Pub Tuning 2017 #1 - Levis - Request For Comments

[Mootland Farmer]

This is walking before you can crawl stuff. If you do not know how Trenchwars Pub should be played, or how you/players want it played, how can you make any changes to the Leviathan, let alone any other setting? I did write Objectives for the zone many years ago, however I don't think they were taken seriously or adhered to, which is unfortunate because they would solve many problems.

Let's say basing is the primary 'fixture' of Public. You have to capture the flag with your team. Close private frequencies and keep Leviathans the same as they are. You would please many 'groups' by doing this. Warbirds can duel in the spawn area, LeviTerrs can still roam around and blast things apart (albeit everything won't be a blue dot anymore) and you would have people going for the flag. Instead of players buying 'PurePub', why don't players buy 'Private Frequencies'?

[rothe]

Let's say basing is the primary 'fixture' of Public. You have to capture the flag with your team. Close private frequencies and keep Leviathans the same as they are. You would please many 'groups' by doing this. Warbirds can duel in the spawn area, LeviTerrs can still roam around and blast things apart (albeit everything won't be a blue dot anymore) and you would have people going for the flag. Instead of players buying 'PurePub', why don't players buy 'Private Frequencies'?

I could live with this and I normally play on private freq and some times make an impact on base when I want to base. That said I havent in the last well I cant member the last time I did a duel so yea please dont get rid of just where WB's just duel in pub imo I love being on private freq and having no one to back me up and everyone shooting at me its a thrill but one I and I think many others could give up if it helps the community at large.

[hellmouth]

I lev a lot, and my suggestion would be to disadvantage strictly the LTs. How? I would make the lev in an LT get kicked out of the LT with 0 energy every couple of minutes. This would make them easier to hunt and they would be forced to choose between only warping to safe or leaving the lev out vulnerable every 2 minutes.

[MHz]

In my view, the Lev should be made the 'defenceless cannon'. Greening one to 20 should be a genuinely difficult and rare event. Remove all of its items - repels/portals. Also, make the antiwarp energy drain for spider less severe, so LTs can be hunted easier. Currently LTs can just warp, warp, warp, warp, rep, warp. Any semi-proficient terrier can easily avoid death. It is only by virtue that few good players actually play LT that it isn't a more devastating combination.

Also, culturally-speaking, I think we should be moving pub towards being a 'training ground' for base and twd. Encouraging ways of playing that are more competitive. Levs are a huge hindrance to that. Lev bombs and bursts account for so many lame deaths that kill off advanced basing. Particularly now that, for many hours of the day, players can expect to be spawned *in base*. This makes items like bursts and rockets so intense, because players never have to use them in getting into base. They are used at a much faster rate in a much smaller area.

So my second suggestion is to make terrier bursts do lanc-bullet damage. A terr is not a 'fighting' ship, it is there to be attached to; there's no reason why it should have such a powerful weapon. If there are two terriers in a 6v6 game, majority of your deaths will be from unplanned burst. Most 'attachable' ships in other zones have no weaponry. If the terr had never had burst, and someone added it now, it would be seen as completely asymmetrical and unnecessary.

We need to reduce the number of random deaths in pub. This helps newbs as much as it helps vets. And it lends itself to more enlightened ways of playing.

[MHz]

#1) -Energy, -recharge, -bomb fire cost, -bullet fire cost
I'd like to try them with half the energy and recharge they have now, but also half the fire cost for bombs and bullets. Essentially, everything would be miniaturized in proportion to energy. It would feel exactly the same as it does now in terms of how often you can fire and how long it takes to recharge from 0 to full. This means Levis could be 1-shot by Lancs, and if not at absolute 100% energy, 1-shot even by Spiders and Terrs. It would also make Javs a much greater risk for them, as well as TKs from other Levis on an LT. This does provide a disadvantage for solo Levs, of course. But keep in mind that no disadvantage was so great as having L2 bombs! And that most ships are still able to basically 1-shot Levs already, so that it's more what's in their bag of tricks (reps, rocket, port, well-timed bullets/bombs) that can keep them alive anyhow. Mainly this change would help Spiders and Terrs... And they're underplayed as it is, so incentivizing them isn't a bad thing.

