Muslim Demographics

[Money]

is that pau gasol

[Exalt]

[TagMor]

You can kong all you want.
It just further proves my argument has merit, and Islam is a violent and oppressive religion that has no place in the 21st century.

[Noah]

[DankNuggets]

The Looney Tunes and MJ will still form a team. But the space aliens will probably just kill them instead of playing by the rules.

[X`terrania]

[PUNK rock]

[PH]

[PUNK rock]

[PH]

[PUNK rock]

[PH]

enough is enough

[genocidal]

I'm not exactly sure why I thought I would get into a discussion with TagMor about Islam. I was wrong.

[gran guerrero]

Yes tagmor, shit still does exist, I didn't say it's gone, I said it's losing its strength.

People over are much larger in numbers, the people who are victimized are usually singled out because they have no one to support them, or got the short end of the straw.

Bahai is iran's equivolent to mormons in USA (not religious perspective-wise, moreso how the rest of the nation treats them, the only difference is the USA can't outright arrest em for it)

There are other religious minorities there as well such as sufism, and zoroastrianism, but they aren't persecuted like the Bahai <-because they aren't socially accepted for what they do.


You know not all women are treated like shit as you like to think

The ones who usually are treated like that are the byproduct of being in a poor, conservative religious family that couldn't wed her to someone (they are the douchebags, yes this is true)

But people of middle class and up treat their daughters better than theyre sons. They get all the riches they want (treated like princesses) they are protected like treasure for they do not want the world to harm them from idiotic religious assholes and whatever. you saw what they did to the rape victim, of course they dont want them hanging out in the streets for men to take. They take marriage seriously, so they dont like people just dating unless they are seriously considering to get married (but like I said before, the trend is changing because of the youth) but because of which they have less aids/stds than the major countries who are more open to sex with different partners.

some of your quotes from quran can be translated on a different end of the spectrum, you really are just giving one perspective of what someone would see from that.

also like galaxy said, you aren't giving full quotes, just parts you want to see. Heck that sounds like a lot of christian radicals here who do the same thing when they want to justify killing homosexuals and abortion doctors.

[Galaxy Turbo]

Oh ok, well you wont find anything advocating lying and being deceitful in most other religions. Whether in a "defensive context" or not.

Is this trying to prove something? It's like saying "My dad could beat up your dad", so not sure what you're trying to say by that.

Again: These leaders are in western countries where they have no political or militaristic influence.
If the muslim community did have its own opinions and they conflicted with that of the leader, all they would have to do is find another mosque and stop associating with him. Instead they stand side by side and defend such hostile statements.

Some of these Imams are part of these extremist groups and we know it. They have militaristic influence if they require it. You're simplifying the situation and it's simply not that easy, as the current situation is another variable you have to consider. Some can and will of course switch mosques, but it could be that they are still praying salah in a mosque with these imams.

Your perspective in this matter is quite frightening in itself. Why do you continually try to argue that these muslim leaders, who are preaching in western countries, are somehow above the criticism of their followers?

Not once have I actually said this, and even if I suggested it within this argument, it's because I'm giving you more variables to which I expect you to respond with more open-mindedness.

Now for the quotes you made.

Your women are your fields, so go into your fields whichever way you like - Sura 2:223

Wed not idolatresses till they believe; for lo! a believing bondwoman is better than an idolatress though she please you; and give not your daughters in marriage to idolaters till they believe, for lo! a believing slave is better than an idolater though he please you. These invite unto the Fire, and Allah inviteth unto the Garden, and unto forgiveness by His grace, and expoundeth His revelations to mankind that haply they may remember. (221) They question thee (O Muhammad) concerning menstruation. Say: It is an illness, so let women alone at such times and go not in unto them till they are cleansed. And when they have purified themselves, then go in unto them as Allah hath enjoined upon you. Truly Allah loveth those who turn unto Him, and loveth those who have a care for cleanness. (222)

Once you put verse 222 back into context, from the one you completely removed it out of, it's speaking about menstruation. Here I've included verse 221 just before it. Not even your quote is accurate so I don't know where you got it from.

Here is one that advocates pedophilia:

when you divorce women, divorce them for their prescribed waiting—period and count the waiting—period accurately . . . 4 And if you are in doubt about those of your women who have despaired of menstruation, their waiting period is three months, and the same applies to those who have not menstruated as yet. As for pregnant women, their period ends when they have delivered their burden. - Sura 65:1,4

This doesn't advocate paedophilia. Islam was established a long time ago, and this was written to cater for all possible situations of that time. Much like when Victorians in their time were able to marry etc. at young ages. Women who were not married by 18 or 19 were considered to be "old maids". My point is, marriage ages fluctuated with times and were down to social acceptance. It doesn't clearly advocate paedophilia at all. There are social standards and laws in place now that would disallow paedophilia, and there are millions more who follow these standards and wouldn't commit such crimes.

Before you argue that these are taken out of context: Let me point out that in most Islamic nations women are treated as second-class citizens who are likely to be charged with adultery, and/or executed, if they make allegations of rape.
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2007/ja...paki-j24.shtml
http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/asiapc...law/index.html
And in some Islamic countries they will hang the victim for "bringing shame to their family", even if she is a child:
http://www.crin.org/violence/search/...p?infoID=15034

I'll get back to this once I'm back from university, too many links and stuff to read.

Ok, so we can agree that muslims are more likely to adopt extremist views, and be hostile towards alternative cultures?

Yes, but only because they're being exposed to such negative media attention, extremist broadcasts etc.

Despite global criticism, Pakistan continues to use Sharia courts in dealing with rape cases and more often than not it is the woman who is condemned.
These laws are accepted by the Pakistani government and the people who are predominantly muslim.

Will also get back to this once I read more on their system.