blackrazor, BanID #20549, Three Month Ban ... why please?

[kthx]

I can understand lag limits and the bang system being kept secret, that prevents people from cheating and evading (although that doesn't work and the information is pretty much available anyways) but the rest of the information doesn't really need to be a secret.

[Jason]

i agree that purely empirical data is completely harmless. not sure why connection is so afraid to share these numbers.

[kthx]

stfu cheese, nobody cares about your distension shit.

[Connection]

i agree that purely empirical data is completely harmless. not sure why connection is so afraid to share these numbers.

Graph about how many bans are took in place in 1 month/year is not a secret but i'm not going to count them just because someone wants to know that useless data What comes to lifting bans, there's no way to count them because there is no records/trace about those. How many bans are took place in one month depends on how many jackasses there are playing in that month B) I know dev team is way too busy to do that kind of bot who calculates bans.

[Jason]

just mention data and graph in the same sentence and aro will be all over it!

wait, i just did it, so now all we have to do is get aro to take a look at this post. :]

[Jerome Scuggs]

[kthx]

[Connection]

just mention data and graph in the same sentence and aro will be all over it!

wait, i just did it, so now all we have to do is get aro to take a look at this post. :]

I'd rather keep him do dev stuff that can help TW to improve than use his time on something that doesn't improve our zone at all.

Can someone honestly say why do you guys even want to know this info?

[Jason]

i think people just want to see if what we're telling them (i.e. - bans have gone down such and such percentage) actually matches up with the data. they're looking for transparency. they're looking for statistics by which to measure our performance, at least a little bit anyway.

let's face it. there's no way (as of right now) for the public to truly know whether or not we (staff) are doing our jobs. i mean yeah, we don't have rampant cheating or anything, so at least there's that. ultimately though, we could just be dicking off a lot. and yes, i know some players believe that's precisely what we do.

[Ephemeral]

I'd rather keep him do dev stuff that can help TW to improve than use his time on something that doesn't improve our zone at all.

Can someone honestly say why do you guys even want to know this info?

"Honestly say"? Hmmm, sounds a bit like you have a strong position and do not really want to consider change. I thought I did outline my 'honest' justifications.

...And it is my opinion that general staff performance should not ever be considered ‘private’. Transparency is a ‘good’ thing, in both directions. Again, the primary value is that these kinds of threads would decrease. Whining and complaints could then be handle in the proper context, that being that the trend is simply there or not there. Metric also serve as a very good way for the staff to understand how it is doing, where there are areas to improve, or how to better hire, or how reduce work.
Not everyone understands metrics and how to use them correctly. Other times people understand them, but resist using them because they don’t want to be held accountable.
eph

What is the metric here? Obviously it is easy to calculate just how many bans are handed out and how many are then reversed. Give us the numbers. If the numbers reveal that ban reversal happens more than 15% of the time, then improvement is called for. If it is under 15%, those falsely banned probably need to understand and deal with it.
eph

...But citing specific events is opposite from what my post was trying to achieve, I was trying to remove emotion from the topic and simply discuss empirical data...
eph

...Publishing these kinds of stats would go a long way in helping communicate what the staff actually does. I think it would at least be helpful in quieting some of the whining and perhaps help migrate specific (and endless) threads to a more empirical discussion...
eph

Frankly, I was trying to point out that doing this would actually benefit the staff more than the playing population. And as far as ‘time sent’ goes, consider the time being spent dealing with threads just like this. If metrics were available, the staff response becomes simply “undeserved bans do occur but only 2% of all bans are found to be undeserved”. End of story. But it appears that staff would rather not publish and communicate trend data, preferring instead to deal with emotional threads on a case by case basis.
eph

[Connection]

"Honestly say"? Hmmm, sounds a bit like you have a strong position and do not really want to consider change. I thought I did outline my 'honest' justifications.

Yes i do have strong opinions about all that is about BanG. But i don't understand that "and do not really want to consider change" sentence, what change? change that i'll start to give personal game data out about our players and our whole bang system how it works?

Frankly, I was trying to point out that doing this would actually benefit the staff more than the playing population. And as far as ‘time sent’ goes, consider the time being spent dealing with threads just like this. If metrics were available, the staff response becomes simply “undeserved bans do occur but only 2% of all bans are found to be undeserved”. End of story. But it appears that staff would rather not publish and communicate trend data, preferring instead to deal with emotional threads on a case by case basis.
eph

How would this benefit staff? any staff member with BanG can see latest 100 bans that were issued and why were they issued including time line.

what comes to counting undeserved bans/banlifts, there cant be any bot that can count that as the server doesn't store data on that. That data is in my head and if public don't believe me, i can't help it. I have no reasons to hide/lie information that i know that can be published, but i will hide information how our bang system works and information about single bans. As i said before, simple graph can be made about how many bans are issued in 1 month/year but i'm not going to ask dev to do it because at the moment they have so big workload on their shoulders.

at the moment there has been over 20500 bans issued when billing server started, Ban number 1 was issued 2001-03-30 23:56

[kthx]

at the moment there has been over 20500 bans issued when billing server started, Ban number 1 was issued 2001-03-30 23:56

That is like six bans a day for the last 9 years +, and that means that like 10250 bans were for racism.

[Connection]

at the moment there has been over 20500 bans issued when billing server started, Ban number 1 was issued 2001-03-30 23:56

That is like six bans a day for the last 9 years +, and that means that like 10250 bans were for racism.

C'mon, i know you can troll better than that, i'm disappointed

[kthx]

was probably over 50% now it's far more less after i took the bang op job. Teamkill bans are raising.

at the moment there has been over 20500 bans issued when billing server started, Ban number 1 was issued 2001-03-30 23:56

Since when did fact become troll?

[Barton]

Since when did fact become troll?

because your reasoning is incorrect.

At the beginning we had more then triple the amount of players then we have now and since we got BanC there are weeks where noone got banned.