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  • Thunder Appeal

    Exalt was not eligible to play in the TWLD match against Thunder today. He played against us Round 1 of TWL with the squad Rape, and today, he played against us once again with the squad Dynasty. According to rule 3.05c he must wait one round before he is eligible to play.

    3.05c Waiting Period

    The Standard Waiting Period for roster eligibility goes as follows: Any player joining a squad for participation in Trench Wars League (this includes changing names), will be subject to a 1 Round Waiting Period after being accepted by the squad Captain. Players will not be eligible to participate in Trench Wars League matches until a round occurs in which the player cannot play (Example: Players joining the Tuesday after round 3 will not be allowed to play in any games until round 5). Saturday 1PM EST is the start of the next round.

    Key words from this include "one round" so it doesn't matter if Exalt waited one, two, three or even four weeks. The fact of the matter is he played Round 1 vs Thunder (while joined to the squad Rape), and the "one round" he must wait should have been round 2 when he joined Dynasty (which means he shouldn't have been eligible to play vs us). It's not our fault that there was an incompetent host. Everyone knows the rules. As even more evidence that they knew this rule was the fact that Dynasty even asked whether Exalt was eligible. Just because the host incorrectly let Exalt play, that doesn't excuse the fact that Dynasty clearly broke the rule. Dynasty should have responsibility to play. Thunder should not be punished by an incompetent host letting Exalt play; it's clear Dynasty knew the rules but managed to get around them due to an incompetent host

    According to rule 9.03, it clearly states that:

    9.03 Forfeits

    a) If a squad is unable to submit a valid line-up within the allotted time, that squad will automatically forfeit the match and will receive a warning.


    It clearly states that the if the SQUAD is unable to submit a valid lineup, they automatically forfeit, it doesn't matter whether the host was right/wrong. The fact is, Dynasty (the squad) was unable to submit a valid line-up.

    Also, according to rule 10.02:


    10.02 Ineligible Players

    If a player has been found over the lag limits and has been removed from the game by a referee or TWL Op, is sitting out due to the Standard Waiting Period, or fits other non-eligible reasons, the player may not participate or be reconsidered for that game to play unless specific approval has been given by a TWL Op. This includes substitutions. If an ineligible player is added, the game will be killed and the offending squad will receive a forfeit loss and is officially warned. (see Rule 3.05a-III).


    Some people may bring up the fact that "the player may not participate or be reconsidered for that game to play unless specific approval has been given by a TWL Op". It's quite clear that this part of the rule is made for special exceptions (ie. someone hacks a cap's account and axes someone). According to the rules, it's very clear that Exalt should NOT have been eligible according to rule 3.05c. It doesn't matter whether he waited one week, two weeks, or three weeks, the rules clearly state he must wait ONE ROUND.

    Finally, people may argue that Exalt went 0-5. But it doesn't matter, the fact is, he was added and he shouldn't have been in the game at all. Also, just cause he went 0-5 doesn't mean he didn't have an impact on the game. Someone could go 0-5 but lure 10 kills for their teammates, whose to say that if he did lure 10 kills and still went 0-5, he didn't create an impact on the outcome of the game.

    In conclusion, Exalt was ineligible and clearly should not have played, and since he did, Dynasty should have to forfeit.


    Sincerely,

    Draft, Quartz, Creature, Ease, Kian, Eelam, Tsunami.
    Last edited by Draft; 01-05-2009, 02:07 AM.
    (Steadman)>they went out drinking... ogron siaxis and siaxis gf
    (Steadman)>apparently ogron is EXTREMELY morbidly obese and ridiculously sweaty
    (Steadman)>and he spend the entire night being awkward and staring at siaxis gf
    (Steadman)>and after that they did not meet up again...

    Iron Survivor> you missed something in your sig. he also smells like cheese

  • #2
    Lol, nice attempt to reverse an otherwise honorable and close defeat.

    But as is with my experience with the site and some players on Rape, it wouldn't give permission to a name prematurely. Since the site and the TWL Bots are linked together like TWD and the rosters there.

    You physically can't add a person on roster before the week wait, so he must have been eligible.

    If I'm wrong, lemme know, but this sounds dumb to me so far.
    DELETED

    Comment


    • #3
      Good try thunder better luck nextime.

