current crop of staff (somewhat constructive at least...for once)

[Ilya]

lets talk about pandagirl some more

[Exalt]

But what a shame, you couldn't get in staff right, that means your attitudes and words aren't bringing enough importance. Because they are not the right words. Insulting will not make the zone better, forget it already!

Damnit, can't you guys learn this?
Then don't cry creating posts, because if you're wondering about anything, this is your fault: you haven't done anything constructive to the zone instead of crying in forum.
I'm not doing a personal attack, Exalt.

I didn't make this post because I didn't get in staff dexter. You must really be an idiot if you can't see that. I actually like you, but you did attack me, therefore I will attack back. I made this post to show the problems in staff that a large majority of TW vets agree with. You aren't a vet, but I'm sure even you could see the problems if you didn't have your head so far up your ass. Maybe that's why you coded such crap in public? Ohhhh

Yes, it is our fault that staff is fucked up, because we complain about it. Great logic there dexter. That makes so much sense. We should all sing koombayah and hold hands together, because that sure will fix staff, right?

Just think... when more people post how bad staff is compared to the entire history of 12+ years of trenchwars, I think there is some relevant truth in that matter.

This entire post WAS constructive, but you took it personally to defend your butt buddies. Good for you, but don't ignore the obvious facts simply because it might hurt some lowly staff member's feelings.

Plus, I never mentioned coders/webdevs/whatever in my post. I said the general staff members that don't do shit to help the zone. If you want to say we need guys for everything, fine, but we don't need 20 staff members who simply afk 24/7 or who can only ban people when they say nagger. There have been multiple other posts where staff members don't even respond to help calls at all. They sure don't do anything else like help running/hosting leagues or events, so what exactly do they do?

I clearly stated there are good staff members. The problem lies in that there are so many more shitty ones that overshadow the good. Also, there are a shit ton of staff members that are only still staff because of their tenure. They don't do shit, but they keep staff for being there a long time. Yes... that sure is what this zone needs... old afk staff members who don't do shit. That surely helps promote this zone and keep it alive and fun, right? HMMM.

Oh, and one more thing to your "stop complaining and do something constructive" ignorant comment. People like me who care are not staff. Therefore, we do not have the power to change things. YOU are staff, so YOU have that power. Try using it instead of telling the players who keep this game alive to stfu and be constructive instead of those who actually have the job and the title and the powers to do so. The only power I have is to keep placing your staff's inadequacies into the public limelight and hope that at least one staff member will do something to change things. That is all I can do, but I do it.

People like delectable get hired, and that alone shows how retarded staff have become. Sure, he got fired for being worse than useless, but that doesn't change the fact that he got hired in the first place. Whose call was that one? I think whoever is doing the hiring nowadays should wake the fuck up and learn how to do their jobs properly. I don't want staff, because I've already been denied over people like delectable. The difference between me and him, beyond the fact that I've never cheated in this game, is that I actually care to help make the zone better. That alone shows you what the problem lies in. It isn't even about me, because I could care less if I got hired. I just know plenty of people who WANT staff and WANT to help this zone and make it better, but they get denied for useless fucks that don't want to help. Oh, but wait.... I forgot... people like me who complain are the reasons staff is fucked up... not the people actually doing the hiring or the head staff members running the show. Riiiiiiiight.

[Exalt]

lets talk about pandagirl some more

Pandagirl is the skinny blonde semi cute one. Panda bear is the asian one.

I meant to say panda bear originally, but I guess I got it mixed. Oh well.

[Exalt]

also to exalt:

the reason the zone is dying is that select people are forgetting the reason this zone has stayed on top is because it is a holy trinity of pub, events, and twd/twl

all three are important, and the zone suffers any time any one of the three is neglected

The zone is really suffering when all 3 are neglected at the same time. However, events are the least important of the three. Leagues are the most important, since pubbers come and go, and vets tend to play leagues.

Anyway, my point of this post was to say... People like PH, Humid, Demonic, etc etc... the guys/girls that actually run these leagues... they do it alone. They get no help from staff, and that is sad. There are a lot of staff members, but the large majority of them are useless. I just wonder how those who are in charge of hiring can constantly complain that there isn't anyone good to hire when I've seen multiple people who really want to help the zone get denied over and over. This isn't even including me.

