Programming

[Creature]

VB is a good language to start with and want to make stuff that you might actually USE...or if you have a shitload of time and energy, go learn C++ or C#.

I'm in high school and currently programming robots for this FIRST Robotics program in C. VB is good for making things in your free time.

[IceStorm]

Compilers

Same Question : What should i start out with?
Another: What compiler do you suggest i download for VB.
I have compilers for Pascal,C++, and C.
And i allready have been looking for VB i just need to know what would be one of the top compilers.. Thanks
And i was wondering if anyone would suggest Java?
If you have any good programming/Graphic design links please tell..

[BLeeN]

Imho it doesn't matter which programming language you're going to start with.
The important thing is to learn the basics of programming itself. That's why those "stupid" classes give you those projects without any goal for it.
So what makes people a good programmer?
Try finding a book about objects and relations etc. Good read and gives you a nice start.

[IceStorm]

Imho it doesn't matter which programming language you're going to start with.
The important thing is to learn the basics of programming itself. That's why those "stupid" classes give you those projects without any goal for it.
So what makes people a good programmer?
Try finding a book about objects and relations etc. Good read and gives you a nice start.

What did you start with? (Everyone else feel free to respond to this question also)

[eRad]

Rant

I'd say more like 80%. But I imagine it's worse at Cornell where Verthanthi and I go than a lot of places. Seriously these kids are fucked up people. MIT is probably the worst though. My friend got accepted for graduate school there so he went to check it out. On returning his first statement was "I can't go there, those kids are just too fucking nerdy. I asked them where the nearest bar was, and they said 'we don't have any'"

Try Waterloo... simply surrounded by a hoarde of drones who never consider the possibility of a life outside their work.

Waterloo is known for its math/engineering and is probably one of the most (overly) challenging curriculums around. Computer science is just plain insane (in the membrane) down here. Plus the campus is this deserted area in the middle of nowhere so it's like you're stranded in a torturous island, with no escape (when you live on residence, this is literally the case).

Anyhow as for languages VB is the best to start with i hear, and a compiler i'd just use MS Visual Basic... it's the standard?

Personally i never even bothered to learn VB, i started out with C++, then Java... then at work i encountered VBscript when i worked with serverside scripting on ASP, and later on some VBA in some databasing modules... so i kind of learned it through its extensions (that's how easy it is...)

I've spent many an hour in front of the computer (one assignment required us to literally ignore our other courses and spend about a week in the labs 24/7) and i still enjoy it.. I whine and complain about the work-hard lifestyle that waterloo imposes, but i enjoy programming. I have to say my passion is probably design though.. when i do digital artwork or web design it gives me satisfaction that is almost unparalleled. Even upon completion of huge programs, it's not the same. One time i finished the weekly assignment (write a compiler from scratch) and i had handled almost an infinite amount of cases, but instead of thinking "sweet this is cool" i was just like "thank fucking god i get to sleep this week".

Still... i don't see myself in another field. This is what i do.

[Fallen Angel]

If you want to become a software engineer, firstly familiarize yourself with a true Object Oriented language like Java or C++. I'd choose Java because you don't have to mess around with pointers, which can be REALLY confusing and frustrating to a beginner. Once you're familiar with the language, start learning basic datastructures (array's, linked lists, trees etc.) and algorithmes (bubblesort, insertion sort, selection sort etc.).
The next step is learning about OO design patterns like MVC (personal favorite). If you've got all of this down you should be able to program an application, but designing one is something all together different.
Obiviously, you have to finish the designing fase before you can start programming the software, and as you will learn this is the most difficult, time consuming and also the most critical phase of the entire process.
For this I'd recommend learning all about UML first, so you have the basics for creating a clear set of diagrams.
On a final note: learn to appreciate coffee.
Coffee is your best friend. Really.

[DoCk>]

Start with Java. If anything, it'll teach you useful programming habits that you wouldn't learn otherwise. Also the availablity of pre-made data structures (that are very highly optimized) for quick and easy use will make Java a rewarding experience.

After you've familiarized yourself with the basics, you can then branch out into the most appropriate language for your field. Java remains my personal language of choice.

