The thread where I will attempt to answer questions you have regarding Christianity

[SpiderMage]

That's a fallacious analogy. Not letting a family member into your house is different than throwing them into a lake of burning sulpher.

How about this...there is a tornado coming, and this estranged family member in your analogy shows up to take shelter in your basement with the rest of the family.

If you love your family member unconditionally (as in the Christian claim of love is), do you really think that you aren't being a total fuckhead by sending him to his/her death by not letting them into the storm shelter?

There's a name for that in the real world: Criminally negiligent homicide.

Bio actually answered it far better than I did, read his post.

Bio also has to answer my question :grin:

And Zeus, those are all Old Testament, laws of men not of God. Most, if not all modern day Christians go by the New Testament, which is the teachings of Christ and the laws of God, which he(Christ) actually went against some of the laws of the Old Testament, because as I said, they were laws of men.

[Bioture]

Actually, the "unconditional love" part I described is what I have been told is the reason why I should be a Christian. So, you agree that Christian love is not unconditional? And if the answer is no, then I would argue that you don't understand what true love really is.

In the past, I have accepted Jesus, but the lord did not answer the door. So I have decided not to waste my life second-guessing myself on this subject. He isn't waiting patiently by the door, because there is no door. I played by Christianity's rules, but it turns out the game is rigged.

The love IS unconditional, and to argue about what true love really is would be kinda pointless because you're already set in your beliefs on this matter. But how would you know if the love is unconditional unless you accepted it as such? I don't have the power to sway you from believing otherwise other than to say that God's love for you is unconditional, but it's up to you to accept this love. He doesn't love you more or less even if you don't accept Jesus. But then again we just have one life to decide whether or not it's right.

I'm sorry that your acceptance of Jesus turned out that way, a lot of the times I ask myself the same question - Is this all that christianity is? Shouldn't there be more? Shouldn't I become a better person at this or that or feel differently about a different ideal? I came to the conclusion that to find these truths, whatever they are, is to run towards God and not away from Him. I realize these words are of little consequence to you... but in the larger scheme of things, God did put my 7 years as a athiest (I thought I was christian before) to good use.

[Subjugation]

I can play the question back to you: If you spent all your life trying not to be with someone (for whatever reason) that loved you and waited for you, do you deserve to be with that person just as you find out how messed up things are when they're not around?

For the flaming sulfer and etc. Personally I just see it as a eternity without God or an eternity with God - and we only have this lifetime to choose.

Deserve has nothing to do with it. Jesus was very clear on his philosophy toward forgiveness. And it's not very helpful that you answered my question with another question.

An eternity without God? What in the heck does that mean? Limbo? Hanging out by the 3rd ring of Saturn jerking off and dodging asteroids? Reincarnation over and over?

If God is full of revenge and doesn't know what unconditional love is, I really don't see what's so great about him. He sounds a bit of an asshole.

[Sufficient]

Here is a good resource provided by a fairly well known Christian apolegist, Ravi Zacharias. I've listened to a few of his stuff, and he speaks intelligently and articulately. Don't expect blow-you-outta-the-water material tho, cuz you're going into the discussion having already decided that the answer you will hear is wrong.

At least listen to this particular Q&A he gave at Georgia Tech in the US. Basically students asked him questions on the spot ... so he had no real way to prepare beforehand.

http://resources.christianity.com/ministries/rzim/main

It's in the archives.

8/8/04 Question and Answer Session (part 2 of 2)
8/1/04 Question and Answer Session (part 1 of 2)

Get past the cheesy intro first tho. Also there are also some silly convoluted questions ... so just skip around to some other the other questions unless you wanna hear some really complicated non-applicable-to-real-life questions and answers.

[Bioture]

Deserve has nothing to do with it. Jesus was very clear on his philosophy toward forgiveness. And it's not very helpful that you answered my question with another question.

An eternity without God? What in the heck does that mean? Limbo? Hanging out by the 3rd ring of Saturn jerking off and dodging asteroids? Reincarnation over and over?

If God is full of revenge and doesn't know what unconditional love is, I really don't see what's so great about him. He sounds a bit of an asshole.

If we didn't accept forgiveness, then it's just like it isnt there... I don't have the skill to answer your question regarding God's actions to your satisfaction because the problem is you don't have this faith.