If you are going to hire an ex cheater, you should've hired vys or mythril or something. Delectable was probably the worst choice of a staff member I could possibly think of. He never hosted an games while being an ER, I highly doubt he ever responded to help calls, and he is a cheater. People like delectable don't want to help this zone, and they sure don't care about it. I guess he just wanted the little ER tag next to his name. People like that are beyond useless. I know guys like vys have cheated, but they would have done things to help the zone (if you were going to hire a cheater). I just don't see the logic in these staff hirings, and I don't see how people like ARA allow these staff members to not do their jobs. Why would anyone want to be on staff if they don't want to actually do anything? It makes no sense to me.

[Jones]

hello dele, join wingmasters?

[roxxkatt]

exalt, you have good intentions, despite being a little too boorish, but the reason things havnt been fixed yet is because noone can answer one simpe question:

how do you fix a pyramid structure when the highest levels are broken?

[the_paul]

exalt, you have good intentions, despite being a little too boorish, but the reason things havnt been fixed yet is because noone can answer one simpe question:

how do you fix a pyramid structure when the highest levels are broken?

I came in here fully expecting to tell you to stfu, and your previous posts have deserved this, but this one is actually a pretty decent one.

Not all of the highest levels are broken though, but yeah a lot of key ones are. I think we have 2 good sysops in Space and Pluck, but beyond that, idk. I think Stargazer started off pretty gung ho with this QA thing, which is good, but has tailed off lately for whatever reason (not leveling blame on him, just saying). However as the levels go on below them it starts to get fucked up. People already know how I feel about our deans (M_M I still got hope for you). However the problem isn't that these people aren't qualified to be staff (referring to upper staff), Ara has been staff for like 800 years. The problem is an attitude problem within staff, nothing more than that. However, now a staffer is going to come in here who knows about my past run ins with staff in game and on forums, and they'll ignore everything I say and then tell me I have an attitude problem (which may be true). And so the vicious circle continues.

[Dexter]

I didn't make this post because I didn't get in staff dexter. You must really be an idiot if you can't see that. I actually like you, but you did attack me, therefore I will attack back. I made this post to show the problems in staff that a large majority of TW vets agree with. You aren't a vet, but I'm sure even you could see the problems if you didn't have your head so far up your ass. Maybe that's why you coded such crap in public? Ohhhh

I wasn't talking about you, but about whoever was ruining your topic, if you understand
Like keep on saying "oh yes he is staff, oh hes mod!" ..What will it change? So I pointed on that, something that wouldn't help to improve the zone. You didn't understand it well, wherever I was "pointing". Then you came with personal insults, going to the "troll" side on your own topic.

Yes, it is our fault that staff is fucked up, because we complain about it. Great logic there dexter. That makes so much sense. We should all sing koombayah and hold hands together, because that sure will fix staff, right?

Staff(Development) isn't at the best situation, or at least wasn't, because I had a good talk with someone to do a change and that change happened, and thats why I'm happy atm and I can say the Staff(Development section) can do very well now.

Just think... when more people post how bad staff is compared to the entire history of 12+ years of trenchwars, I think there is some relevant truth in that matter.

This entire post WAS constructive, but you took it personally to defend your butt buddies. Good for you, but don't ignore the obvious facts simply because it might hurt some lowly staff member's feelings.

I'm not defending any internet "friend". All I'm saying is that you all keep going on attack on delectable, which is not necessary since that will not change anything. If you wanna do a change, you can do a change without insulting someone. I'm not defending delectable, just saying you're losing time talking about that and always bringin that up.

Plus, I never mentioned coders/webdevs/whatever in my post. I said the general staff members that don't do shit to help the zone. If you want to say we need guys for everything, fine, but we don't need 20 staff members who simply afk 24/7 or who can only ban people when they say nagger. There have been multiple other posts where staff members don't even respond to help calls at all. They sure don't do anything else like help running/hosting leagues or events, so what exactly do they do?

There are different sections of staff, you are right. Some do less, some do more and others much more(Which I can say, the persons that really do big changes and improve the zone).
Whoever does a small amount of change, I assume this person is doing his best and the best is always nice to see, even if thats not something "big".
Rule is rule, we can't break it, so of course we need people to go and ban someone thats breaking the rules.
I assume, I didn't have many time to go and do bans, because I was busy with development and thats why I was staff. But if it were just developers and league runners in the zone, we probably would not have enough time to take care of people saying the "n" word, and anyone would go and say that, breaking the rules.

I can tell you, the problem is not this you are apointing.

I clearly stated there are good staff members. The problem lies in that there are so many more shitty ones that overshadow the good. Also, there are a shit ton of staff members that are only still staff because of their tenure. They don't do shit, but they keep staff for being there a long time. Yes... that sure is what this zone needs... old afk staff members who don't do shit. That surely helps promote this zone and keep it alive and fun, right? HMMM.

