TWDT Hot or Not -- Finals Edition

[Jones]

i like adding the idea of a much larger range for ratings and enforcing a sort of total team cap rule.

this

[Zeebu]

and ogron, to combat mid season improvement (or failure) from misrated folks, i wonder if we could have a midseason re-rate. or even piggybacking on this TSL league a weekly rerate (with a cap on the amount a person can change weekly) based on some sort of automatic system. for wb/jav at least that seems possible. basing would be way tougher.

spitballing here. i do not understand how much work that would entail

i would be willing to sit down and discuss some formulas on how this could be achieved though. i do not know how to program bots though, so that part is not in my skillset.

[Major Crisis]

Claus, I did understand why I was an 8 in base, just because it seemed that TW lacked terrs. But I have seen the reason "you can play all three ships" passing by.. While before this TWDT season I havent touched spider in a competitive match for years, dont think I even touched it in TWL/TWDT, still have problems going even... Shark same thing, but I played it some for Sage in TWL.. That with me being total inactive right before TWDT started, I could have also understand if I was a 7..

But my main problem with my ratings was my jav rating. How can you rate someone who has only gone once positive last season and never in TWLJ an 8? The only assumption I can make, it was because of Envy, since Geio and kado also got rated 8. We won a lot because of our teaming and lack of competition in twd. Besides that there were 42 javs who got rated 8 or higher. Thats way too much for 6 teams (18 spots), like half of them were 8's (27).. In wb's its 36 people, 18 of them are 9 or 10. This means that some teams even had 4 people as 9 or 10 for those spots..
As someone stated before, 8's get benched a lot in both jav and wb matches. I would recommend making wb and jav like 6, 7 and 8 star needed in line up.
Back to the javelin ratings. How can someone give Kim, revered and ro a 8. While you also rate people like me, Fork, kado and hellkite an 8. No way those people are the same level. Ofcourse there are some mismatched ratings in a season, but it feels like this season had a lot.

If you look at the base ratings, you will only see 48 8+ people. I say only, because if you compare this to the wb/jav leagues its ridicilous. Especially if you consider that Terrorist, Power and Brexit are together responsible for 28 of the people. And to make it more amazing, there are 60 7+ people. The chances you get play time as a 7 is ridicilous low as you can see. I am leaving out the fact that many of all those numbers didnt show at all.



Something I would like to see is changing up the order of divisions that get played. Why do we have basing as last? We all know most of the europeans that are left do base, while of all the wbs 99% is north american or british. I would consider getting javs done first, then base and end with wbs. If I remember from TWL, most of the wb games got played at 5 pm. (when ppl actually scheduled it themself). While twlj got played at the 'early' hours.
Besides that often I see specfreqs quite active on the wb/jav games, while on the base games many people logged off. Atleast that happened on Alf this season.. People tend to get bored if they have to stay in spec. I can totally understand they dont want to wait for 2 hours to finally get to play in base, especially if you arent even sure you will play. Get basing in the middle, because it's also the league that has the biggest chance of going out of time. I mean if a wb game starts at 5:10, you will still be done at 5:35. Especially around playoffs its much better in my opinion. WB and jav games are much faster.

[Major Crisis]

And please get balanced caps next season.
Dreamwin and Zidane both had a huge advantage, because they both already had a high star for both jav and base. While Ogron and Attacks only had one for a league.. Then we had Jessup which had none. And delectable had none either, cuz he didnt tend to play himself at all, he felt that was his duty as captain.
With other words, DW and Zid were always a step ahead of the other teams. Attacks picked a great team, but Ogron and Jessup had the need of stacking one league from the beginning, because of the late picking places and the lack of being multishippers like both named guys.
So either get 6 people of top level, or get 6 people from a decent level.

[Rab]

A few thoughts based on what MC said:
- I agree MC got fucked by the star system, seems quite obvious and should have been adjusted.
- The basing rosters tend to be colored to show what ship you play. I usually get colored green because I mostly spider. However... I'd say I'm an 8* terr and 7* shark, it would be good if that was displayed somehow.
- I also would prefer if basing was not last. I would prefer wb last because that's the one I least care about.
- I agree about balanced caps, Zid's team has an instant advantage over Jessup's team. I know we don't have the luxury of choosing caps, but maybe we can factor in the cap's rating somehow.

[Omega Red]

Rab has 100% correct.

Rating players in basing based on ship would be more accurate. Basing should not be a blanket rating since we all know that every ship is 100% different and just cause you are an 8 star spider, doesn't mean you are a 8 star terrier.

I'm aware that this will add some complexity to the ratings and drafting but this will benefit everybody overall and would allow captains to experiment more with their roster.

I predict that this will eventually push more of the shitty "names" out of starting lineups but i think with accurate ship ratings, the level of play might only be slightly higher.

[Rab]

It adds complexity to the game too.
Imagine I'm 8* spider and 7* shark. I get added as shark, as the only 7*. A switch could invalidate the lineup.

I'd settle for just showing that I could also terr and shark, even if there's only one star rating overall.

[zidane]

to be fair i was begged to cap cause not enough people volunteered and I was last pick in Free agency while people got to pick Ease/24/lasenza/stayon. The top players in FA would have all been first round picks so this was a pretty big disadvantage.

Not to mention I try to win all 3 leagues while half the caps stack 1 league.

