Changes in pub #2

[fiS]

I was playing today in pub a little, with the LowP mid-base spawn on.
If you are going to keep this, you need to alter it for levis. Letting them spawn in mid-base turns the 2v3v1 into which team's levi can not die before getting into flagroom. Personally, during this time disable both levis and sharks. Allowing mining ships to just SPAWN in mid-base and mine flagroom is not fun to play against. I specced this morning cause of that. It's a good idea, but there's a reason levis still have an attach bounty requirement.

I'll get that done with the levis. I actually thought in 3v3 or below people wouldn't play levi, but I thought wrong
About sharks -- I guess I gotta play it myself (which is not really easy with my schedule) to experience it. Theory alone tells me that the spawn radius should be big enough to avoid "spawn" mines.

[Shaddowknight]

spawn mines arent a problem, but when its 3v3 and one team sharks or levis and mones fr, you have to do it yourself. it greatly reduces the gameplay variety when that happens. if the bot would disable mines on LowP (its possible) then shark would be fine (although mostly useless, only a rep machine). Disabling them seems like just the better option.

[Izor]

Or you can do away with all of these modules except the basing game, streak bot, and duel and call it a day. Idk how a conversation about bot features ruining the game went to a conversation about adding and modifying more bot features. Defies logic

[Spock!]

No Input...........

[Tone]

Good basing track here

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EOCTndA2lto#t=4m45s

[Tone]

If i switch between WB & the new levi i can get a 30 to 1 kill ratio for a while before becoming lazy. a week ago I reached 55 wins 0 losses when including warping, mostly WB some Levi. New levi is good because the speed which helps lack of patience would make up for weaker bombs.

[WingZero]

Levi and weasel settings have returned to their original settings.

[Contempt]

Levi and weasel settings have returned to their original settings.

Unfortunately pubbase has become unplayable due to the reappearance of levterrs. The adverse effects on gameplay seem even worse than before; I just played for half an hour and it was no fun at all.

The X is also now awful, and being killed by a ship that is entirely invisible just sucks.

For this reason I'm indefinitely quitting trenchwars.

Some simple parting advice to staff:

Your absolute main goals for public should be to concentrate on improving a) pubbase gameplay and b) gameplay for warbirds in "spawn". Everything else should be secondary to these two extremely simple, but primordial goals.

By the way, with regards to the warbird in pub: the space they play in is not just spawn, it's a warbird dueling area, and you should have probably kept killothon there, where it was a contest of virtuosity between the best players in the arena (and really fun).
A lot of spawning happened during killothon, but not to the extent where it excessively affected pubbase; logically spawn kills would affect both freqs equally anyway. As for the spawning of new players, I agree it is perhaps not the best situation, and this is effectively a good argument against killothon; having said that, I'm pretty sure getting raped by better players happens to first-timers in every game.

Any changes made in the game's settings should only be done so to promote skill and/or fun.

Peripheral ships in trenchwars should not have the capacity to ruin the pubbing experience. You guys should be absolutely concentrating on enhancing the core elements of the game, which is actually a really simple task - a mere task of facilitation -, but the opposite is currently happening.

Bye

P.S. It's a shame because the previous settings for the leviathan weren't perfect, but seemed like a decent compromise

[Demonic]

Unfortunately pubbase has become unplayable due to the reappearance of levterrs. The adverse effects on gameplay seem even worse than before; I just played for half an hour and it was no fun at all.

The X is also now awful, and being killed by a ship that is entirely invisible just sucks.

For this reason I'm indefinitely quitting trenchwars.

Some simple parting advice to staff:

Your absolute main goals for public should be to concentrate on improving a) pubbase gameplay and b) gameplay for warbirds in "spawn". Everything else should be secondary to these two extremely simple, but primordial goals.

By the way, with regards to the warbird in pub: the space they play in is not just spawn, it's a warbird dueling area, and you should have probably kept killothon there, where it was a contest of virtuosity between the best players in the arena (and really fun).
A lot of spawning happened during killothon, but not to the extent where it excessively affected pubbase; logically spawn kills would affect both freqs equally anyway. As for the spawning of new players, I agree it is perhaps not the best situation, and this is effectively a good argument against killothon; having said that, I'm pretty sure getting raped by better players happens to first-timers in every game.

