The Capital Punishment

[Galleleo]

You're not forced, you can chose not to sue him to get your money/stuff back.

[WuTang420]

true, but to let someone str8 jack you would just be silly

[Sarien]

I am not sure why the opinion of the four people he killed is especially relevant.

Because they were thinking, caring, feeling people, alive and free, until he took it upon himself to take everything they had and everything they could ever have, away from them. In so doing he forfeits his life as well. If he were trying to kill these same four people and they killed him in self defense, would you feel bad for him? I wouldn't. He made the decision and in so doing forfeited his life. It's not exactly like the death penalty was a big secret, or anything. He knew what he was doing.

He is a children's book writer, isn't that more productive than rotting away in jail?

He is a nominee for the Nobel Prize, that means he has done good works, and benefitted many people. He has used his life to enrich that of others, is that a bad thing? If he had been killed, what would have happened to the lives of those whom he helped?

Writing all the children's books in the world, and being nominated for all the peace prizes in the world, doesn't vindicate him or the fact that he murdered people for money. I can easily tell you that were I to have kids, they wouldn't be reading his children's books though.

Do you have to constantly seek after revenge, answering one death with another? Do you think it would be right to say "I don't care that <x number of people> will be screwed if Tookie hadn't done what he did after leaving jail, I want to kill him no matter what"?

Constantly? No. Do I feel bad about getting revenge? No.
Call it barbaric if you like, it really doesn't matter to me. He made a conscious decision to murder people that had done him no wrong. I don't honestly care if he reformed. I don't care if he felt awful, or if it plagued him constantly, what he had done. There's a price you pay and a responsibility you have to take for your behavior. That's part of being a man, if not a human, citizen, adult, etc etc etc. He knew the price going in and disregarded everything, laws, his own future, the futures of the people he killed, for immediate monetary gain. He sacrificed hiimself, and I, for one, am glad it's done and over with.

He died the moment he pulled the trigger. The rest of the time he had was pretty much just paperwork. Whether or not he did something noble during that time can be debated, but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt and say that he attempted to use what time he had left to try to do some good. Good for him, and a shame that thought didn't occur to him before he decided to kill people.

[WuTang420]

^ what sarien said. thx man saved me some typing

[geekbot]

Do you have to constantly seek after revenge, answering one death with another?

This doesn't necessarily have to do with capital punishment but one of the benefits of an impartial justice system that works is that *I don't have to seek revenge myself*. That's because my goverment works to provide justice. When someone robs me or attacks me, I don't have a right to stalk and launch a counter-attack. I can't rob them, even if it's the same dollar amount they took from me. But my government can and should act to right the situation.

I *want* my goverment to "seek the proper revenge". This doesn't mean I want to be a vengeful person or want revenge for everything beyond what is fair and reasonable.

Hmmm, I just thought of the movie "A Time To Kill" with McConaughey, Sandra Bullock, and Samuel Jackson. Who here wanted Samuel Jackson to kill that person? Wait, who here is old enough to remember that movie?

[K2Grey]

He made the decision and in so doing forfeited his life. It's not exactly like the death penalty was a big secret, or anything. He knew what he was doing.

So, let's say he is placed in prison, and then he gets out of jail. Apparently, you feel that the most moral thing is for him to die. So should he think to himself,

1) Wow, now that I'm out of prison I can do good works and make myself a benefit for the world and help countless numbers of people that would be screwed otherwise, or

2) My crimes are too enormous, I better commit suicide and screw everyone involved in 1)

[Facetious]

maybe his actions wouldnt solely be guided by sarien's opinion. thinking "i should be dead right now, i deserve to die" doesnt neccessarily mean that hes going to think "well, id may as well go kill some more families" it might motivate him to continue his good deeds to try to reverse the opinions of the people he can. if thinking he deserves to die makes him kill more people he DEFINTIELY deserves to die.

[froedrick]

These topics have never gotten anywhere before, why would they start now?

Seriously, you guys got to chill about this. A forum topic about something is not going to change anyones views. Especially if you dont have any.

Well I guess we should just shut down the boards then. No point in keeping them if we can't if talk about an issue.

[Sarien]

So, let's say he is placed in prison, and then he gets out of jail. Apparently, you feel that the most moral thing is for him to die. So should he think to himself,

1) Wow, now that I'm out of prison I can do good works and make myself a benefit for the world and help countless numbers of people that would be screwed otherwise, or

2) My crimes are too enormous, I better commit suicide and screw everyone involved in 1)

What he thinks and what he feels isn't really any of my concern.
If he had gotten pardoned, number one would have been the obvious preferable choice for what to do with the rest of his time. But that doesn't mean I think he should've been pardoned. Nor does it mean I think he could've ever repaid the loss of the people he murdered.

When I was growing up, there was a family that my family were friends with. One of their sons was kind of a troublemaker, but mostly just in a prankster kind of way. He went to school with my older brother, but in all honesty he didn't seem exactly a terrible person. About three years ago, he raped a girl. He was convicted, and is in prison, right now. I remember my brother being kind of upset by this, and wondering whether or not he should write or contact him in prison, and that generally he didn't know how to feel about it. I, however, knew exactly how I felt about it. He deserves all the time he got, and probably some more. I said as much, and that I wanted nothing to do with him, ever again. My brother kind of winced at that. Then I made the remark that, even if he had been a friend, he'd done something that both of us had said we would have killed people for. He made his own choice, and as far as I'm concerned, were he to be stabbed in prison tonight, the only person in the equation I feel bad for, is the innocent girl that he raped. To hell with what he feels and what he wants.

[Galleleo]

Donno if you read my post sarien. But if he wouldn't have gotten the life sentence, he could atleast have done more of what he was doing. And I am not saying whatever he was doing that that would somehow change what he did, or make it more ok. But he was doing some good from what I understood, and without the death penalty he could have done ALOT more good for alot of years. I do not think he should ever be released, nor would the good stuff simply cancel out what he did. But in this case the death penalty did take away alot of years from him in wich he could atleast have done something.