Yes, you're right again. There are really nice staffers. People that run leagues, like ph did and like humid is doing, are appreciated and really appreciated. It is a hard job and I'll tell you, it is even harder then do a bot project, for example. So I, myself, admire the people that run leagues. Like Evildeed with twel, demonic with twht, humid with twl and twdt, stabwound with twd... Our zone is still alive because of people like them.

But, again, the problem is not about this you just pointed again: inactive staffers or whoever is staff and don't do any.

Some people are still staff due to their previous work, it is an honor to have them in the staff department.

Oh, and one more thing to your "stop complaining and do something constructive" ignorant comment. People like me who care are not staff. Therefore, we do not have the power to change things. YOU are staff, so YOU have that power. Try using it instead of telling the players who keep this game alive to stfu and be constructive instead of those who actually have the job and the title and the powers to do so. The only power I have is to keep placing your staff's inadequacies into the public limelight and hope that at least one staff member will do something to change things. That is all I can do, but I do it.

Who told you I'm staff? I'm not staff anymore. I had the power to change, I tried, and I almost was burnt out by the players because of a work and gift I gave to them. Also, I saw no posts of you about this on the 2 topics. Just curious why, since you're always wondered about the zone.
Yes, you have that power, to come up and show the situation. but some points aren't right and I'll tell you what is right to say and the problem that we(players) had/have.

You have other power to, which you don't know yet. But let me tell you
There is a development subforum in this forum, requested by me months ago, so the players could go and post ideas or even ask questions about anything related to that.
Like, its so easy to make a map, even Wark could do that!(Lol, jking )
yeah, at start I wasn't staff. But I wanted to work, to make changes. and I'll tell you, it was really hard to me to get staff, I had to do my application too, just like anyone. But when I was recruited by Ara and M_M God, they both worked to get me enough support so I could try to do my work.
So, I used what I had: programming.
But if I wanted to work and I hadn't that, first thing I'd find out to help would be maps, something easy to do and to learn.
Or any kind of help, like make tutorials to new players, how appreciated is that?
The best things are simple. Keep it in mind.
You don't need staff power to do the change, but you can get that power when you do the change, because you'll be admire'd.

People like delectable get hired, and that alone shows how retarded staff have become. Sure, he got fired for being worse than useless, but that doesn't change the fact that he got hired in the first place. Whose call was that one? I think whoever is doing the hiring nowadays should wake the fuck up and learn how to do their jobs properly. I don't want staff, because I've already been denied over people like delectable. The difference between me and him, beyond the fact that I've never cheated in this game, is that I actually care to help make the zone better. That alone shows you what the problem lies in. It isn't even about me, because I could care less if I got hired. I just know plenty of people who WANT staff and WANT to help this zone and make it better, but they get denied for useless fucks that don't want to help. Oh, but wait.... I forgot... people like me who complain are the reasons staff is fucked up... not the people actually doing the hiring or the head staff members running the show. Riiiiiiiight.

And again, you stated about delectable, offending him somehow. Hey, have you heard about a 2nd chance? When I was in staff, delectable really helped. For example, we had a tournament because of him, didn't we? He is worried about zones improvement. I'm not pushing into his side, I'm not his friend and hes not mine, but I'm trying to show you the truth and whats really the problem.

Ok, no more quotes, I guess you may know what is it(problem):
People in the wrong staff positions.
I'm not telling whos in wrong position or not, because thats not kind of a human thing to do.
But there are people good in X, but are in the other side to do Y. Understand me?
Plus, there are people REALLY good in X, but doing Y.

But that is changing, you know why?
and Why it didn't change before?

Because none talked about it with the really high upperstaff.
When someone talked about it to him(which was me), "a" change happened 1 week after. and this is about a position that someone deserved and everyone knew he deserved it, because he works a lot.
So, you can see other problem there, right? Communication, yes.
The communication between staffers is not so easy, is not that they don't want to do it well, its not anyones fault, it is just hard to do. Because there are many different sections, really many. And some stuffs we need to keep in secret, because it would be a BOOM! to anyone and result in worse thing.

Hope I showed to you some situations, and I can tell you they're being worked on because I know they are. Its getting better, but its not always the best. So thats why I tell you, try to do your part just not by posting on forum, but finding something else to do TOO - This means, posts are useful also.
So just stop insulting your next. Why attack delectable like that, why blame Ara - someone who has done just nice works to the zone, why offend someone?

