I Like Weasels

[Cops]

i like the yellow ship

[Kolar]

It's getting a little annoying seeing the "Congrats, you do this, and this and this.. now you get shit". I'm finding a lot of hostility directed at me for no reason, I didn't change it and I really never had opinion on this until DoCk> changed the ship. I'm willing to disscuss changes but i'm going to have my opinion here, if you think differently PH then try to convince me, either way the misdirected anger isn't doing anything here.


I don't think it's as complicated as you said to disable the thrust shot, if nothing else we can disable thrusters in the settings. The WB had this ability at one time and it was removed. Also Pure Hatred didn't know about this ability until the recent changes.. atleast that's what I read from the post in staff forums, who knows.. he was high on nyquil at the time :turned:.

Balance for TW means balancing game play so all ships can equally and fairly compete against each other. Yes for some ships you have to accept their limits but we get that from the theme of the ship. It is far too easy for the weasel to do it Cherub and a few personal observations on pure publics by one person isn't enough to judge the effects of current settings. Yes, if you want to say that to me that's fine but i'm not saying I'm right.. just that this is what I see.. now lets do something about it.. or we can sit on our asses arguing over pointless shit. Using the side entreances eaily allows the weasel to bypass any real defense. There are many problems in the publics all of which need separate solutions, to ignore this one or to leave the ship without having a real and balanced function for basing is just plain stupid.


Small steps are needed for the weasel. I think we should test it out by reverting the size and leaving the thrust shot intact for now and see how it's used by the public. I think the greening idea is worth trying out also.

[SpiderMage]

Why do people complain about campers(in base) so much? It's a sound strategy that is put to good use in real battle as well as many, many video games. It may not take much skill, but it's a good defensive strategy.

[Pressure Drop]

Why do people complain about campers(in base) so much? It's a sound strategy that is put to good use in real battle as well as many, many video games. It may not take much skill, but it's a good defensive strategy.

not sure your talking about ?go base or in the pub base i was complaining about campers in pub so i'll assume it was that :P

I don't care about the campers in the flag room, or even upper roof really, its other ones that annoy me. Camping in the flag room is fine to defend it , i'm not saying everyone must push out or anything like that. However there is a different breed of camper.

It is playing for yourself rather than the team, these campers would get alot more kills if they participated in the battles going on , however they would also get killed a hell of alot more so they camp instead, this actualy is taking up slots in your team.Some would even go on an independent freq so anyone they radomly hit dies, if you go to kill them they warp etc...

You get ppl who just freq hop to who ever has flag and go and camp, this makes it unbalanced and then generaly one freq gets a numbers advantage and owns completely, so the smaller freq begins to give up which is no fun for either freq at all.

If you terred regularly (not saying you don't) and you are in a battle against a freq with flag and they have more ppl than you and not many of your team is attaching (a regular thing) then it is hard to stay alive in mid, having campers spamming shots makes it alot more difficult. In that scenario you don't have enough ppl to have a couple of ppl go deal with the campers becuase you are struggling just to gain control of mid. Or indeed if instead of attaching your team is of camping , they aren't helping that much to get the flag.

I'm not saying i'm right but i'm saying they piss me off :P and if everyone did it there would be no game.

[PrOnEsSim]

Tone....


4) Yer a pub newb that just needs to die


Just disapear Tone...do us all the favor and go play with yer daddy's loaded gun

Hasta!!

Am i wrong, or didnt you own a pub squad called Dark)SidE) for like a year?

[WiseCherub]

I remember when the Weasel change was made to 1 tile size, like 2 years ago. I admit, I was against it at the time.
But I remember chatting with Arilou, he said over time players will get use to it. He was right, and now I much enjoy the smaller size.

So Kolar you suggesting now to make the weasel larger, but retain its thrust shot.

Still I fail to see why the current weasel is overpowered, I don't think it is. Its not like it has L3 Bomb like the levis, which can quickly turn a nice basing game to crap.
I always see that, as soon as levis are allowed in purepubs, the basing game goes to crap and isn't fun anymore.

Since the weasel is so sensitive to bomb splash damage, once levis are in there, the ship becomes very useless for basing.

Ok, I'm no expert weasel player, but its not like I get 200bty or rarely get killed. If that was true, and as an average player got these stats with it easily and repeatibly, then it would be overpowered ship.

Uniqueness is what makes a ship standout, I think it is good that the weasel's primary CLOAKING ability is weakene. But in place given other abilities which don't need cloak is a good direction, other abilities where you need skill and not invisible. Even T0ne agreed with this, and he was one the main players against the weasel.

Ohya the idea about buying rockets..etc.. is silly.. Okay, I'm going to pay 10-20000 pts for 1 rocket just so I can kill 1 ship (maybe I will or not); bad trade off.. 20000pts for maybe 200pts (for killing 1 ship).

