WTF Japan? Epic thread of problems

[Liquid Blue]

Now to the discrepancies. Let's say you're a Christian. I'm presuming you know the foundational stuff so I'll skip it. My question to you is this - how do you justify faith if you don't act upon it? God doesn't need us to do anything - you're quite right about that, but it's not for His sake we do good deeds, it's for our sake. As a Christian, when you help someone else in need, you're not doing it for the sake of doing it anymore, you're doing it for God's glory. Now, if something irks you about that, then you need to have a chat with the big guy about where "glory" should go.

That's the thing, I'm not doing it for God's Glory. I never even think about that when I do something to help someone out, or to justify my faith. I just do it and move on. I don't need to justify my faith, that's why it's called faith. It's just there.

You claim that as a Christian you don't need to "live for Jesus," then I ask you, what is it that you live for? Again, how will you justify your faith acording to James 2:20?
http://mikeratliff.wordpress.com/200...works-is-dead/

I live to help the people around me and to reach the point where I can financially support myself and still have money and time left over to give and help people even more than I do now. If that falls under your category of "living for Jesus" ok, but if anyone asks me I'm not going to say I live for Jesus.

The problem with your assumption lies here: God does everything, we literally do NOTHING for Him because he doesn't need it.

No, I'm saying God doesn't need us to do good deeds in his name, not because he does everything but because he's God and he doesn't need us praising him every 5 seconds. I think of him as mad chill, a being that doesn't need his followers to constantly praise him or do good things to live for him or God's Glory- he's content in the fact that there are people that believe in him, in what he stands for and do their part to help their fellow man.

Christ died so that we may live, now our lives are our own. These things are biblically wrong. Granted, doing the right thing is never wrong, but what are your intentions? A hungry person will be hungry the day after you feed him - we need more than bread to stay alive - and I'm assuming you know this.

I don't really have intentions when I do something, I just do it. If I repeatedly saw someone who kept asking for food I would eventually try to help them get on the path of being able to feed themselves instead of feeding them every day.

So the next time someone tells you they've been spreading God around, instead of thinking of it as something they're doing to get on God's good side, maybe you can appreciate the fact that God WANTS us to share our faith, even though he doesn't NEED it. Besides, if you had something that was great, and you got it for free (free pancakes at ihop mmm), would you not tell your friends? Wouldn't that be doing the right thing for the sake of doing the right thing?

The problem I have with how it's spread around, is alot of people (preachers and members of the congregation) use heaven and hell as one of the main reasons to do God's will and to show God how much you love him; which I find wrong. It's hypocritical and selfish to talk about spreading gods love just so you don't go to hell or show God how much you love him by doing this or that.

And to tie your pancake analogy with your first Christianity post, it's like saying a big factor for all these suicides, depression and social problems is because Japan has less than 1,000 IHOP's in the whole country. Just because something is free and I like it doesn't mean it's a major factor in whether or not a country can avoid major social problems.

Edit: so to tie it back to the thread, do Japanese people NEED God? Absolutely. We all do, regardless of whether or not we choose to acknowledge it.

Well with an attitude like that what's the point of discussing it with you? That's like me saying regardless of what you think I'm still going to believe what I believe.

Does God need me in Japan filling up the heads of natives with stories of salvation and Jesus? No. Am I doing something God commands all Christians to do? Yes. And by obeying you give glory to God.

I guess I can see where you're going with that, but I just don't feel like it makes sense to me anymore.

[Galleleo]

What I am wondering is what makes you right to judge what those people need Bioture? Maybe I feel that you need the atheist way, but I don't come to your house and spread the atheist word.

Who are you to say that they need god and christianity, why would that be better for them than being Shinto or Buddhist?

And no I am not really waiting for you to answer those questions. Because really the answer is that it is all subjective and personal. To you christianity is the answer, to me atheist is the way, to some Japanese Shinto is the way, to some Australians Islam is the way, etc. etc. It is not up to you to decide what other people should believe in and it is not up to anyone else.

[Bioture]

I'll briefly respond to only the things I see here as heretical - not in the i'm-going-to-burn-you-because-you're a-witch meaning, but as being unbiblical. We can take this conversation off this thread after this if you wish, because I don't want to derail the thread. Largely, we are in agreement.