I like this idea *a lot*. Remove all of its items, as well, bar 1 rep.

[hellmouth]

I couldn't possibly disagree more. If you do the above, you'll make lev only useful in an LT but will not have mitigated any of the issues that make LTs annoying. That's entirely the wrong approach.

[Rab]

I couldn't possibly disagree more. If you do the above, you'll make lev only useful in an LT but will not have mitigated any of the issues that make LTs annoying. That's entirely the wrong approach.

This

[godisdead]

This is walking before you can crawl stuff. If you do not know how Trenchwars Pub should be played, or how you/players want it played, how can you make any changes to the Leviathan, let alone any other setting? I did write Objectives for the zone many years ago, however I don't think they were taken seriously or adhered to, which is unfortunate because they would solve many problems.

Let's say basing is the primary 'fixture' of Public. You have to capture the flag with your team. Close private frequencies and keep Leviathans the same as they are. You would please many 'groups' by doing this. Warbirds can duel in the spawn area, LeviTerrs can still roam around and blast things apart (albeit everything won't be a blue dot anymore) and you would have people going for the flag. Instead of players buying 'PurePub', why don't players buy 'Private Frequencies'?

I agree with these sensible suggestions and map changes. It would make the game better for existing players.

However tweaking ships or maps will not improve the zone more attractive to newer players, it will only serve to make some players happier and some players unhappy. Over the decades I have played, ship changes have come and gone but not made any significant impact on the game. Sure, tweak them to add variety to game play but dont expect it to make the game more attractive to new players which is surely the objective.

I would be more inclined to poll new players or read the negative comments on steam http://store.steampowered.com/app/352700/ to discover why many new players leave the game shortly after starting.

[San Tokie]

Let's have a trial run of free pure pub and see how it does.

If us basing purists have to buy a pure pub, consider ways the basing saboteurs have to pay as well (i.e. having to buy the ability to allow a levi to attach).

Having to buy a private frequency is a good idea, but at times we find ourselves starting a new frequency to save a derailed basing game.

I like the idea of increasing the attach limit for levis. I also like the idea of tweaking it towards even more of a glass cannon.

[hellmouth]

Increasing the attach limit is just as stupid as making the lev 'glass'. People who seriously LT just have the lev kill the terr to charge up. None of those suggestions change that. What needs to happen is just what I said above.

Thank you.

[forwards]

consider ways the basing saboteurs have to pay as well (i.e. having to buy the ability to allow a levi to attach).

I AGREE WITH THIS

Having to buy a private frequency is a good idea, but at times we find ourselves starting a new frequency to save a derailed basing game.

I disagree with the part in bold but mainly because of the part not in bold.
Also

+1

[qan]

The idea of having Levis pay to attach is a pretty interesting one. How would it work? The easiest would be to just subtract a certain amount every time they attach... very very easy to add. But the amount would need to be somewhat low, probably between $100-$1000, or else it could make someone broke quite quickly, and maybe without them noticing. (However, most LTers are experienced members of the zone and do have sizeable stacks of spaceshekels.)


Slightly harder to implement (and probably much more annoying for Levis) would be to !buy an attach privilege. This wouldn't run the risk of causing accidental purchase. But also makes it much harder to plan for attaching. Getting to 20 bounty and then having to do a !buy just to attach is pretty awkward.

[forwards]

it could make someone broke quite quickly, and maybe without them noticing. (However, most LTers are experienced members of the zone and do have sizeable stacks of spaceshekels.)

I think this was the point. lol
Also shekel = Israel currency

Slightly harder to implement

This I'm against

and probably much more annoying for Levis

THIS I SUPPORT

[San Tokie]

With regard to the cost of attaching as a lev, why not keep the price of pure pub in the same ballpark?

Better yet, what if the levi terr players had to buy their own pub instead?

What about taking away the lev's ability to attach altogether?

Or taking away a Terrier's warp capability when a lev is attached. Perhaps also taking away the lev's ability to warp in general.

What if the levi was an actual suicide bomber? Or if it only had one L3 bomb and then it downgrades to L2?

[hellmouth]

Qan, how difficult would it be to implement a rule which kicks a lev out of LT after a minute with 0 energy? The !buy idea sucks IMO because it means levs effectively can't base.