      Comment


      • #4
        1.) The Ref told us it was okay before the match, ask him

        2.) The rosters don't lie, i was added to TWL roster after waiting a week

        I'm sorry thunder that you lost a game, I truely am, however your blatant misrepresentation and abuse of the rules won't win here, I made every precaution necessary before the match including talk to TWL Ops and our host, the TWL Ref, to make sure I was eligable to play. Please walk single file toward the exit. Thank you, have a nice day.
        Last edited by Exalt; 01-05-2009, 02:13 AM.
        RaCka> imagine standing out as a retard on subspace
        RaCka> mad impressive

        Comment


        • #5
          mods dropped the ball on this one, should have been prevented with a couple extra lines of code in the twl website, but riistar can't do everything.

          twl site roster setup page is only set for the 1 week delay, whereas the rule states 1 round.

          ref said it was ok, but in the past when the ref got it wrong we replayed after regular season games, correct?
          Gripe> apok is good but he's completely wasted his youth playing this game

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by tragiK View Post
            mods dropped the ball on this one, should have been prevented with a couple extra lines of code in the twl website, but riistar can't do everything.

            twl site roster setup page is only set for the 1 week delay, whereas the rule states 1 round.

            ref said it was ok, but in the past when the ref got it wrong we replayed after regular season games, correct?
            not sure, but me going 0-5 had no effect whatsoever on the outcome of the game, so if thunder does win any sort of appeal then clearly the system is unjust in every way possible

            also I talked to TWL Mods not just the Ref, so Thunder, im sorry, fail
            RaCka> imagine standing out as a retard on subspace
            RaCka> mad impressive

            Comment


            • #7
              im pretty sure that squad captains agree to knowing the rules and to obey by them when they accept twl invitations. Not 100% sure but im pretty sure, thus it shouldnt have mattered what the dumbwin host said

              cant even beat us with a valid lineup, takes cheating.. sigh newbies
              1:Blasphemy> if ur gonna put a jav in line
              1:Blasphemy> we gotta have people like eelam and kian in
              1:Blasphemy> from the beginning

              1:exquisite> u know whats wierd
              1:exquisite> having ur dad talk to u on AIM
              1:exquisite> like zzzzz
              1:Ease> you think thats wierd?
              1:exquisite> ya
              1:Ease> try skipping school
              1:Ease> and having ur mom IM you
              1:Kian> LOL EASE
              1:Collusion> LOOL
              1:exquisite> LOL

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Draft View Post
                9.03 Forfeits

                a) If a squad is unable to submit a valid line-up within the allotted time, that squad will automatically forfeit the match and will receive a warning.

                10.02 Ineligible Players

                If a player has been found over the lag limits and has been removed from the game by a referee or TWL Op, is sitting out due to the Standard Waiting Period, or fits other non-eligible reasons, the player may not participate or be reconsidered for that game to play unless specific approval has been given by a TWL Op. This includes substitutions. If an ineligible player is added, the game will be killed and the offending squad will receive a forfeit loss and is officially warned. (see Rule 3.05a-III).
                1) the squad was perfectly able to submit a legal line, and did because

                2) specific approval was given by the ref.

                I just dont see how you want them to forfeit given those circumstances.

                EDIT: none of you even knew any of these rules before 10 mins ago. The site let him join and when the ref checked it it was cool.

                More food for thought:

                11.08 Check Eligibility before the Start of the Game
                If you are unsure of the eligibility of any of your players, it is imperative that you contact a TWL operator before the match begins. This way you can avoid being disqualified due to playing ineligible players.
                Last edited by Izor; 01-05-2009, 02:30 AM.
                I'm just a middle-aged, middle-eastern camel herdin' man
                I got a 2 bedroom cave here in North Afghanistan

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Izor View Post
                  1) the squad was perfectly able to submit a legal line, and did because

                  2) specific approval was given by the ref.

                  I just dont see how you want them to forfeit given those circumstances.
                  they are fishing izor, but too bad its cleared up already, the bad thing is thunder looks worse and worse by the day with this stuff... its kinda stupid that they chose this game to use their rule abuse on... shouldve saved it for when something really mattered like them getting knocked out of playoffs
                  RaCka> imagine standing out as a retard on subspace
                  RaCka> mad impressive

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I don't give a shit about either Dynasty or Thunder, but the fact of the matter is that the rule was broken and whether or not Thunder is doing it because they lost (and they are =P ), they do have a valid appeal.

                    If a TWL op really did give them the OK to add Exalt then they shouldn't be punished, but the game should be replayed because the appeal is legit.
                    Last edited by Stabwound; 01-05-2009, 03:45 AM.
                    sdg

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Stabwound View Post
                      I don't give a shit about either Quicksand or Thunder, but the fact of the matter is that the rule was broken and whether or not they're doing it because they lost (and they are =P ), they do have a valid appeal.