Its not their fault. So, the first thing we have to do, instead of pointing on each other, is do our part - bringing up ideas, making the ideas happen somehow, learning new things: map dev, lvl tileset dev, announcing the game to the others, advertsement in sites, etc. There are lots of things you can do to help instead of attacking someone on a forum site about a game.

English isn't my first language, hope you'll still understand me. I tried

[Ilya]

i started reading that but it got too long, so i just skipped back and forward to random sentences and i must say that was a hilarious post

i especially liked the BOOM!

[Major Crisis]

Anyway, my point of this post was to say... People like PH, Humid, Demonic, etc etc... the guys/girls that actually run these leagues... they do it alone. They get no help from staff, and that is sad. There are a lot of staff members, but the large majority of them are useless. I just wonder how those who are in charge of hiring can constantly complain that there isn't anyone good to hire when I've seen multiple people who really want to help the zone get denied over and over. This isn't even including me.

You forget the people who host the TWL/TWDT/TWHT games.
Last year in TWL we had like 3-4 ERs who hosted all games. If we hadn't these people TWL wouldnt happen.
Demonic asked me to host many TWHT games as well.
They aint the only one who should get the credit, but yes they are the people who should get the most credit.


And like already said, everyone has a thing to do in staff. And not everyone can spend all the time in this game. Remember we are all voluntering to do this.

[Dexter]

i started reading that but it got too long, so i just skipped back and forward to random sentences and i must say that was a hilarious post

i especially liked the BOOM!

Are you using "hilarious" as something funny?
I don't see anything like that on my post.

[Demonic]

You forget the people who host the TWL/TWDT/TWHT games.
Last year in TWL we had like 3-4 ERs who hosted all games. If we hadn't these people TWL wouldnt happen.
Demonic asked me to host many TWHT games as well.
They aint the only one who should get the credit, but yes they are the people who should get the most credit.


And like already said, everyone has a thing to do in staff. And not everyone can spend all the time in this game. Remember we are all voluntering to do this.

I dont think the post is aimed at you major, i think most people know you host alot of games, and were certainly a massive help for me during twht in adding a few extra time slots for players.

Staff is a thankless "task" i say task rather then job, and too be honest the standard has fallen from when i originally joined many moons ago (01/02 ish i think), but, it doesnt take much to change it from where it is now. The basics need to be sorted first, which im sure wark will agree with, and something which has been poorly addressed recently. However, this will be changing im sure, and i know ara/mm are working hard to raise the ER standards. As for leagues, i appreciate the comments exalt, nice to hear but much of twht failings was also down to me too, since i didnt trust the ER's (major excluded) to be able to host the games to a high enough standard and consistency, and the lack of time to personally train them.

anyways, the argument of dele is fairly irrelevant, he had a chance, made no real mistakes as staff so although it was not a hiring i agreed with originally, he gave no reason too axe him or anything so whether he should have made staff or not becomes redundant with the latter point.

[Major Crisis]

I dont think the post is aimed at you major, i think most people know you host alot of games, and were certainly a massive help for me during twht in adding a few extra time slots for players.

Staff is a thankless "task" i say task rather then job, and too be honest the standard has fallen from when i originally joined many moons ago (01/02 ish i think), but, it doesnt take much to change it from where it is now. The basics need to be sorted first, which im sure wark will agree with, and something which has been poorly addressed recently. However, this will be changing im sure, and i know ara/mm are working hard to raise the ER standards. As for leagues, i appreciate the comments exalt, nice to hear but much of twht failings was also down to me too, since i didnt trust the ER's (major excluded) to be able to host the games to a high enough standard and consistency, and the lack of time to personally train them.

anyways, the argument of dele is fairly irrelevant, he had a chance, made no real mistakes as staff so although it was not a hiring i agreed with originally, he gave no reason too axe him or anything so whether he should have made staff or not becomes redundant with the latter point.

I was more pointing to Tres who helps humid alot with running TWDT.

[Exalt]

Hey dexter, I just wanted to say that was a really good post man. I understand where you are coming from. It's just that those of us not in staff don't see what happens. We only see the results. Anyway, sorry for offending you if I did.

[Zazu]

Wow.. a lot of drama and a lot of novels have been written here.
Couldn't read most of them, as I have a life outside the computer as well.

Anyway, I just second what someone said before.. Before crying and pointing at others, first think about "What did you do to make your zone better?". If the answer is "nothing", then don't bother to blame others for anything. Especially don't blame people for a possible failed attempt at improving things. So easy to sit back and point at failing attempts, so hard to step up and make those attempts.