My answer regarding eternity without God is just as such... that you aren't with Him. Whatever you want to make up about that would be awesome speculation because all I have to go on is the fire and brimstone you seem to know so much about.

[Bioture]

Here is a good resource provided by a fairly well known Christian apolegist, Ravi Zacharias. I've listened to a few of his stuff, and he speaks intelligently and articulately. Don't expect blow-you-outta-the-water material tho, cuz you're going into the discussion having already decided that the answer you will hear is wrong.

I went to see Ravi when he came to Penn State last year! This guy is SMART. If anyone can put the question of God to your heart, this man can!

[Subjugation]

But how would you know if the love is unconditional unless you accepted it as such?

If love is unconditional, by definition it means it has no conditions. If you have to accept Jesus first in order to him to love you back, that is a huge condition.

I realize these words are of little consequence to you... but in the larger scheme of things, God did put my 7 years as a athiest (I thought I was christian before) to good use.

Thanks. And I'm actually glad that you are at peace. I know I'm usually a cynical and sarcastic fuck, but I am actually being sincere in this case. We clearly disagree and will probably never get beyond that, but I still think real Christians (like you and Disliked, for example) are good people.

[404 Not Found]

I pray to Opie & Anthony....such devine radio

[Bioture]

If love is unconditional, by definition it means it has no conditions. If you have to accept Jesus first in order to him to love you back, that is a huge condition.

That isn't a contition, in the sense I was trying to explain it to you - please read my above post more carefully. God doesn't start loving you because you have Jesus or some magical doodad thats able to harness his love (although it would rock and whoever makes it would be rich). He has always loved you. The problem is that you wont find this to be true unless you acknowledge that He has always loved you. God didn't put Jesus to the earth because everyone who accepted Jesus would be loved - but as basic as John 3:16 puts it, "for God so loved the world," the love already existed.

Thanks. And I'm actually glad that you are at peace. I know I'm usually a cynical and sarcastic fuck, but I am actually being sincere in this case. We clearly disagree and will probably never get beyond that, but I still think real Christians (like you and Disliked, for example) are good people.

We're not so different, maybe open the door a little wider next time and see what happens.

[Sufficient]

What makes Christianity any more trustworthy than any other ancient religion?
First of all it's well known the Christian, Hebrew and Islamic god are all the same. (Allah is the arab translation of God, only reason Europeans started using Allah when talking about their god is because it was important for us to differ from them, which was a key-element in creating the European identity). Anyway, do you believe these are all the same god? If so, do you also believe that throughout the ages, since the idea of god(s) goes back to Mesopotamian times, everyone was basically worshipping the same god but until the Christians everyone got it 'wrong'. And what about the religions from civilizations on continents who had never even heard of a place called Jeruzalem. Now that's kind of cruel of God, isn't it? What I also never understood is if there's a God why would he be so vague about what's the true way to worship him. All he ever did for us was to create a lot of different religions, who've been in a clash with eachother. Resulting in many religious wars in his name between civilizations since the ancients times (example: Crusades, Jihad).
I think I'd rather go to hell than believe in a god who is as shitty at his job as he is. And to all Christians, I hope for you guys God isn't in charge of Heaven aswell, otherwise I wouldn't be surprised it's an even bigger shithole than earth is. (<insert Ricky Gervais quote from 'Animals' and/or Eddie Izzard quote from 'Glorious'>)

I hate threads about religion. Someone please reply with a quote from the bible or another holy scripture, so I can laugh real hard and leave this thread behind me.

Edit: Oh nm, Bioture already quoted the 10 commandments.

I didn't listen to this, but I think it'd be helpful in tryin to answer your questions. ***Just a heads up, these are pretty long, and perhaps a bit hard to get your head around, even for me, as a college grad*** So don't expect some simplistic short answer that takes a min to answer. One more thing, I've listened to a few of Ravi's lectures, but I dunno if I've listened to the ones below. So I can't really answer any questions you have about Ravi's material ... however, I'm sure if you email him, you'll get some sort of response.

http://resources.christianity.com/ministries/rzim/main
look under archives on the left

4/24/05 The Uniqueness of Christ in World Religions, Part 2
4/17/05 The Uniqueness of Christ in World Religions, Part 1
4/10/05 The Uniqueness of Christ in History, Part 2
4/3/05 The Uniqueness of Christ in History, Part 1
2/15/04 Jesus Among Other Gods (part 2 of 2)
2/8/04 Jesus Among Other Gods (part 1 of 2)

===

Sry for the constant referring to Ravi's lectures ... here's another one ... perhaps more relevant to J=T's questions:

6/13/04 Who Are You God (part 2 of 2)
6/6/04 Who Are You God (part 1 of 2)

===

This might be more relevant to the majority of us, as students.

