Faith

[Pressure Drop]

Originally Posted by 1ight
Jesus loves me and I sure do love Him. And I know He loves you too. What other god has ever died for their believers?



Christianity is Monotheistic correct? Then how can a man (Jesus) be a God? Did not God create him? If so, then there cannot be two Gods, or else you'd be going against one of your fundemental beliefs. Purely inconsistent logic.

yeah and isn't one off the commandments about not worshipinf false idols or engraven images

yet i see christians worshiping a cross

lol the irony !!!



anyways for me faith in science is alot different to a faith in religion. Yes there is alot of faith in science in that we trust scientists and their equations. But one of the things about science is that it moves on and changes to fit the latest understanding. It isn't set in stone and doesn't claim to have all the answers but is about working to try and get more answers, if that means one theory supercedes another so be it etc...

Faith in a religion is different becuase it doesn't have much logic to believe in a perticular religion. Also often faith is used as a means too answer alot of the questions that arise from believeing in something that is fundamentaly flawed. Also when you got ppl like 1ight trying to bully ppl to believe in what he does by saying stuff like

Believing in science will not save you.

i think that faith can be dangerous. Its the same with those extremist muslims that support the likes of Al Queda becuase off their "Faith" and its not limited to muslims as christians and other religions have done similar things in the past. Religion can be like brian washing and as you can see all this talk of saviour etc... is drummed into some ppl and is a great way to spread their religion around by picking on the nieve and vunrable and telling them they are "saving" them.

The thing i really hate is when faith is used as a way to subdue doubt and curiosity.

[Superted]

Christianity is Monotheistic correct? Then how can a man (Jesus) be a God? Did not God create him? If so, then there cannot be two Gods, or else you'd be going against one of your fundemental beliefs. Purely inconsistent logic.

I'm still learning but afaik, God is 3 three things incorporated into one, these are; God, the Holy Spirit and the Lord Jesus. This is known as the Holy Trinity.

And pressure, we don't worship the cross, it's just a symbol. And to comment on to something of yours in a previous post. It's Jehova's Witnesses that believe in the 144,000 thing, it's not in the Bible. The 144,000 were selected years ago and it's believed that when they all die, it's the apocalypse. Just so you know, most of them are now dead, lol.

[Twerp]

Good question: but more importantly, if Goddess got into a cat fight with God (namely Zeus) I wonder who will win, the one with sharper nails or the one who can drink more beers.

This is such a good question I start to think it draws parallel interest from me as the question that whether Epinephrine and Troll King both fell in love with Daze when they met up.

Nice job avoiding the question she asked you.

[Pressure Drop]

And pressure, we don't worship the cross, it's just a symbol. And to comment on to something of yours in a previous post. It's Jehova's Witnesses that believe in the 144,000 thing, it's not in the Bible. The 144,000 were selected years ago and it's believed that when they all die, it's the apocalypse. Just so you know, most of them are now dead, lol.

If its just a symbol then why do you hold it up to ward of vampires huh?

and put it on top of churches (guess vampires can fly)

Also are you sure its not in the bible? I thought a Jehova's witness told me it was.

ehm i googled it and found this

And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty [and] four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.

ha ha ha your my bitch now

seriously though, i'm not trying to be even handed and reasonable in religion threads becuase i allready have my views and i'm never going to agree with ppl like 1ight. The reason i post is to try and bring in a little balance by representing a non religious stand point, though i admit i do it half assed and probably do more damage than good but its only TW fourms and i don't take it too serious. occasionly i can be serious and like in my Japanese whaling thread i towed the line and was responcible in what i said. Other threads specialy religion ones i don't be so much :P

probably best to let my wild accusations be than get into a debate about the validity of my claims. But what you said did intrigue me a bit. What exactly is a diffrence between a "symbol" and an "engraven image" or a false idol? many christians worship and pray to a picture of jesus on a cross and even mary too. But to me it seems strange to have a commandment like that and then have a load of ppl carrying crosses around and holding it when they pray etc...

[Lucon]

Finally, a topic I can talk at length about.

Faith is obviously irrational, but so many people have incorrect beliefs ingrained into their superegos, that's it's taboo to talk about. It's generally understood among those in-the-know, though.

[Superted]

If its just a symbol then why do you hold it up to ward of vampires huh?

Vampires don't exist
It's a symbol like 'In the name of Jesus, I command you to go away demon!'

ehm i googled it and found this

That's me owned. I have yet to read revelations so I can't comment.

What exactly is a diffrence between a "symbol" and an "engraven image" or a false idol?

A symbol is a symbol, like my avatar is sign of peace, you know it as a sign of peace, everyone knows it as a sign of peace. The same with the cross (granted not everyone knows).

Engraven image, not absolutly sure but I think you had it with the pictures of Mary, which is mostly a catholic thing.

