Hybrid Cars & Efficient Gas Mileage

[404 Not Found]

Since there is so much country bashing going on in the forum. I am curious to know what many of the European Countries as well as New Zealand & Australia, are doing in regards to high gas prices and the availability of fuel efficient cars.

As a Statesman...not an American as that would be saying I could be from Canada, USA, Mexico, Brazil, Aregntina...and so on...but as a citizen of the USA, the trend for a more fuel efficient car has been a high priority here.

Not counting public transportation & noting high petrol costs worldwide, what has been done in your country?

In the States, within the next 5 yrs, 4 out of 5 cars will be Hybrids (Gas/Electric) with mileage at somewhere on an average of 50 MPG or roughly 80 KM. These cars will be emission controlled with almost no trace of pollutant emissions. The old Diesel Engine is being retro fit to run on Corn Oil at almost the same mileage as the Hybrids. There are kits to convert the VW Diesel Engines over to Corn Oil here in the States and it is not all that expensive. Corn itself is an abundant agricutural product that could eleviate a good 50% of the Oil being used here in the States...and with a yearly replenishing of the crop, it could do away with how Cars are fueled here,

So to sum it up....have your Governments and or Countries made steps in creating as well as supplying a more environmental friendly and fuel efficient car?

[Epinephrine]

404 are you on crack or something? 4 out of 5 cars will be hybrid in the USA in the next 5 years? When Bush and the Republicans keep stalling on lowering milage standards, and when oil is 1/3 as cheap as it is in Europe, what crack are you smoking? Granted, Canada isn't much better at all I completely admit (our strong oil industry and American dominated auto industry procludes us from doing anything drastic either which is a shame), but your strange assertions about the US and cleaner cars is just plain wrong.

But to answer your question, from what I know Europe has done a lot of things.

1) They have stricter fuel milage standards.
2) A lot of their cars there use newer diesel engines which produce much less emissions and use less fuel than American cars.
3) They have gas prices which are 2-3 times higher thanks to gas taxes. This means that there is a much lower insentive to actually drive, thus people drive less and walk/take transit more and thus there is less carbon produced overall. This is important. You talk about 'higher petrol prices' but in reality most of these prices are imposed by the government itself. It's not just that fuel costs more, the governments have made a conscious effort to get people to use less fuel by artifically raising the price of it by taxes.
4) European cars are smaller overall if only because the streets are more narrow. But smaller cars (and very few SUVs or pickup trucks) = better fuel usage.

Then of course there's Japan, which pioneered the Hybrid car, but I guess everyone knows about their efficiency there (and why you probably didn't mention them).

I'm not so sure about Austrailia or New Zealand though.

[Bigwig]

actually hybrid cars are on the rise in the states, but i think 404 means that 4 out of 5 new cars will be hybrids. i don't think that is entirely accurate though, it seems impossibly high compared to brazil which has been working on the switch for 30 years. i did read somewhere 200k new yorkers have hybrid cars (ethanol), though, most don't use the capability since there are few places to buy the fuel in new york.

brazil is an interesting case. they already have 1 in 5 new cars being ethanol hybrids. but the ethanol producers are as greedy as oilmen and shove the prices around on the consumer.

this is an interesting article about brazils use of ethanol.

[geekbot]

Hybrids are not an end-all. Their mileages improve over gas-only vehicles but usually only less than 10%. 50 mpg is easily achieveably with a manual gas-only Civic. Hybrid rarely if ever beat that. And they do it at the expense of a more complex engine. More parts, more repairs translate to hybrids not being *that* much better for us or for the environment.

I'm not saying they're *bad*- I would seriously consider it for my next car- but we could do a lot better than 4/5 new cars are hybrids or whatever the statistic is.

Stricter standards can also be a difficult thing. Europe has many diesel cars while America has only a small handful and that is in part of stricter standards in the US. Honda has developed their first in-house designed diesel but they're not selling it in America because they can't meet our standards at a low enough cost.

One good thing, Illinois government and school fleets are required to use at least a 2% biodiesel blend. I think that's at least part of the reason that IL is the largest biodiesel market in the US right now.

Anyway, that blathering is just to say that there's a complex picture and the US has a *long* way to go. We have gone from being a world provider of oil to importing over 50% of our oil consumption. And being the self-declared world police/army/government of oil producing countries. Meanwhile, back at home, the EPA hasn't even devised a new standard to accurately report MPG ratings of hybrids yet.

Oil is big business and we need to vote no on oil dependency with our wallets.

BTW, gas-electric hybrids create just as much pollutants per gallon of gas used as gas-only cars.

[Fit of Rage]

Geek, I think the point behind gas-electric hybrids is that they expend less gas per mile traveled, thus they're cleaner for the distance you get out of them.

