Conspiratorially speaking seeking facts not theory

[Epinephrine]

Considering they did end up demolishing nearby buildings which were on the verge of collapse anyway, they might have helped WTC7 along. Or the media might have speculated that they were going to help WTC7 along by demolishing it.

Unless someone has a video of the actual building in mint condition with absolutely no chance of collapse after WTC1&2 collapsed, then I really don't believe that they had intentionally plotted to destroy WTC7 ahead of time.

BTW I can post videos too lol:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tacYj...eature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLShZ...eature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9UOUR...eature=related

More sites:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programme...es/6341851.stm

[Mythrandir]

I'm glad that you were joking Vatican, but I couldn't tell it apart from the rest of your post. But as much as you feel lumped into the group of conspiracy nutjobs, you do the same to the opposing group. It is possible to be very sceptical and conclude that what is said to have happened at 911 is basically what actually happened. Being a sceptic does not mean that you have to disagree with every popular opinion, it does not mean that you have to play the devil's advocate for everything.

[HeavenSent]

Don't forget about the 2 videos I posted on the 1st page of this thread with Giuliani saying the building (WTC7) is about to come down... And the BBC reporting WTC7 has fallen 20 minutes before it actually does. Apparently they read the script handed to them too early.

Here firemen are telling people to get away from WTC7... It's gonna blow up:
http://www.youtube.com/v/CwjmqkjwnvQ&rel=1

Here's a video where not only does Silverstein use to the term 'pull' for WTC7, but just after a demolition team takes down WTC4 & 5, they say they're "getting ready to 'pull' building 6."
http://www.youtube.com/v/F6QV6LK8j1Q&rel=1

BTW I can post videos too lol:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tacYj...eature=related

A rebuttal (from Epi's 1st video) to Brent Blanchard's analysis:
http://911research.wtc7.net/reviews/...ard/index.html

Here's the same video shot Epi posted, only in this one, the 'explosive pops' can be heard as the building is coming down:
http://www.youtube.com/v/rETQrDWNW2U&rel=1

Here's some footage of the aftermath. Notice the usage of the word 'pulverized' and the number of times the word 'explosion' is used:
http://www.youtube.com/v/WB3IvA8WCyo&rel=1

This one is much more dramatic and much more convincing:
http://www.youtube.com/v/8n-nT-luFIw&rel=1

Re: the 2 towers:
The core colums had some help in mist of the explosion.
These videos simulate not only the way the towers should have looked from the 'official' story but also show what it took to make them look the way they did:
http://www.youtube.com/v/qJ11i6fi7KQ&rel=1
http://www.youtube.com/v/ExmSMU9ls-w&rel=1

The public's awareness of this [inside job] is spreading like wildfire. Soon the so-called tin-foil hat wearing conspiracy nut-jobs are going to be the majority on this issue. Everyday more and more people are waking up.

The opposide actually. Within a year, half of the people who believed it was an inside job stopped believing it.

BREAKING NEWS: Major CNN Poll On The 9/11 Conspiracy 76% or 3568 as of now say YES that the U.S. government covered up the real events...

BBC airs an hour long documentary that investigates the growing number of conspiracy theories surrounding the 9/11 attacks.

More Americans blame Bush for 9/11
whether they blame the Bush administration for the attacks, 45 percent said either a "great deal" or a "moderate amount," up from 32 percent in a June 2002 CNN/USA Today/Gallup poll.

MSNBC: 9/11 conspiracy theorists multiply

CNSNEWS: 9/11 Conspiracy Theories Gain Ground, Study Finds

Scientific Poll: 85% Reject Official 9/11 Story

wikipedia:Time Magazine stated, "This is not a fringe phenomenon. It is a mainstream political reality."

ScrippsNews: Third of Americans suspect 9-11 government conspiracy

Centre for Research on Globalization
9/11: Looking for Truth in Credentials: The Peculiar WTC “Experts”
The Bush Administration employed a number of such credentialed experts to give us multiple explanations for the unprecedented destruction of three tall steel-framed buildings at the World Trade Center (WTC). Unfortunately, all of those explanations have proven to be false, and this fact reminds us that academic credentials don’t necessarily make a person more capable, or more likely, to tell the truth.