False idol, following someone who claims to be Holy, but isn't.

I hope that helped, I could of course be wrong but meh.

[Lucon]

Oh man, I'm glad I'm not reading the rest of this.

[Bob (SRB)]

What is science then? Science can't prove that God exists nor can it prove that God doesn't exist. Believing in science will not save you. Why be stubborn and follow science, science doesn't give you any salvation. I know I would choose Christianity, then being stubborn and die empty handed. I know I can die with a smile on my face, knowing that I choosed the truth, while others will be afraid on their deathbed, dying stiff.

Jesus loves me and I sure do blah blah blah etc.

Is it just me or did this have absolutely nothing to do with faith? You kind of just started to talk about jesus serving people food. Science may not be able to prove that god does or doesn't exist, but it damn well can prove that the christian concept of god and many events of the bible are false. So I don't see why you are attempting to argue using only christian beliefs, it just shows how narrow minded your thinking is.

And I don't even need to prove your argument wrong there about "being stubborn and choosing science," you've already done it yourself. Believers in science can say the exact same to you, why be stubborn and deny the truths of science? Not because you chose the truth, but because you chose faith, which will give you more comfort as you die because you can believe that you are going to heaven. While the people who are brave enough to attempt to find the real truth might have to die with that uncertainty. Well I'm sorry, but for me being a sheep all your life isn't worth a comfortable death.

[Pressure Drop]

Vampires don't exist

yes they do :wassat:
i've seen six and killed 2 :fear:

A symbol is a symbol, like my avatar is sign of peace, you know it as a sign of peace, everyone knows it as a sign of peace.

holy shit, i always thought that ment airport. I see a plane with a circle around it!!!

[Bioture]

i think religious/faith debates are really useless unless everyone involved has, to some degree, a open mind - so that that they want to learn something new rather than just say stuff they know or think may be true. It's not the disagreements or doubt that gets me, but it's always the closedmindedness and the people who say "prove this, if you can't then your faith is false" when they already have in mind the answers for themselves.

[Epinephrine]

This is such a good question I start to think it draws parallel interest from me as the question that whether Epinephrine and Troll King both fell in love with Daze when they met up.

And yet again...

I have faith that you will never really make sense.

[Troll King]

Faith in a religion is different becuase it doesn't have much logic to believe in a perticular religion. Also often faith is used as a means too answer alot of the questions that arise from believeing in something that is fundamentaly flawed. Also when you got ppl like 1ight trying to bully ppl to believe in what he does by saying stuff like

"Believing in science will not save you."

i think that faith can be dangerous.

I wouldn't call 1ight's quote an example of "bullying people" into faith any more than I would call your statement an example of "bullying people" out of faith. The two statements are nearly the same, only applied in different directions. People talk about how the religious try to bully people into believing, but I see the exact same behaviour from atheists trying to bully people into not believing. They're both exactly the same, but in my experience, the religious tend to sound nicer when they go about it. Critics complain about the religious "forcing their religion onto us", when sometimes, they're just stating their religious views. I usually find atheists to be more forceful with their views than the religious people are.

This is exactly what Bioture meant when he talked about people being too closed-minded to have any meaningful discussion.

P.S.
And I don't get why atheists call it bullying when a religious person tells them "you're going to hell because you don't believe". If you're an atheist, you don't believe in hell anyway, so is it really bullying when the words mean nothing to you?

[Lucon]

I wouldn't call 1ight's quote an example of "bullying people" into faith any more than I would call your statement an example of "bullying people" out of faith. The two statements are nearly the same, only applied in different directions. People talk about how the religious try to bully people into believing, but I see the exact same behaviour from atheists trying to bully people into not believing. They're both exactly the same, but in my experience, the religious tend to sound nicer when they go about it. Critics complain about the religious "forcing their religion onto us", when sometimes, they're just stating their religious views. I usually find atheists to be more forceful with their views than the religious people are.

This is exactly what Bioture meant when he talked about people being too closed-minded to have any meaningful discussion.

P.S.
And I don't get why atheists call it bullying when a religious person tells them "you're going to hell because you don't believe". If you're an atheist, you don't believe in hell anyway, so is it really bullying when the words mean nothing to you?

Probably just because they're so self-assured and sanctimonious that it feels like you're being bullied.

[R1pp3r]

P.S.
And I don't get why atheists call it bullying when a religious person tells them "you're going to hell because you don't believe". If you're an atheist, you don't believe in hell anyway, so is it really bullying when the words mean nothing to you?

What if someone is a lost and weak person and someone starts with the Christianity bullshit. Probably that person will be lured into the Christianity bullshit. They go for the weak and lost people, who are easiest to control.

[geekbot]

Doesn't apply because there are no lost, weak-minded people on these forums.