Abortion debate: who cares?

[semenfaze]

ROFL
thats so delicious

[Vykromond]

Okey, consider yourself as the baby that is going to get aborted, or what should I say killed.

wiggle piss wiggle wiggle wiggle wiggle flail wiggle flail piss eat eat eat eat eat wiggle wiggle wiggle flail wiggle eat eat eat piss OH NOES I'M GOING TO GET ABORTED ISN'T MY LIFE SACRED??

[Kolar]

I don't think any mother should be forced to have a child if she doesn't want to, so I'm pro-choice. Although I think adoption is always a better option than death, I don't think other people have the right to choose for a girl/woman.

^ That's the best this thread will come up with, consider you live in a democratic society. Defaulting on science to come up with the exact timing ect ect.. and making sure there's no abuse of the option.

[geekbot]

I am pro life. I believe abortion is murder.

Assuming human life should be protected, what is human life?

Brainwaves? Heartbeat? Fingerprints? DNA? Chromosomes? A fetus has all these around 6 weeks- about the same time it is first possible to detect a pregnancy. Some of you have been saying it is not life because a premature baby/fetus is not able to live without the mother. The mortality rate of a normal born baby without mother, father, or any care is near 100% as well.

What is the difference between a 3rd trimester fetus and a pre-mature birth? Not much. If 2nd trimester abortion is ok, why not 3rd?

The life cycle of a human that we learn in biology doesn't start at birth. A sperm and egg each have 1/2 the chromosomes. Once it combines, all the information that will produce a full human is there. It seems pretty clear to me from biology that human life starts at conception.


A side note for those that believe abortion is ok if the mother's life is in jeapordy: medical science is not an exact science. No operation or diagnosis is 100%. No doctor will be able to say with 100% or probably even 90% certainty that a mother will die if the fetus is not aborted in such and such a case. So who decides whether the chance of death is worth the ending of another? Not an easy question and not as black-and-white as people sometimes casually say.

[Kolar]

So then it's up to the person to decide on Geek, if you believe in freedom of choice but it's the Govn.'s responsibility to see that it is not used as a form of birth control. There's more to life then we know about so until then I will rely on a doctor's word and skill to decide when and if something can be consider human but I think in that area it should be more conservative.

[Ilya]

whats so wrong with murder, anyway

[Ilya]

thats right, i said it.

[geekbot]

What's wrong with murder is a different question that should be answered before the abortion question to avoid becoming confused.

Harper's had a article a few issues ago on the US Partial-Birth Abortion Ban Act of 2003

http://www.harpers.org/GamblingWithAbortion.html

[froedrick]

anyone else notice there was like 2 girls and 30 guys that responded to this. Hmm, :\. And what's with this 'pro-choice, pro-life' label that's been put on this. Half at least of the people who are all about 'pro-life' are also FOR the war. Which is a total contradiction in itself. And why would a man be 'Pro-choice' about a woman's choice. I, do not get to make a decision for anyone in the whole fucking world save for myself. And when I grow up for my kids untill they are old enough. So why, should anyone deem themeselves morally responsible to make these decisions for someone else? And don't bring the, god says it's wrong argument, it just doesnt fly. "the bible says this about it" Well the bible wasn't written by god and I have a hard time believing my best friend sometime so why should I trust in someone who's long dead. So that opinion doesn't fly with me.

[Epinephrine]

Because 'pro-choice' means you're NOT making the decision for them dummy.

[SEAL]

since 'pro life' and 'non pro life' will never agree, my 2 cents.

simply said:
when a child gets born the man can deny being father, like a early disowning. (im not an advocate so not familiar with the good technical words-terms)

why cant a woman do that too? she is owner of her body and up until 12 weeks it's basicly a bunch of overgrown sperm.

[froedrick]

Because 'pro-choice' means you're NOT making the decision for them dummy.

I see 'pro-choice' as meaning "I am for making decisions". But if you hear someone say 'pro-choice' it's automatically assumed that it's towards abortion, when it could just as easily be, gay marraige or whether or not I want to put on pants today.

[Ilya]

overgrown sperm.

haha

[Da1andonly]

abortion is good.

[geekbot]

Abortion and war is not the same thing, although it brings out a good point for me. I believe that there are ethical justifications for war (I've yet to convince myself our current war is ethical), but in all cases war should be pretty darn close to a last resort. A pre-emptive strike is an exception that wouldn't be a "last" resort but it had darn better be with the aim of preventing greater losses, and in the face of few to no other workable solutions.

Abortion should be treated as the same- as a last resort when no other option seems likely to succeed or be workable. For pro-lifers to call it 'murder' (as I carelessly did earlier) is to suggest that the abortion is done without due consideration. But on the other side, for pro-choice advocates to emphasize 'choice', makes it seem that a mother should be able to choose abortion when it is convenient.

Perhaps abortion should be called neither 'murder' nor a 'choice'. Neither of these words even closely resembles what a mother is doing when she is forced to consider what she never thought she would ever have to do.

The New York Times post that Epi linked (http://www.wfu.edu/~chesner/bc-conla...%20Justice.htm) described the original Roe v Wade as a decision to preserve the rights of a doctor to make his/her best judgement. This seems very reasonable to me as long as the doctors are held accountable to those decisions. Perhaps pro-lifers (like me) should spend less time arguing the definition of human life and instead be devoting more time and energy protecting mother and child by making sure doctors that perform abortions are accountable for the decisions they make on behalf of their patients.

I'm not trying to make decisions for anyone but I do think in this case the potential baby should be protected as much as reasonably possible. True 'choice' whether or not to have an abortion shouldn't be an option. Does this make sense?