A new [Zogby] poll indicates that some 43 percent of Americans believe that Washington knew about the 9/11 attacks but did nothing to stop them. The poll also indicates that a majority of Americans (56.3 percent), including the members of US armed forces, support the idea that the Bush Administration used the September 11 attacks as an excuse to push ahead with its own agenda..

[SEAL]

Don't forget about the 2 videos I posted on the 1st page of this thread with Giuliani saying the building (WTC7) is about to come down... And the BBC reporting WTC7 has fallen 20 minutes before it actually does. Apparently they read the script handed to them too early.

i think the video's eph showed make more commen sence. those videos are based on facts and the ones you show are all "x files" themed.

Plus, commenting on your quote; one news show said the tower was on fire or about to collapse. bbc took that sentence over without doing a verify and made it "it has collapsed". it's rather poor research and cheap copy than a conspiricy.

[Epinephrine]

i think the video's eph showed make more commen sence. those videos are based on facts and the ones you show are all "x files" themed.

Plus, commenting on your quote; one news show said the tower was on fire or about to collapse. bbc took that sentence over without doing a verify and made it "it has collapsed". it's rather poor research and cheap copy than a conspiricy.

He probably won't believe it anyway, but there's an article on the BBC website from the editors about this and they are surprised that so many people choose to use that report to further conspiracy theories. The editor actually talked to the reporter who said that and she said that she didn't remember what she said that day as spotty information was coming in throughout the day and they were just reporting it.


The thing I really don't get is, why the conspiracy theory people so harp on this. The thing is, if there were people who actually plotted to bring down the WTC for their own gain, it would have been a MASSIVE undertaking to bring down the buildings, set up the airplanes, set up explosives secretly, bribe/threaten countless experts and witnesses to do their bidding, and hand out scripts to the INTERNATIONAL media to blindly report.... why would they reverse their entire story right after the event?

Why go to all the trouble of telling everyone in the world that they had just demolished the building, and then deny it? It just doesn't make any sense. The conspiracy people are grasping at straws.

[HeavenSent]

Planes are mostly air. What wreckage there is, can easily be obscured by smoke, bad camera angles, blending into the rest of the rubble, and undated and untimed photos which don't show the extent of the cleanup already done. Also a lot of the plane ended up inside the buildings where the upper floors then collapsed onto the wreckage.

If planes are mostly air... Why is there a hole (before the collapse) from what most people believe to be the nose of the plane and not holes from the engines?... which are are virtually big blocks of nearly solid metal. ...and those big spools in front look practically untouched.

Sam Danner;
An Eyewitness to
the Crash at the Pentagon!

Sam Danner (red arrow), was one of the people who helped pick up scraps. The white arrow points to a mysterious agent with a name like "Erkstein" who was directing the destruction of evidence.
As is typical, the FBI and other agencies were waiting for the event so that they could immediately intimidate witnesses, destroy evidence, and chase away any honest policemen.

Here is Sam Danner's story, along with discussions of related subjects (If you don't have the time to listen to the entire interview, there are brief excerpts of important points below this box. Also, check out the information at the bottom of this article.)
Sam_EyewitnessToFlight77_hour1.mp3 6.3 mb
(the phone cut out, and then we continued)
Sam_EyewitnessToFlight77_hour2.mp3 9.7 mb

Note: he had a chemotherapy treatment a few hours earlier, so he was a bit tired.

A Few Important Excerpts
Sam Danner, who had been an emergency medical technician, was driving near the Pentagon on September 11, 2001. When he was in front of the Pentagon, traffic began to slow down. Danner noticed an airplane in the distance. He knew about the attack on the WTC, and he pulled over and got out of his car. He noticed a small aircraft in the distance coming towards him. However, he also noticed some people on the Pentagon property watching the traffic and the aircraft:
WhiteCollarPeopleLooking.mp3

He saw a second airplane with 4 engines high up in the air above the Pentagon:
JetHighAbove4Engines.mp3

