Next League

[afghan]

The usual post to get people thinking about next league since people are being eliminated…

im sure there’s already been talks but just to make it semi-official, any word?

[ogron]

Basing Cup would hit the spot.

TWLB (and the last Basing Cup with 4 teams) are maybe a little too exclusive, and TWDT-B with star cap is too watered down. A 6-team Basing Cup would find the right balance between good competition, fun, and inclusivity.

You could expand the Cups to Warbird and Javelin, each separate cups with no relationship to each other in terms of draft, with 3 showrunners each running one league.

Run games tuesdays, thursdays, and sundays. The weekday games give more players a chance to participate. Everyone active auto-signed up like last Basing Cup, unless you specifically opt-out (people say they won't play but everyone ends up showing for Semis and Finals anyway). Everyone makes the playoffs so the weekday games don't screw euros over. The incentive for winning games is you get to pick your opponents as the higher seed, which is valuable.

You could finish the whole thing before Christmas.

4 contenders, 8 teams (TWLB)
6 contenders, 6 teams (Basing Cup)
8 contenders, 10 teams (TWDT-B)

[Mythril]

T S L

Bring back the death threats and toxicity. This new era is not ready.

[Sprackle]

pictionary!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Turban]

We should host Distension as a competitive league while we're at it.

In all seriousness I will probably wait until the next competitive league is announced. I would personally prefer some short variant of TWL sometime early next year. You could host a smaller tournament or league during November - December period to keep the zone somewhat active.

[RageRitual]

I never did get to play this TSL everyone keeps talking about

I also keep seeing people wanting to take the * cap out of DT. Maybe having the basingcup once a year is good middle ground for this.

+1 for either of these ideas.

[Dennys]

Just let me know the season schedule.

*opens up StreamLabs*

[Dwopple]

If TWL is next-next, then the next league **should** be something with some "stacking limits"

[Vehicle]

I like Ogron's idea even though I don't understand how teams are made as a fun competitive option that also boosts activity.

Should do another DT season after that.

I'm sure it'll inevitably be TWL, though and I would recommend something slightly different that would basically amount to TWL-lite:

• TWD = Qualifying for TWL
• You could still have Sunday games that are worth like 200 points or something during the late TWD season
• Straight from TWD to the quarter or semi finals

Remember when the worst squads were weeded out because they didn't qualify via-TWD? The top TWD squads were also usually the best squads. This approach basically turns TWD into TWL's regular season.

And to Dwopple's point, good luck. It'll become an asterisk season and people will cry the whole time.

[Dreamwin]

I like Ogron's idea even though I don't understand how teams are made as a fun competitive option that also boosts activity.

Should do another DT season after that.

I'm sure it'll inevitably be TWL, though and I would recommend something slightly different that would basically amount to TWL-lite:

• TWD = Qualifying for TWL
• You could still have Sunday games that are worth like 200 points or something during the late TWD season
• Straight from TWD to the quarter or semi finals

Remember when the worst squads were weeded out because they didn't qualify via-TWD? The top TWD squads were also usually the best squads. This approach basically turns TWD into TWL's regular season.

And to Dwopple's point, good luck. It'll become an asterisk season and people will cry the whole time.

This would probably end up decreasing TWD activity. Squads would refuse to play one another without top lines and borrowing would be off-limits I suppose? The times were good 15 years ago but there is no way back with this population. Sorry to be pessimist but that is how it would roll out.

[Vehicle]

This would probably end up decreasing TWD activity. Squads would refuse to play one another without top lines and borrowing would be off-limits I suppose? The times were good 15 years ago but there is no way back with this population. Sorry to be pessimist but that is how it would roll out.

Good point about borrows. I suppose I would still allow them but their TWD rank would play into points gained or lost from W/L.

And good point about top line too, I thought about, I just think if we make it like 6 weeks long it would only be a problem in last couple of weeks.

Here's the bare truth: TWL is only fun for 50% of the people who play in it. And even then, those 50% of players bitch about half their games. Nothing will be different from last season, talent here is pooled like Pangea.

If you're going to have TWL, why not just start at the playoffs? Could we not of predicted them last season before it even started?