Any changes made in the game's settings should only be done so to promote skill and/or fun.

Peripheral ships in trenchwars should not have the capacity to ruin the pubbing experience. You guys should be absolutely concentrating on enhancing the core elements of the game, which is actually a really simple task - a mere task of facilitation -, but the opposite is currently happening.

Bye

P.S. It's a shame because the previous settings for the leviathan weren't perfect, but seemed like a decent compromise

While I agree completely, it was the public vote to return settings with a vote of 2:1

[Shaddowknight]

I still don't feel like having old levis back is a good move. What exactly are we doing to further restrict them?

[Spock!]

Yeah, the old levi just doesn't help pub in the least....If the focus is noob retention, then this is just going to make nubs quit even more than they have been.

And even though I appreciate staff listening to myself and others saying the Weasel was inadequate, the current X (the original one) is just not much fun to play. The Warbirds and other non-x-radar equipped ship are just not sporting to kill. And it is way too easy for the terrs to pop the x, along with lancs. Any half-way decent lanc can kill these x's with ease.

As I suggested many a time, the last x we had (large, but faster) was fun but under-powered, but if you added stealth that used energy it would be loads of fun while not staying invisible forever. That way ships without x-radar might have a bit of a chance, while giving the x a chance against terrs, lancs and such. It could use some tweeking, but overall I think that would make it nice and well rounded..........

I dislike the current weasel so much that I quit playing it. And thats saying alot, since Ive been an avid weasel pilot for years.

[Rab]

hunting LTs is awesome

[KrynetiX]

I'd just like to step in here and say that I'll be monitoring/playing pub vigorously, and I'll be reading the forums, discussing suggestions with the players and keeping my mind and eyes open for good ideas. I will admit that I am naturally opposed to changing any ship settings, but if a proposed change is logical and will clearly promote good game play - I will consider it.. The two things I'm watching closely at the moment are LT's and Weasels.

As for LT's, the solution will probably not be a change to ship settings - rather a simple change to the map limiting their over-powered shots into the base.

Weasels will find their place again even if it means giving them a small upgrade.

As I said, I'll be watching/playing vigorously and keeping my mind/eyes open for ideas in-game, on forums and abroad.

It seems like a lot of dedicated LT players have left the game, at least temporarily. There were groups of LT's that would play and have a lot of fun daily, just before the previous changes to Leviathan. LT is a part of the game that a good hand full of players are/were passionate about. I'd like to see them return, and see players LT'ing again, daily. Although any over-powered shots that ruin basing must be eliminated or made less powerful.

I'm here to make the game fun and I'm opposed to unwarranted changes.

If you have suggestions or concerns please speak your mind. I'm listening.

[Ephemeral]

I’ve quit playing Pub after 15 years and am close to quitting the game entirely. I used to play Pub because it was fun to join the game at any time and have a disparate group of players use teamwork to take FR and win a game.

Now everything works against this from happening. Dumb ass ‘features’ such as pub bucks allowing ?buy wins and more experienced players to be stronger than newer players were added on top of the already difficult situation of LTs ruining competitive games. Now there are so many people making multiple changes (including rebooting servers multiple times during weekends) that it feels like Pub is nothing more than a giant failed experiment. The zone’s mission statement is what is supposed to be what the zone is about; competitive basing and teamwork. What does this have to do with ‘kill-a-thons’ or dueling for dollars? Many people simply lost sight of the zone's primary purpose.

LTs? The map and ship setting aren’t the issue and yet huge amounts of time have been wasted dicking around with them. Constant changes have virtually killed off Pub now. Did anyone get any real data from all the changes? No. Instead map and ship settings have been changed multiple times when all that was really needed was dumbass vets (and staffers) to stop climbing into a private freq LT and raining down bombs on competitive basing games and trashing them. (We simply needed to control private freq LTs, not all LTs. A LT has a legitimate purpose in a basing game as long as it is used to help team. But having 2-3 staffers/vets play one for their own enjoyment only damages the zone.)

