Canada VS America

[Cops]

I don't udnerstand examples?

But if money is all you care for, then stop paying your taxes, and move elsewhere (e.g. the US).

Not only does this not make sense because I'd still pay to live in the U.S, but it seems like an indirect attack at America because you related it to a country -where I could possibly go if all I cared about was money. Why do you still profess this wasn't a bad example? why do you still spout of opinions and call them facts? why do you try to explain France's in acceptance of Quebec's singers to be completely related to France's lack of external media - without any other facts other than a bias article from a Quebec media outlet?

Of course I'm going to take offense to you saying I can't grasp a French movie that was changed into English that played off on it's narrative form but failed terribly. The production was shit, and the characterization was less than impressive. This movie wasn't groundbreaking, nor would I even consider it an art form. Even the entertainment value of this movie sucked, I didn't expect it to meet any of my other standards but it didn't even amuse me.

In 10 of these municipalities, francophones represented more than 81.4% of the municipality's total population, which was the proportion of francophones in the province of Quebec. Of this group of 10, eight were in New Brunswick and two in Ontario.

-http://www12.statcan.ca/english/census01/products/analytic/companion/lang/subprovs.cfm

Five municipalities accounted for just over 40% of Ontario's francophone population: Ottawa, with 124,800 francophones; Greater Sudbury with 45,475; Toronto with 38,100

-http://www12.statcan.ca/english/cens...g/subprovs.cfm

Toronto's Population - 2,503,281

-http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toronto

Sudbury's Population - 157,857

-http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greater_Sudbury

Anglophones, those individuals who reported English as their mother tongue, represented the majority of Canadians.

-http://www12.statcan.ca/english/cens...ang/canada.cfm

Francophones accounted for 28.9% of the population of the census metropolitan area of Greater Sudbury in Ontario, the highest rate outside Quebec.

I could see a venue for French in Sudbury but as far as Toronto goes I don't see any. And the statistics don't show one either.

The 2001 Census showed that 22.0% of the population spoke French most often at home at the time of the census, slightly lower than the 22.9% who reported it as their mother tongue.

The proportion of the population that spoke English most often at home, 67.5%, was appreciably higher than the proportion whose mother tongue was English (59.1%). This was due to the attraction of English for members of other language groups. Even in Quebec, where anglophones represent a minority, the same situation prevails.

-http://www12.statcan.ca/english/cens...ang/canada.cfm

[Cops]

French isn't being spoken as often, English is on the rise and francophone's even those who claim it to be their mother tongue don't speak it as often. A small city in Ontario has a larger French population than our major city, not including the biggest cities that surround Toronto ie Mississauga, Hamilton, Brampton etc.

French isn't being used by the people who claim it to be their mother tongue nor is it being used as often as English (in fact English is on the rise) so I think the argument about why are we pumping money into a system where people generally don't use the language is a valid argument.

[Hakaku]

I don't quite understand what you're trying to debate by showing me population statistics; what it tells me, is that the population of French speaking people is only ~38 100 in Toronto (dismissing people [students, tourists, other] who just visit Toronto - I'm not claiming this is of significant importance, but the Franco-Ontarien theatres, centers, the Office of Francophone Affairs, media such as newspapers or radio, and other such things in Toronto are of importance to the rest of the Franco-Ontarian community)

If the point is to back up the fact that teaching French in school costs the government billions of dollars [uncited] to provide that education to students in English schools; then I already stated that this debate will end up no where, since it's not my decision, so debating about this subject here will end up no where. If it bothers you so much, get involved, contact your local school boards and ask questions about 'why', or become active in politics and change the education for the kids of the future.

At the current rate, Canadians pay far higher tax on many more things than Americans do, something that is more noticeable with a currency rate almost 1$=1$, so you'd not only benefit money-wise*, but you wouldn't have to pay for French courses in school.

(*Note: I already stated this was an arrogant comment on my part. -- I re-explain this whole statement because you constantly think I'm anti-american for your own personal reasons. Since I'm not, then of course I'll defend myself.)

French may not be used as much, because the de facto language of Ontario is English. But neither linguistic groups have seen a decrease in population, if anything the number of speakers who speak both languages has increased compared to the number of speakers who claimed French as their mother tongue. - Education plays an important role on bilingualism, and provides better opportunities to those who are bilingual.
Statistics on Official languages in Ontario
Bilingualism in Canada (includes controversies)
Culture and Community - bilingualism in Ontario's schools (indepth pdf file)

[Pummel]

..

STFU WITH SPAMf

[Money]

lol hakaku, since when do americans not pay taxes?

[Cops]

French isn't being spoken as much as it used to be, that's exactly what those statistics show. Even in Quebec people are using less French, let alone all across Canada. If people aren't generally using the language then why the fuck are we paying for kids to learn it?

It's all about preservation of the language, it's not realistic. Everything French related is funded by the Quebec government as a means of preservation, like I said there's no real market for it in Toronto or much of Ontario.

After reading your article I've pulled out a few things -

the current curriculum fails to consistently graduate bilingual students

Low enrollment, the difficulties of student retention, assimilation

Basically that talks about the flaws of the system, which is exactly what I was talking about, how the current system is useless and that students generally do not retain any of the language after high school. Thank you for doing my work for me.


I'll wrap this up cause you guys are probably getting sick of this

If you believe spending Billions of Dollars teaching children a language that as your article states is 'flawed' and has little results then I think you suck with money. French is on the decline and every crappy French outlet in Ontario is fully funded from the Quebec government as a means of preservation, nothing more, nothing less. Why are we helping preserve a language from a group of people who want to be disassociated with Canada, I think paying Billions of dollars into the French program is enough for Quebec to realize that at least we're trying to help preserve your language, yet close to 50% of the population still wants to be shut off from Canada. It's like giving your kid a chocolate bar and then getting smacked in the face cause he wanted two.

I have this fuck you attitude because I quite simply do not see the results, the benefits, the increased level in the language being spoken, the overall want from people to learn the language, your report and my statcan statics's pretty much prove that. I'm not a conservative but I'll admit fiscal conservatism is a great idea, let's be responsible and actually see the results from things like these.

[Hakaku]

lol hakaku, since when do americans not pay taxes?

Pay less* taxes than Canadians do

Anyhow, agreed with Cops' last bolded comment :P