A couple seconds later the first aircraft passes in front of him. He describes it as a white aircraft about the size of Gulfstream 300. The front was like a humpback whale. It was flying very low to the ground:
HumpbackWhaleOneEngine.mp3

There was only one engine, and it was in the tail:
TailConfigurationOf727.mp3

As other witnesses have said, the airplane seemed to be under perfect control. He did not notice any windows on the plane:
LookedLikeUnderPerfectControlNoWindows.mp3

He felt the air move as the aircraft flew by, but the aircraft was amazingly quiet:
FeltAirVeryQuiet.mp3

He saw some of the light poles that had been hit by the aircraft, but they seem to have fallen in the wrong direction, as if explosives knocked them down:
LightPolesBlownBackwards.mp3

Danner walked onto the Pentagon property to help the survivors, but he didn't find any bodies or luggage:
WhereAreTheDeadPeopleAndSuitcases.mp3

He joined the people who picked up scraps (see the photo at the top of this page):
AskedToHelpPickUpScraps.mp3

One of the other people assumed they were picking up scraps only to make it appear as if they were doing something useful; ie, in order to impress somebody important:
HorseAndPonyShowNothingToPickUp.mp3

All they found were bits of shredded aluminum and some type of polymer material with fibers:
RoughOnOneSideWithFibers.mp3

He saw tiny bits of aluminum, a few large pieces, and only one engine:
BitsOfAluminumAndOneEngine.mp3

Danner's description of the airplane and the scraps supports the theory that a Global Hawk crashed into the Pentagon.


Many people started to wonder what was going on:
PeopleUpsetConfused.mp3

The people who appeared to be official government agents did not seem interested in rescuing victims:
AgentsDidntSeemToCare.mp3

Are you aware that prior to the collapse of Building 7 at the World Trade Center, the people in the area were told to move away because the building might collapse? Well, Danner said that after a while they were told to move away from the Pentagon. Some of the people in the area obviously knew that a portion of the building was about to collapse:
AgentsToldPeopleToBackAway.mp3

Most of the Pentagon employees were as confused about what was happening as Danner, which implies that only a small number of the Pentagon employees were part of this scam. This implies that a lot of Pentagon employees must have figured out that they were lied to:
LotOfPeopleSuspicious.mp3

Danner's testimony shows that there must be thousands of people who know that the official story is a lie, but they don't realize that their information is important, or they are too frightened to talk. The suspicious government agents intimidated the innocent people who wanted to help:
WeWereIntimidated.mp3

He made a sarcastic remark to a government agent about how there was a tremendous loss of life from the airplane crash but he couldn't see any of it:
AgentsDidntSeemConcerned.mp3

Danner's final conclusion was that there was no 757; the official story is a lie:
No757ItIsBigLie.mp3

[HeavenSent]

[Reaver]

The WTC7 building falling looks extremely suspicious. There was a large bang noise, it was reported ahead of time that the building had fallen despite it not falling yet, I've never heard of any buildings made of steel falling because of fires, especially in such a short time. I watched one of the video's trying to debunk the WTC7 controlled demolition conspiracy and it was pretty bad. As for the WTC and Pentagon, I'm not convinced there's a conspiracy there.

[HeavenSent]

Can you guess which one flight 93 crashed on?

None of them... Shanksville has several of these 'scars' on the ground.
Flight 93 did not do a nose dive into the ground. It was SHOT DOWN.
Rumsfeld says Flight 93 was "shot down."
THE FLIGHT 93 FRAUD- Smoking Gun Evidence

[SEAL]

The WTC7 building falling looks extremely suspicious. There was a large bang noise, it was reported ahead of time that the building had fallen despite it not falling yet, I've never heard of any buildings made of steel falling because of fires, especially in such a short time. I watched one of the video's trying to debunk the WTC7 controlled demolition conspiracy and it was pretty bad. As for the WTC and Pentagon, I'm not convinced there's a conspiracy there.

That's what I thought when I saw heaventsend's video's too. But then the brain kicks in again. About the large bang noise: demolishinig a building takes so much more than just one simple large bang. You don't just put one big firecracked under a building and pray it will falls down straight. Just research on demolishing buikings and you will see you have several (like 10) explotions.

