drop out because they couldn't compete, and NS couldn't compete at all. And don't forget Cripples.
It is unlikely this season, but even squads that made playoffs can fall back into a worthless squad.
Cutting down spots if there are enough squads to fill them -even if you don't think they're competative enough is, in my opinion, not needed. First of all because it's hard to judge other squads (again, some people didn't think Spastic would make leagues, yet they won it) Let more people enjoy leagues if it's possible.
You just have more games, and some of them will be a walkover.

Originally posted by Randedl

when a new idea comes up, so many people are quick to object because it wouldn't benefit them directly.

if your only argument against 3 league squads is that "my squad couldn't play", shut up.

Squads form easily, basingsquads seem more stabile than duelsquads. But if you would make pure 3-league squads, a lot of squads now will dissolve and new ones will form.
If your only argument for 3 league squads is that you like to compete in all 3, shut up.
I see no need in playing in 3 leagues, and at the moment I see no reason why I would have to squad up with (or recruit) duelists or javelins. Every sport has his own teams.

Originally posted by Randedl
and if in fact there is going to be a 4 spid max in lb, it's no longer just about the spiders shark and terr. can rb bring a solid jav or wb? maybe they should show it first.

Just because 5 spiders are most of the time stronger than 4 spiders, doesn't mean 4 v 4 spiders and a different ship will make such an upset. I bet RB can bring 4 more than solid spiders and a reasonable jav or warbird to match.
Or in other words, I don't think that bringing the number of spiders down will make much of a difference to most squads.

[bloodzombie]

Originally posted by Nickname
not particularily hard. Go into chaos and find 7 guys who would be dedicated and you could train them into a title winning team within a few days, stick yourself in the terr and practice a bit. Cha-ching.

I'm not even kidding when I say that I'll bet you $100 that you can't do this. (and yes, I'll have a mod check to make sure they're not just aliases.)

[geekbot]

I know this is pointless but I couldn't resist. 5 things you need to know in basing that you don't in duelling:

1. Shark's rep width
2. Shark's splash damage
3. Jav's splash damage and effect on many different kinds of ships
4. Spider's rate of recharge/cost of bullets (managing energy)
5. Flying a terrier (bursts/portals/moving a team)

Javing in base is very different because of the close proximity (not TKing) and knowing the recharge rates of all the different ships (will you kill/TK that ship at the rate they are firing, etc).

All of these things can be found in svs but it will take time to adjust to TW settings and using specialized ships in our maps.

[Nickname]

Originally posted by bloodzombie
I'm not even kidding when I say that I'll bet you $100 that you can't do this. (and yes, I'll have a mod check to make sure they're not just aliases.)

I'm not exactly at the time in my life where i want to waste time finding the key component - 7 guys who would be commited - thats the hard part.

But don't even pretend i'm wrong. What did Light do? they broguht a bunch of guys who didn't know jack and stuck them in spiders, got a well trained guy in terr (so he didn't need to train anymore) and took possibly the laggiest person in the zone (second laggiest) and stuck him in shark. They actually stuck the laggiest person in a jav, but this is all precram days.

the seasona fter that Elusive did the same thing. Granted they didn't try as hard at doing it but they stuck the same thing in the same places. Rampage did the same thing (ramp is probably the best example) took 2 laggy people in sharks, 5 duelers/chaos people in spiders. The problem with rampage was that they never bothered to train there terr's to a decent level, they just kinda through them out there, thats why the crumbled (that and sudden likes ot have his team choke)