Illegal Immigrants get what they deserve!

[Mobey]

Nazi'z

[Verthanthi]

I'm saving this thread for the next time all the Euros try to claim America is a land of uneducated, backwards, behind-the-times, racists.

[Dim]

Heres another problem with illegal migrants, they push back the availability for legal migrants to come....

The government are spending money like 400,000 quid for each house, for immigrants thats what pisses the brits off.

[Mobey]

The government are spending money like 400,000 quid for each house, for immigrants thats what pisses the brits off.

400,000 of our taxes wich we work to pay.
Exactly.

[THE ENFORCER]

The government are spending money like 400,000 quid for each house, for immigrants thats what pisses the brits off.

Most immigrants work........

[Mr. Peanuts]

yeah and your taxes go to pay teachers in public schools and everyone else who is on benefits- its about 2-5p out of your wage every month, it's all a big huff about nothing.

there are waaaaay more legal immigrants than illegal ones.

[Troll King]

That's a good point, and I think that's what a lot of people on this thread are confusing: the difference between legal and illegal immigrants.

[lunch3]

If no one were were starving why would there be soup kitchens, homeless, corpses of people that have starved to death, and why would I personally know people that hunt deer in (and out) of season for one reason only: to donate the meat to people that need food?

I live in nyc so I should be seeing these corpses but I don't. Hardly anyone starves, if I was in a position of starving and had no idea where to go, I would just go to a church, they would probably feed me a good meal, then they will direct me to a shelter. You would only starve if you gave up or wanted to commit suicide.

Lolz, that second sentence shows your an ignorant hillbilly. Ok "people hunt deer to feed the poor", rofl. You and your friends just like hunting and are doing it illegally by doing it out of season. If we had enough of you people my grandchildren wouldn't know what a deer looks like because they are extinct. Buy the poor canned food or something from the supermarket. Are you telling me instead you will kill a deer, skin it, roast it, and serve it or something?

Enforcer, you missed my point. What you said about Japan is true, AND is why they are hurting. They have a very advanced industry, and almost every citizen goes to college. In that case no one is left behind to work in the shit labor jobs. Japanese are also extremely racist culturally, many exchange students from China and many other places see this and don't want to come back. They have very tough immigration laws, so hence they don't have many legal or illegal immigrants that would take these jobs. So instead the manufactoring industry must increase wages in order to get a student of a college or something to do the work, and/or they are low on workers, slashing output and increasing costs diminishing profits. There economy is strong, but Japanese economists and analyzers do see this as a long-term problem that needs to be fixed.

PS Mobey I saw that thread where you were trying to get everyone to flame a person inside the game because of that nerdy song. That is not the right way to solve differences, whatever they might be, with others. As long as I'm cap you are not getting on RB so stop asking.

[Epinephrine]

Japan is having problems because they don't really have any immigration at all, and because they have an aging population. According to the latest UN projections, Japan should be officially shrinking in population by next year. Japan will also have the oldest population in the world. This is a huge problem. Basically there aren't enough young workers to replace the older workers, and since Japan doesn't embrace immigration there's going to be a huge deficit in workers and people to pay off the pensions of the retirees.

Japanese projections actually say that they will probably need 30 million new workers in the next decade to keep the economy going... it's a huge problem that needs to be solved, and immigration is a good way if it can be worked out.


In terms of legal immigrants, it's sad that so many of you are so against immigration. Being an immigrant myself (who unlike Dock's gf can speak perfect english:P), I strongly believe that immigration is a good thing. Canada has set a goal of increasing it's population by 1% a year via immigration and has come close to that in the past two decades. In fact Toronto is probably the most multicultural city in the world, probably the only major western city where white people are a visible minority (less than 50%). Growing up in such an environment makes you appreciate that people from all over the world, all races and all religions can get along in a thriving society.

Why does the government spend so many resources in upkeeping immigrants? Some of you are extremely naive in thinking the good old "they are stealing my taxes". There have been countless studies that have shown that immigrants are usually more hardworking that native born citizens. This is probably attributed to the fact that since it's hard to get in, people who are more educated or willing to work get in, and also because these people truly want to have a better life and will work hard for it, harder than many of the native population (basically, lazy people probably won't get into the country). Secondly almost every single western nation is going to experience population declines in the next decade (except for the US with it's very high birth rate). Any economist will tell you that this is a BAD thing. It basically means less workers will shoulder the responsibility of paying for the costs of the retired population (health care, pensions, etc.). It also means that the economy will shrink as less people will have disposible incomes to spend on things. And it also means that many vital jobs will go unfilled because people aren't willing to take them as they are too accustomed to growing up comfortably (unlike many immigrants who'll take any job). Further more are the secondary benefits of having fresh ideas and motivated people in your country helping start new businesses and so on. As well there's the more vague network effects whereby successful immigrants will give money back to their home countries thus promoting economic stimulation to those countries, and thus increasing the global market for goods validating free trade and globalization. Finally there are the really highly educated immigrants, who at least in Canada and the United States disproportionally make up the engineers, scientists and doctors in those countries. As less and less people seem to want to go into science even in the US, immigration is an effective way to get the smartest people in the entire world doing research in your country and having your country reap the rewards of R&D.