Then you have the issue with some on staff holding events when Pub is barely going (like 5-6 people on two freqs). Some random staffer trying to make his monthly quota and is not thinking about the future of the zone and why it is critical to retain new players as highest priority runs off to start some event that ends up being attended by less than 10 people. Classic case of spreading the population too thin and trying to be all things to all people. I saw this happen no fewer than 8 times yesterday; each time negatively impacting the Pub game.

Staff should be aware of public opinion but allowing the public to drive all of these changes was stupidly shortsighted (and frankly some people ought to be held responsible for these decisions). Staff is supposed to have more information and a better understanding of the big picture of the zone. Just listening to existing players means, by default, that new players are never represented in any decision. We count on leadership make the hard decisions like doing what it takes to retain new players as highest priority. Instead we got ‘feel good’ management in which ‘this is what the vote was’ is used to justify the decisions. Just because the general population of Germany supported the leadership at the time doesn’t make Hitler’s decisions correct or his leadership good.

Kry, you may now be ‘head of Pub’ but you really don’t have full control over Pub and all the decisions that are made that impact it. At any time someone above you can decide to do something like ‘let’s move all afkers to Elim’ without you being in the loop. When you took the job as head of Pub you should have been told how you would be evaluated (i.e. metrics identified that reflect the growth and improvement of Pub). Same for the head or Events and the head of the various leagues. Each group is given the control and autonomy they need get their jobs done. If they don’t do their jobs then you guys should be removed and someone else given a chance to perform properly. The upper staff should only concern themselves with strategic decisions, they should stay out of all operational decisions.

IMO TW leadership and staff needs a complete overhaul. Something needs to be put in place that holds people responsible for their decisions. If the TW leadership was turned on its ear and restructured you might be able to turn pub around from its current downward death spiral. But as long as the staff mentality is ‘hey, we took a poll and this is what the majority wanted so we aren’t responsible’ then the lack of new player retention will have the same result as seen in EG and Hockey zones. This isn’t rocket science although there are huge logistical and collaborative challenges in building a successful TW leadership. I do feel for you and do appreciate all that you and other on staff have done for the zone. It is unfortunate that those who have the ability to make the staff organizational changes which would give you the tools and resources you need to be successful aren’t delivering. So many on staff have joined only to find they are neutered and simply cannot get their jobs done without the autonomy and control they need. IMO the dean(s) of TW should be an elected position and have no dependencies on zone permissions.

I wish you and others the best of luck but I won’t be playing pub and leagues anymore. I’ll stop in occasionally to see if there is a hockey game going and/or to see if anything has changed but it appears doubtful that this will ever happen. My one regret is that I missed opportunities of kindness; times when I could have stood up for newer players and did not.
eph

[KrynetiX]

My predecessors don't reflect how I'll be handling the public arena. I agree with the majority of the things you say, Eph. If you think I'll be doing exactly the same as those before me, well - that's just not the case.

I can't promise that I or we will figure everything out and turn player retention around - but I'll do the best I can, and make as wise of decisions as possible. I'm not and won't be jumping the gun on anything. I won't be making any changes -just because I can- (which appeared to be the case with a number of my predecessors).

Assuming I'll follow the status-quo and continue to steer the zone away from it's core gameplay is just plain wrong. You've got someone new here, someone knowledgeable who has been playing pub for over a decade. Why not cross your fingers and hope I'm not completely incompetent?

No matter the assumptions or low expectations, I'm going to do the best I can to return TW's public to the gameplay that was once enjoyable and loved.

I'm not going to worry and stress over the possibility that my decisions might be overturned by those above me. I'd rather do what I feel is right and hope for the best outcome. I'm not going to assume Demonic or Wingzero will intervene when I make a change that I believe to be a step in the right direction. I'm going to think positively and try my best to make successful decisions.