I don't need to justify my faith, that's why it's called faith. It's just there.

Maybe "justify" was a poor word choice. But what I was trying to get at is that there is a response to your faith.

if anyone asks me I'm not going to say I live for Jesus.

As a Christian, what do you live for then? Your job? Your money? Your spouse? Is Christ not the "Bread of Life" as he claims in the bible?

I think of him as mad chill, a being that doesn't need his followers to constantly praise him or do good things to live for him

While agree that God is gentle in some ways, we have to remember that this is the same God that asked us for sacrifices (old testament), parted the red sea, made a bunch of jews wander the desert for 40 years, etc. etc.

I don't really have intentions when I do something, I just do it.

I'm sure that before you help someone, you intend to help them.

Well with an attitude like that what's the point of discussing it with you? That's like me saying regardless of what you think I'm still going to believe what I believe.

This is not so much my attitude or my beliefs, but what scripture says - which supercedes our "beliefs" which could be wrong. When I make the claim that "everyone needs Christ in order to enter heaven" can you argue this point as a Christian?

And to tie your pancake analogy with your first Christianity post, it's like saying a big factor for all these suicides, depression and social problems is because Japan has less than 1,000 IHOP's in the whole country. Just because something is free and I like it doesn't mean it's a major factor in whether or not a country can avoid major social problems.

Do you agree with me that faith can help mitigate social problems then?

[Liquid Blue]

I live to help people. I'm not a huge fan of the bible, so forgive me if some of the stuff I'm saying doesn't mesh well with what you've been taught and have taught others.

I understand that God asks sacrifices from us but I don't connect that with having to do things for him or in his name. I've come to practice my faith and understand my relationship with God in a different fashion than most people that go to church regularly (I don't). I feel that having faith in God and being as good of a person as I can be, is enough. I don't worry about getting into Heaven, or spreading God's love because all of that is taken care of with my actions, through what I do on a day to day basis. I just don't focus on details, and generally go about my life as humble and helpful as possible.

When I make the claim that "everyone needs Christ in order to enter heaven" can you argue this point as a Christian?

The problem I have is that no one (to me) should worry about getting into Heaven. I believe that you need to believe in Christ to get into heaven, but that's kind of a moot point. If you don't believe in God or Christ, you probably don't believe in Heaven and so you don't care whether or not you're going to enter into it.

Do you agree with me that faith can help mitigate social problems then?

It can but when you introduce faith into the equation by saying " X has these massive problems because there are only X number of christians", it sets a bad precedent; as if there were more christians this wouldn't be a problem, which is not true at all.

[Vykromond]

japs need jesus

and the thread comes full circle..

[Vykromond]

them slant eyes... they dont know jeeseus?? how can this... how can this BE???

[Vykromond]

My suggestion for Jappon is that we shoud come abnd turn them all a Crhistian. Since as we know this is a sucesful prorgram because It worked Realy wel for Indians (New World Indians lol. I dont mean like India Indians. And no I wont tcall them "Native American." I guess Im not part of the {Political Correctness Police lmao!!!) and African Coloreds.

[Hakaku]

My suggestion for Jappon is that we shoud come abnd turn them all a Crhistian. Since as we know this is a sucesful prorgram because It worked Realy wel for Indians (New World Indians lol. I dont mean like India Indians. And no I wont tcall them "Native American." I guess Im not part of the {Political Correctness Police lmao!!!) and African Coloreds.

Well Christianity was first introduced by Portuguese in Japan in the 16th century, where it gained some popularity in Western Japan as a result of continued trade with the West. But by the Edo period, all religions had been banned throughout Japan, meaning that Christianity had to be practiced in secrecy, or else the person would be executed. It wouldn't be until the Meiji Restoration period (late 19th century) that both foreign trade and religion would re-allowed, but it has never picked up much pace in Japan since, and probably will never. (In part because Christianity is seen as foreign, so it's difficult for Japanese to associate with it, in part because Western Japan is no longer the influential power and trade market it once had been in the mainland).

Ironically, the atomic bombing of Hiroshima killed off one of the largest Christian populations in Japan.