In terms of illegal immigrants, it's a much tougher situation. It's certainly not a thing to be laughed at. As many people have pointed out, these people really just want to make a better life for themselves and their families and are so desperate they are willing to go to extreme ends. Most of these people aren't criminals and really do work the bottom feeder jobs no one wants to do. But they also bring in problems. Having a large number of people living in your country that don't actually exist on any official registration is a huge problem. Because they are not under state protection, they are prime targets for organized crime. In fact many probably got to the country via organized crime, and are ermanently in debt to these criminal syndicates. These crime syndicates will charge outrageous prices for these people to come to the country, and in many cases will keep these people in check using the threat of deportation to have people obey. They will force these people to work for them as criminals, or work in jobs and have the crime syndicate garnish a large percentage. Perhaps they may even force these people into prostitution. Even if the people manage to get into the country on their own, they face enormous obsticles, as many times the only people willing to take the risk of giving them room and board are criminals. Even if no criminals are involved you still have millions of people (at least in the US) who have no rights at all. They have no health care, no right to vote, no right to anything except be found out and deported. This is a huge human rights deficit and no liberal democratic country should condone such a massive human rights deficit in their own country.

So what do you do? In many cases your country needs these people to fill jobs no one wants. In many cases it's impossible to track down all these people and deport them all. One solution is to deport those you can because truely you cannot help them all, and if you find them, you cannot in good conscience keep them in your country knowing you cannot provide for them and that you may be helping crime. Deportation cannot be the only strategy though. In many cases these illegal immigrants will have been around for so long that they are almost part of your country. Having an amnesty for those who have been around for a while may sometimes be useful (as I believe George Bush is pushing for). But that creates the problem of when does the amnesty start and when does it end? What about people who come in later and claim they were here before?

As with all complex problems there is no one answer. In my opinion the best solution is to get to the root of the problem. Only by relaxing import restrictions, lowering argicultural subsidies, pushing for more human rights and democracy in other countries, and massively increasing foreign aid can we stem the flow of illegal immigrants. These people leave their homes not because they really want to leave their families, but because they have no choice. If this is a real problem, people must acknoledge that we must help them help themselves because in many cases they cannot do it themselves because of corrupt governments, or because the western world has systemically destroyed any hope these people have by implementing illegal tarriffs and most of all argicultural subsidies which destroy all hopes the third world farmer has of ever being competitive in the world market (and yes most poor countries depend on agriculture for most of their GDP). In terms of other richer countries that still have problems and thus are a large source for illegal immigrants (Mexico, China), we must push these countries for greater governmental reforms so that their citizens can realize their potential in their own countries. Remember these people are extremely desperate, even if we make things a bit better, there's a good chance we can significantly lower the amount of illegal immigrants there are.

So let's not laugh at illegal or legal immigrants. They're just people like you trying to get by, and in many cases they help you. Let's embrace immigration, and deal with the root problems so that illegal immigration has no base to start from.

-Epi

[code]

Sleepy Wea> swimkid is only 17
Divine Rid> he is? let's fuck his asshole with our dicks

rofl..

As Epinephrine begins Chapter 1, Page 1..

[bloodzombie]

Anyone else think it's strange that the enforcer can tell you what life is like in your country, no matter where you live?

[lunch3]

Nice post Ephi.

[Ewan]

Why would illegal immigrants piss anyone off, under any circumstances, ever?

I have a feeling that this harkens back to the desperate untruth: "Illegal Immigrants take jobs away from regular citizens"

It's completely, one hundred percent untrue.
First: They don't come to your office, shove you out in the street and say "MINE!"
Second: If they get a job that a regular citizen applies for, there must be a reason, they'll work for less, they have the better skillset, whatever.
Third: If companies set out to hire illegal immigrants al a Wal-Mart, and then get found out and forced to pay equally... then all incentive to hire illegal immigrants vanishes.

Wax especially with his cavalier death penalty talk... e-fucking-gad.
You make your posts sound like the meanderings of someone who doesn't know what the hell you're talking about. I believe in using the Death Penalty in certain cases, but it's a serious issue, and the simple fact that there are innocent men that have gone to death and have been sitting on death row... completely innocent.. only goes to show that you cannot and must not be so ... well.. fucking stupid in your attitude towards applying executions.

Someone may have already said this, but I skipped the 2nd and 3rd posts. But anyway:

MADDOX

~Ewan

[Subjugation]

Anyone else think it's strange that the enforcer can tell you what life is like in your country, no matter where you live?

yes, that crossed my mind. maybe he's japanese-british-american-renaissance man.

[Fit of Rage]

I'm saving this thread for the next time all the Euros try to claim America is a land of uneducated, backwards, behind-the-times, racists.

Stop taking my good ideas.