[ogron]

If you're going to have TWL, why not just start at the playoffs? Could we not of predicted them last season before it even started?

Turban had the right idea TWL 2020. 5 week regular season, then straight to Semi-Finals.

New ops for TWL 2021 ignored Turb's work and multiple veterans urging them to keep the season short, and made it 17 years long, and the zone died hard for 6 months.

I agree that the Quarter-Finals shouldn't be bothered with, as typically there are 3-4 contenders, although TWLB the last two years has been remarkably strong. Accuracy as the 5th place team in 2021 beat Strike and Pandora, and Spastic in 2020 as the 5th place team had Zizu/JAMAL/Fermata/Stayon/Cripple/WBM/Jurassic/Undercut/Lupin and the final week saw a play-in game that decided whether Fire or Spastic made the playoffs behind Gun, Plade, and Pandora.

So the QF would not have been/was not pointless. But for the sake of brevity and a quick turnaround to TWDT, I agree that the QF should be abandoned.

Here's the bare truth: TWL is only fun for 50% of the people who play in it. And even then, those 50% of players bitch about half their games. Nothing will be different from last season, talent here is pooled like Pangea.

That's your opinion. TWL brings back veterans like Rough and others who only play TWDT if TWL is around. TWL is good for the zone in that it motivates and brings back top players, who then play in other leagues. It's bad in that it kills the zone several weeks in. The key is to have TWL once a year, but keep it very short. TWL 2020 is the blueprint.

There are players on non-contenders who enjoy the challenge, get to play with their friends, showcase their skills to contenders for the next season. What might not be fun for you is fun for them. And if there's 8 teams and 4 contenders, nearly half the matches should be non-contender vs. non-contender and competitive. Top teams also often don't show, don't bring their A game, and bench players against non-contenders, and there's enough TWL finals caliber players on those teams to win, so you end up with plenty of quality, playable games that are not blowouts.

It's also a proving ground against top-level competition that you're not going to get in TSL, TWDT, or TWD. What happens when there's nobody on the other team you can exploit, everyone's elite, it's a must-win TWL final with 100+ people watching, you won't get another chance for a year (if ever), and fingers get sweaty? That's what TWL is about, and eliminating that would be a huge loss. It's the premiere league of the zone for a reason.

While I prefer star slot TWDT (2012-2018) over TWL in terms of fun, star cap TWDT (2019-present) re-introduces previously fixed issues, and you're at the complete mercy of low-stars going 2-10 every game, particularly if you're a 10* and don't have the luxury of being in a 9/8/8/8/8 type line. Star slot TWDT had the key feature of setting a baseline of competence, where your worst player goes 7-10 on average instead of 3-10. Until something is done about the flaws in this system, TWL (and Cups) are the only refuge from having your season wasted despite going 16-10 every game because your low-stars can't hang in a league match.

[ogron]

Vehicle i also took 5 minutes to look at the TWL vs. TWDT discreptancy in base (if any), to see if there is a significant difference in how many games are competitive.



The seven teams in TWLB (excluding Juice, which was a disaster with apt's mismanagement and quitting) had 31 competitive games, or around 60%, with an average of 8.6 minutes won on the losing side. TWDT-B had 31 competitive games, or around 65%, with an average of 8.5 minutes won on the losing side.

TWLB had significantly more 15-14 games, while TWDT-B had more 15-9 to 15-11 games.

Overall, however, there's little difference in the amount of competitive games between TWL and TWDT in base.

Contenders play contenders in close matches, non-condenders play non-contenders in close matches, and contenders bench/don't show/don't bring their A-game against non-contenders half the time, meaning you end up with the same amount of competitive, playable games as draft leagues.

[Vehicle]

TWL is good for the zone in that it motivates and brings back top players, who then play in other leagues. It's bad in that it kills the zone several weeks in. The key is to have TWL once a year, but keep it very short.

Agreed.

Just keep it short. 8 weeks is reasonable.

Then we only have to deal with about 4 months where no one plays the game. Then we can have TWDT. Lather, rinse, repeat.

[PrOnEsSim]

Down to cap Heroes once again! HEROES 2021.