I do agree with major crisis if those #s are true then there was definitely too many 8* javs, however part of this is because jav is by far the most active league in tw and has been for at least 5-6 years. so if we lower a bunch of the 8s it will be a bunch of 7s fighting for 1 of 1 spot instead of fighting for 1 of 3.

I think the best way to fix this is implementing ratings with decimals, so say like 6 or so people make the ratings and then it becomes their average.

IE: Major crisis gets rated 7.7 in jav, and is allowed to jav in the 7* slot. this would make people who get rated like 7.9 op as hell and make the draft more interesting also

[ogron]

We could look into an overall star cap limit (per league). We'll see. I think centigrade or adding .5s is definitely happening, to improve ratings further.

And you're giving Dreamwin too much credit, he has never gone for 3 leagues. He only goes for jav/base, and through an extraordinary set of circumstances, incredibly soft matchups, and no shows did he reach TWDT-D Final (look at his lines, they feature anywhere between 0-1 actual WBs and 4 euros on 4000 reso straying). He picked the same amount of WBs this year as he does every year except those circumstances didn't occur and he went 0-10 in TWDT-D.

Zidane, Attacks, Hulk, Commodo, Ease and others have been more ambitious. I'm not criticizing him because I've never been overly ambitious myself, but he has not gone for 3 leagues ever, despite being a two-leaguer and consistently having great draft position.

The rewards are bigger for those to dream big (double and triple crowns), but so is the fall (Power Triple Frown 2015).

TBH I really like what Attacks has managed as a 1-leaguer. A bit lucky having Ease fall into his lap both FAs and rounding out his lines, but he has done some great work.

I've tried to help those lesser caps by re-structuring the Free Agency draft with the 3-tier system, and it seems to have helped. Zidane and Dreamwin howled at the moon at their #5 and #6 FA draft positions and were unhappy with their haul, but they still managed to both make multiple finals, so I think it's an effective tool without robbing them of the chance to get the #1 or #2 pick in the main draft or their ability to triple crown. Jessup got 24 and Lasenza, Attacks got Ease, I got Spezza, and delectable got Stayon in the FA, which really helped bolster those teams and close the gap a bit between them and Zidane/Dreamwin.

The ideal would be caps having to draft themselves, but probably not a realistic prospect at this point, and they've resisted it in the past.

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Adjusting ratings mid-season is not going to happen.

You're punishing captains for good picks, and screwing up their lineups that they've started through half the year.

It's a bad idea that you guys have not thought through.

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TSL looks at your actual ship in base in both sorting and rating, and the former will be adjusted mid-season. It's different because we're not punishing a team/captain by doing that.

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It's possible we could do is per-ship in TWDT-B in terms of ratings, but I'd have to discuss programming bots and it would be a huge overhaul. That is definitely in the MAYBE category. It would have to be the bot, because asking caps to keep track of 3 separate ratings per player mid-game during switches and changes and subs would be asking too much.

100% bot dependent.

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Base is last because the population is at it's smallest at 3pm EST, and grows to its largest at 5pm EST. It improves shows and the league, and reduces forfeits.

You all seem to have extremely short memories -- TWDT used to be a rotating schedule, and every 3pm EST base game was dogshit and resulted in tons of forfeits. It was so bad in 2013 that K A N E had to run a poll and then changed it to a static schedule.

That is not changing.

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[Rab]

Just to be clear, I wasn't asking for per-ship ratings in base, I was asking for the color to not be only green when I can also terr and shark.
I think the color influences what the captains pick you for, e.g. this season I mostly spidered but should have terred for ALF.

[kess]

Just to be clear, I wasn't asking for per-ship ratings in base, I was asking for the color to not be only green when I can also terr and shark.
I think the color influences what the captains pick you for, e.g. this season I mostly spidered but should have terred for ALF.

I dont think it influences much tbh, captains or ppl helping with draft/FA, should be able to know in what ships each player can be good in basing. This all stems to the captain quality thing, every captain should be a garanteed starter type player, usually with alot of years of twl.

[Major Crisis]

to be fair i was begged to cap cause not enough people volunteered and I was last pick in Free agency while people got to pick Ease/24/lasenza/stayon. The top players in FA would have all been first round picks so this was a pretty big disadvantage.

Not to mention I try to win all 3 leagues while half the caps stack 1 league.

I do agree with major crisis if those #s are true then there was definitely too many 8* javs, however part of this is because jav is by far the most active league in tw and has been for at least 5-6 years. so if we lower a bunch of the 8s it will be a bunch of 7s fighting for 1 of 1 spot instead of fighting for 1 of 3.

I think the best way to fix this is implementing ratings with decimals, so say like 6 or so people make the ratings and then it becomes their average.

IE: Major crisis gets rated 7.7 in jav, and is allowed to jav in the 7* slot. this would make people who get rated like 7.9 op as hell and make the draft more interesting also

Stayon was a great pick indeed.

[Turban]

there was a point in time where I secretly wished to take over and be in charge of ALF during the earlier parts of regular season in the hopes of salvaging our season. unfortunately our first pick in the free agency was wasted on a player who was known not to show after a week and that ended up being the final nail in the coffin.

congratulations to all the winners nonetheless even though I did not enjoy the league format that was used this season.

[kess]

Stayon was a great pick indeed.

:laugh:

[Attacks]

Can we not just do this, warbird/jav one 6 star one 7 star one 8 and two 9+, and for base one 6 two 7s one 8 and the rest 9-10s? Least then the 8s wont be left out? Seems simple to me maybe im not spotting something