Every language has its benefits and drawbacks... you pick the right language for the job, you don't just learn one thing and hope it does every job well.

[arrogance]

Finished my undergrad degree in computer science last may, took a few months but I found work by July in software development and quite enjoy it. That said I think there are very few people who'll enjoy the degree and the subsequent work. You need to be prepared for the daily grind of sitting infront of a monitor and thinking really hard for 8-10 hours a day, certainly not for everyone. If you don't enjoy the prospect of writing good code of making something work, you'll probably burn out pretty quick.

Java's a good place to start, but you miss something if you don't know why it's a good place to start. I'd reccomend starting to play with Java / C++ / C all together, it's not that hard to keep what language does what straight and you'll discover alot about why they're each strong in their respective areas. But if that's overload, I'd definately reccomend starting with Java. PHP, Perl, Python all fun to toy with too, but very different from stronger object oriented languages. You can just make neat things happen quicker.

Avoid VB like the plague.

[ConcreteSchlyrd]

My university went through a curriculum change halfway through my CS degree--always fun. As it stands, I was just drilled in a lot of C++/Java syntax for about two years, and spent another two years dissecting data structures and hypothetical programming situations.

How much of that do I use in my job these days? Very little. However, it's the difference between being a true systems programmer and a systems/network admin (which is what I do). While general programming practices are still useful (getting efficient with internal documentation, being able to visualize databases, etc), I hardly ever use C++ or Java in daily work. Pretty much all of my daily "programming" is done in Perl or CGI scripting as a means to automate daily tasks. The only times I really use C++ is when I'm helping one of our programmers try to debug their code ("The compiler's broken!" "No, shitface, you're just not good at coding.").

Arro's especially right on two fronts: 1) Avoid VB, unless you enjoy being ridiculed. 2) Unless you really like programming and spending countless hours in front of your computer, don't enter into a CS major--you'll end up hating life pretty quick.

To add to this list:
3) Don't enter a programming/admin field because of money. First off, the best programmers/admins are always on top of their game and honing their craft--it's like any other professional occupation. Unless you want to spend time (non-paid) outside of work learning as much as you can (and trust me, it's a never-ending process), you're going to be marginal at best.

EDIT: Oh, I saw you also mentioned Graphic Design. Funny that you should mention that. When I first started up at U of I, I wanted to major in CS and minor in Graphic Design. Turns out that the major prof for design was an "art asshole"--one of those guys that asked me in my entrance interview "What is art?" You know, the question that has no answer. So I dropped the GD minor, concentrated on a BSc in CS, and took a lot of gen ed art classes. I was a lot happier.

[ZeUs!!]

On returning his first statement was "I can't go there, those kids are just too fucking nerdy."

No disrespect to the people who have replied in this thread; but what do you expect when you go to a computer specialist place?

[Verthanthi]

I can't base this off my own expereince, but several people have recommended C# over C++ or java as a starting language.

[IceStorm]

Okay good thing you guys just told me to stay away from VB because i was going to start learning it since i got it recommended by a few people i know. (I think they try and take the easy way out)
Well me staying infront of the computer for hours is no question. Im on here 24/7.
I have a few books
Pascal
2-books
C++
2-books
Java and XSLT
1-book
Html
3-books

I can read code like hell i could find errors and identify everything easy.. Now i just need to practice making up my own. Do you guys have any links for tutorials for java or anything that would assist me?

And angel

The next step is learning about OO design patterns like MVC (personal favorite). If you've got all of this down you should be able to program an application, but designing one is something all together different.

Remember im an absolute newb.. Help? lol could someone break that up for me?

[Creature]

(I think they try and take the easy way out)

Not necessarily, just teh speedier one. Try programming a fucking button to work in C++, it's a BITCH. I'll take the double click button in VB rofl :P

[Jason]

Here's perhaps the best Java tutorial out there.

http://java.sun.com/docs/books/tutor...ybigindex.html

[Epinephrine]

I used to be in it, did 3 years of it but recently changed to something better and higher paying

-Epi