[RATTY...]

There's a little company who makes electric cars in Norway, Think, it was owned by Ford last time I read about it. They're small and ugly.

[404 Not Found]

actually hybrid cars are on the rise in the states, but i think 404 means that 4 out of 5 new cars will be hybrids. i don't think that is entirely accurate though, it seems impossibly high compared to brazil which has been working on the switch for 30 years. i did read somewhere 200k new yorkers have hybrid cars (ethanol), though, most don't use the capability since there are few places to buy the fuel in new york.

I was incorrect in my posting, as not 4 out of 5 new cars will be hybrid, but rather sales of new cars and this is directed at the smaller economy class and mid size cars.

This does not include the sports cars, such as the Corvette & Mustang. This also does not include the F-150, F-250 Pick-up's.

This is geared to compact & the mid-size. Toyota just introduced it's mid-size Camery as a Hybrid. Honda has the Accord & Civic as Hybrids.

So I am corrected as this did not encompass all cars. But considering that most people in the States Lease a car for 3 years rather than buy a car, tendancy for new leases, especially corporate leases will be directed at the Hybrids.

EDIT: Hmm...they may have a problem in years to come with what to do with spent batteries

[Richard Creager]

Hi, too lazy; didn't read. I just wanted to let you know that the cause of everyone's problem is the 100 year old internal combustion system. It is made of ass and poo and it's time it was rid completely. By extension, hybrids are shit as well as anything that uses it at all. Working around IC will not work, it has to be scrapped entirely. It's a new milennium after all, why even use that outdated garbage for anything?

[Galleleo]

I know Volvo made hybrid cars, but if I am correct it's not electric-gas, but the cars use a special kind of mixture of gas and something, could be water, not sure, wich results in alot less gas. They only drive in Sweden tho because Sweden only has the stations where you can buy that stuff.. I'll see if I can look up some info on this in a min and I'll get back to ya.

[Fluffz]

i was driving with an hybrid car already, some small toyota limo, and i have to say it was quite awsome. its drives with its electro engine up to about 70 kmh, with the best thing being, it makes no noise. none. it feels like you are still. also it needs no gears. this is quite awsome in a city. perfect smooth driving. im not talking about automatic here, it has no gears. it also needs less fuel, about 4,5l / 100 km which is awsome. however, you could only load the battery with the diesel engine afaik, so that was quite weak.

[ZeUs!!]

I've got a limo too yup

[bloodzombie]

Hybrids are not an end-all. Their mileages improve over gas-only vehicles but usually only less than 10%. 50 mpg is easily achieveably with a manual gas-only Civic. Hybrid rarely if ever beat that. And they do it at the expense of a more complex engine. More parts, more repairs translate to hybrids not being *that* much better for us or for the environment.
.

I'd love to see that civic that gets 50mpg.

[sexy wooden spoon]

my manual non hybrid does 45 mpg (england)

[Bioture]

Cost wise, Hybrid cars just aren't worth it. Why get a hybrid civic, that costs 3 thousand more, when you won't get the money back from gas for about 10 years or the life of the car? Also fixing it and upkeep will cost more too. I don't think there is enough of us to even care about the environment if the only benefit is saving it.

I'd say diesel is a better way to go, as crude refinement can provide us with a lot more diesel than petroleum based stuff. the VW jetta diesel gets 45mpg highway too.

[ConcreteSchlyrd]

Cost wise, Hybrid cars just aren't worth it. Why get a hybrid civic, that costs 3 thousand more, when you won't get the money back from gas for about 10 years or the life of the car? Also fixing it and upkeep will cost more too. I don't think there is enough of us to even care about the environment if the only benefit is saving it.

Because it's not all about how much money you'd save. Stop thinking with your wallet for a second and start thinking long-term. Shit, if I was thinking with my wallet for the decision, I'd ride a fucking bike--that's cheap. Walking's even cheaper. A lot of people buy hybrids because the actually give a shit about reducing dependence on oil and the lesser impact on the environment. The fact is that they're currently one of the few alternatives that normal people have to full-on gas guzzlers.

I'd say diesel is a better way to go, as crude refinement can provide us with a lot more diesel than petroleum based stuff. the VW jetta diesel gets 45mpg highway too.

...and right now, diesel sells for 2.98 something per gallon as opposed to an ethanol blend for like 2.16 a gallon. Nice and price-conscientious. And let's not forget that diesel also smells like complete ass (outside of BD20 or BD50 biodiesel blends--not like those are readily available for everyone). As far as getting 45MPG highway--I have a close friend who owns a fairly new TDO Jetta. He bought it new not too long ago. It doesn't get 45MPG. That's a sticker-seller.