About the steel falling of fire: you're correct. It doesn't fall because of a little fire. Just think of the immence power/ force that the dropping of the others buildins where to the foundation on wtc7.

[Reaver]

Are you trying to say that you couldn't set off multiple charges at the same time(or close enough) to sound like one?

[Mythrandir]

Are you trying to say that you couldn't set off multiple charges at the same time(or close enough) to sound like one?

Considering the size of the building and the speed of sound? Not a chance.

[Cops]

Best decision I ever made was ignoring this thread and just making random jokes about tin foil hats.

Worst decision most of you made was arguing this out with him.

[HeavenSent]

There's testimony from an eyewitness that helped on the scene (pictured above - not part of the pentagon officials). From what he says, there were no bodies and really nothing to pick up, except for a few pieces from what he described as the Global Hawk that he did see hit the building. Then how about those 2 cops at the gas station? They saw a plane fly over that wasn't in line with the light poles that were knocked down... and which that other witness, Sam Danner, says the poles were blown off their foundations with small explosive charges and fell in a direction inconsistant with where they would have fallen if a plane had hit them. The hijacker that supposedly flew the plane into the Pentagon failed his flying class with small planes, yet, as reported by veteran pilots, the hijacker did a nearly impossible turn around the Pentagon and swooped down with jetliner 4 stories high and managed to slam into the first floor without touching the grass. Why did he have to do the turn? Why didn't he just fly straight into the building? The side he hit just happen to be undergoing renovations anyway and was nearly vacant. Not to mention that the Pentagon was considering the senario a year earlier... Which was also part of their PNAC plan for 'A New Pearl Harbor' to get the support from the public to further their agenda. Speaking before the Commission, Norman Mineta confirms that Dick Cheney ordered a stand down on 9/11 as the plane was approaching the Pentagon.



Then there's flight 93. The official story is that the passengers fought with the hijackers and the plane lost control and did a nose dive into the ground, yet there's pieces of the plane spread out for as much a eight miles. Rumsfeld says the plane was shot down. Those 'scars' in the ground are quite common in the area and there was no wreckage at the crater. Eye witnesses in the area say they saw a rocket hit the plane.

Regarding the WTC area; Just days before it all happened, 'put options' on the stock market spiked. The asbestos in the towers needed to be removed. The cost to upgrade would have been more than it's worth. The revenue of the towers were falling. Silverstein, a few months before, got the max he could get for it with insurance. Then got paid double for 2 planes. There were already crews set up to renovate the complex beginning with WTC7. WTC7 which was the office for few government intelligence agencies also had a lot of classified documents, including the enron scandle. The day before, Rumsfeld was being asked 'where's all this money that's unaccounted for?' In the towers, several of the floors were vacant. Which would have given some paid-off demolition experts opportunity to prepare the buildings. Marvin bush headed the secruity that shut the buildings down the weekend prior to 9/11. No doubt to prepare the floors that weren't vacant. The National Guard was deployed to the area the night before 9/11 only to find out why the next day. For months prior, people were sending warnings to the Pentagon of a terrorist attack on the towers, only to be ignored on every instance. Then, Condileezza Rice says they never imagined anyone would fly planes into the towers, yet, on the day of 9/11, NORAD was simulating the exact senario, which explains the confusion for scrambling the jets. Several witnesses say they heard explosions coming from the basement levels after the planes hit, yet their testimony was not included in the Commissions report.

Just like politians, the 'experts' like the 9/11 Commissions report and Popular Mechanics don't directly answer the questions that were asked. They blow a lot of hot air without addressing the details of the questions. There's a great book out; it's called the 9/11 Omissions report. It goes into great detail of how the testimonies of witnesses and important evidence was totally ignored. It's like asking a criminal to be his own judge in a trial. When cops pull over suspected criminals, they divided them and get separate testimony, yet with Bush and Cheney, they were inseparable.

You can believe what you're told or you can put the facts together for yourself and have your own opinion. I choose the latter. <_<

[Squeezer]

You can believe what you're told or you can put the facts together for yourself and have your own opinion. I choose the latter. <_<

So says another Alex Jones robot.