War?

[gran guerrero]

404 I'm ready to get on my knees for you.

[Displaced]

truth....

I've said this for years, and it is one of the areas i will debate with anyone since i have first hand experience from the Middle East. (Ive spent more than half of my life in the Middle East, and no I am not of Arabic descent nor am i Muslim)

I still don't understand why it is so hard for most Americans to fathom that over 90% of Arabs do not want the US to have bases or any kind of presence in the ME, yet the US won't give up and still try to gain as much of a economic foothold in the region as possible.

Ive said this atleast a thousand times, but one of the largest reasons for animosity in the ME is due to the US presence in Saudi Arabia, the locals absolutely hate the fact that US troops are stationed in their "Holy Land", and if they had their way would kick them all out of the region. (This ofc wont happen as long as its rules follow the plans set by King Fahd, which Abdullah bin Fahd is doing... which is a bit of a shame since i think the ME might have been better of had Sultan bin Fahd been the successor, but thats another topic entirely :P)

The US presence in Iraq is also a problem, many see the US presence in Iraq as a springboard to other operations in the Middle East, and quite franckly this is something that i am somewhat apprehensive of. Not tho mention the fact that many still hail Saddam Hussein as a hero after the first Gulf War, as he was able to "withstand the US onslaught". (ok, not quite the whole truth since the US wouldve got him had they wanted to, but the truth is irrelevant :P) Others view Saddam as a martyr who gave his life fighting the oppressive United States... (which again is not my view, but the view of many of the people who reside in the area)

The Israel - Palestine issue has been around forever, and it will continue to be around for as long as there are people living in the ME. The conflict is so far gone, and is so rooted in the psyche of the people, that I personally find it very hard to forsee a cease-fire or peace negotiation that will actually hold.
I also find it improbable the the gulf states will stop supporting organisations like Hamas or Fatah al Islamiia, or that the US will stop supporting Israel, nor do I see Israel leaving the occupied areas of Palestine, and giving Palestine Jerusalem.

Iran, the iran issue has been covered earlier by gran and 404, so i wont go any deeper into that, but you think people are pleased about it?

As for possible "solutions" to the whole problem, I still can't see any viable alternatives to pulling out of the region completely, It should ease some of the animocity against the US in time, and although i would not be able to predict what would happen to Israel or the fact that the government in KSA may be toppled without US support, it would work itself out eventually.
You cannot force change onto a country or set of countries and expect things to actually change over night, peoples political beliefs, perceptions, religious views, traditions, etc do not change in a matter of months, it takes time, and these would develop faster if people were allowed to make up their own mind, rather than being told what to do.

[404 Not Found]

Ive said this atleast a thousand times, but one of the largest reasons for animosity in the ME is due to the US presence in Saudi Arabia, the locals absolutely hate the fact that US troops are stationed in their "Holy Land", and if they had their way would kick them all out of the region. (This ofc wont happen as long as its rules follow the plans set by King Fahd, which Abdullah bin Fahd is doing... which is a bit of a shame since i think the ME might have been better of had Sultan bin Fahd been the successor, but thats another topic entirely.

The U.S. has been out of Suadi Arabia for awhile now...since we left the Prince Sultan Air Base in 2003.

[Displaced]

? i know for a fact that there are still troops stationed in tabuk, hofuf, dammam, dhahran, yanbu and taif.

sure, not as many as before the "pull out", but they are still around.

[Cops]

what do 99.9% of these posts have to do with georgia or russia, did i miss something

Normally I'd agree with you but I think America's response to such a situation as this is important. It's also important to consider the ramifications of opposing this war head on or just opposing it by having 'our' leaders condemn Russia's actions.

[gran guerrero]

what do 99.9% of these posts have to do with georgia or russia, did i miss something

because tw forums knows no bounds.

but in relevance to the thread, shit is going down

[404 Not Found]

? i know for a fact that there are still troops stationed in tabuk, hofuf, dammam, dhahran, yanbu and taif.

sure, not as many as before the "pull out", but they are still around.

The majority are supposedly out, but one never knows...and I would be last to know for sure. The D.O.D. made note that there are 400 troops in SA for training of Saudi military personel. Do I believe that? I dunno...most likely there are more, but the majority of what once occupied the Prince Sultan Air Base are gone.

[Displaced]

i dont have any clue as to the actual number of troops still stationed in KSA, but im sure its a damn sight more than 400.

although i havent personally been in KSA for over 10 years, i know people living there, and people who go there frequently for business, and what ive been told, there is still a substantial presence in the KSA.

[404 Not Found]

[Heroin Bob]

OMG HAHAHAHAHAH IM STEALING THAT IMAGE

[Displaced]

that made my day :turned:

[FarScape]

Never mind.:fear:

[FarScape]

I wrote long post up there, but I decided to delete it. I think my English isn't good enough to speak about those issues here. Maybe I should avoid those political arguments, I feel uncomfortable debate with language that I don't master like mother tongue.

Ill just say that the history prove us right and wrong in many times and places. We need to look to the future and learn from the past. For Iraqis and Afganists, I believe the future will be much better than before, Without entering the debate if U.S invasion was justified or not.
Just see what happened to countries that U.S supported in Europe after the world war 2, watch South Korea compared to north. Watch us in the middle-east, how we became a powerful country.You ear about the wars we are having with Arabs, but much less about the development and researches in technology, farming and medical, that the whole world benefit.

Yes, even the greatest nation that help many countries, is not protected from criticism, and isn't really pure from doing wrongs, but some people are just having those thoughts against U.S and forgetting that its actually because the U.S that they can speak it up...

[kthx]

I was going to post something serious, but that yahoo picture put me in too good of a mood for it right now

[Heroin Bob]

I was going to post something serious, but that yahoo picture put me in too good of a mood for it right now

true your hosting events again? i might come back for one if you do me right.