8/17/03 The Top Five Questions Students Ask (part 5 of 5)
8/10/03 The Top 5 Questions from Students (part 4 of 5)
8/3/03 The Top 5 Questions from Students (part 3 of 5)
7/27/03 The Top 5 Questions from Students (part 2 of 5)
7/20/03 The Top 5 Questions from Students (part 1 of 5)

[SpiderMage]

If love is unconditional, by definition it means it has no conditions. If you have to accept Jesus first in order to him to love you back, that is a huge condition.



Thanks. And I'm actually glad that you are at peace. I know I'm usually a cynical and sarcastic fuck, but I am actually being sincere in this case. We clearly disagree and will probably never get beyond that, but I still think real Christians (like you and Disliked, for example) are good people.

I don't think we have to accept him first in order to love us back, I think he already loves us and he's waiting for us to accept that love. When people are like "Jesus love you" and the person who that is said to just shrugs it off and goes "yeah whatever", Jesus still loves that person, even though he basically just brushed him off with that statement.

Bio I have a question and it's one 've brought up in a different thread(one I made actually).

'm still a fairly new Christian, 've asked my girlfriend many questions and my grandmother many questions, but a lot of the time I don't think 'm doing things right I guess, like 'm not very good at being a Christian. I don't go to church and I haven't been reading the Bible as much, and unless I actually ask Abby or my grandma about it, I don't read and then sit and think about what I just read, I read it, enjoy what sounds right and feel mad at things wrong(like Judas or the law makers). And I still keep a lot of my old views, I think everyone is allowed to do what they believe is right, 'm not one of those Christians who go out and say you must be this way or must be that way, and I still have no problem with nude or even sexual art, though a coworker who is Christian says that because I am an artist and have been doing art all my life, I don't see it as sinful yet, which something like that really makes me feel hurt, not because it may be true, but because that sounds just... wrong.

[Ilya]

whats with the whole putting a fish on your car thing?

[Bioture]

Bio I have a question and it's one 've brought up in a different thread(one I made actually).

'm still a fairly new Christian, 've asked my girlfriend many questions and my grandmother many questions, but a lot of the time I don't think 'm doing things right I guess, like 'm not very good at being a Christian. I don't go to church and I haven't been reading the Bible as much, and unless I actually ask Abby or my grandma about it, I don't read and then sit and think about what I just read, I read it, enjoy what sounds right and feel mad at things wrong(like Judas or the law makers). And I still keep a lot of my old views, I think everyone is allowed to do what they believe is right, 'm not one of those Christians who go out and say you must be this way or must be that way, and I still have no problem with nude or even sexual art, though a coworker who is Christian says that because I am an artist and have been doing art all my life, I don't see it as sinful yet, which something like that really makes me feel hurt, not because it may be true, but because that sounds just... wrong.

You're not going to be a perfect Christian. Ever. Jesus was the only one of those. The real problem here is would you trust God with directing your life and your heart? I think one of the least motivating parts about the religion is that when you accept Christ, your sins are revealed and most people are like OH NO NOT ALL OF THEM. Yes, all of them. So the struggle continues as we grow closer to God. Just remember that your relationship with God is your own. Whats the main ingredient in any relationship? Trust. If you asked Him, would you trust Him or would you trust... you?

If its of any comfort, I ask myself that question every day. And apparently so does a lot of christians everywhere. Although I may know the correct thing to do in my heart and because God said so, I may not actually do it because I'm not all that smart. For example I really don't believe in abstinence before marriage though I know its wrong. But in my heart I know I'm just trying to justifying the sin instead of repenting that sin.

[Bioture]

whats with the whole putting a fish on your car thing?

awesome question, really. I think its actually an ancient symbol from some ancient language that was synonymous to Jesus christ. Put it on your car, you take jesus with you when you drive! Yay!

Though I do find that people who have those things drive just as badly.

[Ephemeral]

Why did most all miracles, in all major religions, all stop approximately 2000 years ago? Is the most likely reason because they were simply unexplained things going on or that God choose to stop doing them?