                      If a TWL op really did give them the OK to add Exalt then they shouldn't be punished, but the game should be replayed because the appeal is legit.
                      11.02 Ineligible Players

                      If a player has been found over the lag limits and has been removed from the game by a referee or TWL Op, is sitting out due to the Standard Waiting Period, or fits other non-eligible reasons, the player may not participate or be reconsidered for that game to play unless specific approval has been given by a TWL Op. This includes substitutions. If an ineligible player is added, the game will be killed and the offending squad will receive a forfeit loss and is officially warned. (see Rule 3.05a-III).

                      The TWL Ref specifically said I was eligable and OK to play, as Dynasty asked BEFORE THE GAME if I was ok to play. No rules were broken on our part. We did everything necessary to assure we played fairly and fully within the rules set up for TWL.

                      Also, I talked to the TWL Head Op. I'm sure she can explain if you want to ask, but doing this over forums is bad form Thunder. It's very unconstructive on your part, and also disruptive in nature for the TWL staff who do a very good job at keeping things running smoothly after huge problems with the hacker 3 weeks ago and downtime with holidays.

                      In the end, your appeal is purely bad sportsmanship to the next level, and I'm happy to say you won't win. We covered our asses beforehand knowing how your squad tries to abuse the rules throughout many seasons of TWL. We are fully within the rules, and have every right to the win that we received.

                      Thanks again,

                      Exalt
                      RaCka> imagine standing out as a retard on subspace
                      RaCka> mad impressive

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        nice sig phiz :>

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Exalt View Post
                          11.02 Ineligible Players

                          If a player has been found over the lag limits and has been removed from the game by a referee or TWL Op, is sitting out due to the Standard Waiting Period, or fits other non-eligible reasons, the player may not participate or be reconsidered for that game to play unless specific approval has been given by a TWL Op. This includes substitutions. If an ineligible player is added, the game will be killed and the offending squad will receive a forfeit loss and is officially warned. (see Rule 3.05a-III).
                          Well, if we're going to get technical, a TWL Op is not the same thing as a TWL Ref, and you were therefore not "given specific approval by a TWL Op."
                          sdg

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            EDIT: Oh.
                            7:Warcraft> Why don't white people hit their kids anymore?


                            Duel Pasta> great
                            Duel Pasta> I spilled juice on my face


                            Tower> NATIONAL WEED YOUR GARDEN DAY


                            TWLB Champion Season 12
                            TWLJ Champion Season 11
                            TWLB All-Star Season 10
                            Best undeserved TWL title winner in Trench Wars history

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Really? REALLY? Thunder guys, this is fucking low. Like... reeaaaLLLYYY low. It was a close game, he waited weeks. Are you really going attack this? I don't even know why you need to, or better yet WANT to. I figure that you guys were a squad that could take a close loss and not to sink to such desperation. He waited weeks to play. Don't fucking throw the definition of the word out there - you know how this looks. Just sad, that a squad with such status would pull something so retarded.

                              Honestly guys, tons of you are awesome, pull up, hard.

                              Originally posted by Exalt View Post
                              not sure, but me going 0-5 had no effect whatsoever on the outcome of the game, so if thunder does win any sort of appeal then clearly the system is unjust in every way possible

                              also I talked to TWL Mods not just the Ref, so Thunder, im sorry, fail
                              I missed the scores, did he really go 0-5? You think this needs to be replayed? You'd technically have a worse shot with him out, having a score like that?

                              Originally posted by KiAN View Post
                              im pretty sure that squad captains agree to knowing the rules and to obey by them when they accept twl invitations. Not 100% sure but im pretty sure, thus it shouldnt have mattered what the dumbwin host said

                              cant even beat us with a valid lineup, takes cheating.. sigh newbies
                              Kian come on man, you know that isn't really cheating. They aren't lagging, double squadding, using ce, whatever. Exalt was on that squad plenty of time, the definition of a word is a flimsy arguement when compared to the real cold logic of a situation man. That was a cheap shot bro
                              Last edited by Capital Knockers; 01-05-2009, 03:15 AM.
                              7:Knockers> how'd you do it Paul?
                              7:Knockers> sex? money? power?
                              7:PaulOakenfold> *puts on sunglasses* *flies away*

                              1:vys> I EVEN TOLD MY MUM I WON A PIZZA

                              7:Knockers> the suns not yellow, its chicken
                              7:Salu> that's drug addict talk if i ever saw it

                              1:chuckle> im tired of seeing people get killed and other people just watching simply saying "MURDER. RACISM. BAD"
                              1:chuckle> ive watched the video twice now

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