[CloudHelmut]

Would it be so bad to let people green up rockets? Heh, then all those poor javs will have two reasons to green up. (since most don't seem to know they can increase their shrap) It might make the jav loyalists less touchy about losing their spawn with x-radar.

[Sarien]

Why do people complain about campers(in base) so much? It's a sound strategy that is put to good use in real battle as well as many, many video games. It may not take much skill, but it's a good defensive strategy.

You are only thinking of this in an extremely limited viewpoint, SM.

CamperGuy goes to a private frequency, he's able to kill everybody. He slips into this weasel (formerly warbird) and noses up to one of the 4 popular camping holes, and proceeds to pour some shots into mid.

BasingGuyA and BasingGuyB have been slugging it out each on their respective two teams. It's been a great time, no sure control of the flagroom. The fight moves back and forth, and it seems like any small error, any small hole in the defense is enough for each side to claim the flag for themselves. Whoops.. Camperguy just set off a round that TeamATerr flies into while running and dies. Ergh.. those two warbirds slugging and dodging and using cover in mid each wrangling to get a shot off and get a hit on the sweet meat of the enemy terrier, that kinda got jacked, another of CamperGuy's random rounds nailed one of them during a dodge.

It's disruptive. It's annoying. It isn't just "camping by a side or other" that people are even barely complaining about (although that's kinda pathetic).. it's the above example.

This is why leviathans are disruptive. When you distill pubs down to what they are supposed to be, they are not supposed to be hop on your own team and jack with as many other people trying to play as you can. It's supposed to be about public basing, and public dueling between whatever two ships want to duel it out. Period.

Using your other game analogy it's like a team deathmatch game where one guy suddenly decides to form his own team, and hide and shoot both of the actual competing sides, to up his kills so he can go "omg lol I so great".

The only difference between this and leviathans is levs are able to do it with a bigger effect. And no offense, but spare me your rocket launcher analogy. It doesn't fit. That red bomb that the jav has? That's the TW equivalent of a friggin rocket launcher. The blue bomb is something like the redeemer from UT, except it isn't limited. It's crap, and if anybody is even remotely serious about working to make publics a better environment. Leviathans need to be torn apart and reworked to make the blue bomb a thing of the past. LTs inspire an environment of greed and self-centered behavior that you can see is the number one complaint about public arenas.

[Sarien]

Would it be so bad to let people green up rockets? Heh, then all those poor javs will have two reasons to green up. (since most don't seem to know they can increase their shrap) It might make the jav loyalists less touchy about losing their spawn with x-radar.

In my opinion,
You should be able to green any ability you have. Rockets, Antiwarp for spiders, (cloaking for weasels as per my idea) etc.

Two ships should get team greens. The Terrier and The Shark. Both ships need things that they get only in limited amounts, to survive in a long haul. Sharks with teamgreened reps, would be a godsend.

The Leviathan needs to lose the level 3 bombs. It should lose all extraneous abilities it has now (stealth, rocket, port, etc). It should be as fast as the weasel, have level 1 red double barreled bullets (no multifire), level 1 red bombs, no bounce, but the ability to fire 3 of these red bombs on a full energy loadout and have no attachment penalties. "Heavy Artillery" doesn't mean necessarily "bigger bombs" it can also mean "ability to use bombs even under duress" This leviathan would be used for bombing base and as a heavy bomber to try to pound defenses back from from the door, while the sharks would try to keep the door from being overwhelmed. And note, the red bombs would still kill plenty of people, just without the being able to kill them 6 inches from a wall, as if they'd used a thor (removed from TW).

[Pressure Drop]

Ohya the idea about buying rockets..etc.. is silly.. Okay, I'm going to pay 10-20000 pts for 1 rocket just so I can kill 1 ship (maybe I will or not); bad trade off.. 20000pts for maybe 200pts (for killing 1 ship).

Not really when you consider a decoy costs over 5k. The fact is not many ppl buy stuff to actualy use, other than ppl lting. The only thing i have bought over the last while was antiwarp when pure pub's bots died and it turned to lev terrs every where. I also bought a decoy for a laugh. The fact is if you play regularly you get alot of points, if you wanted to spend them on a novalty like getting an x cloak and a rocket to try and do some good and take out the enemy terr or what ever then why not?. But considering the amount of points you can accumalate i think the price should be high so its not a case of 500 for a rocket and cloak then play the game for a few days and then just get your x to safe and green up before going on a killing spree.

Also i think it would add a bit of fun , if you spent all those points you would want to killl your target and if you die, then you have the fustration of losing all those points :P but it could well add more fun for the x's if they play alot and get loads of points.

This is a completely different issue but i like the idea of buying things you can't green, i think it adds something to the game becuase its not a random green but you actualy planned and bought it in a safe. I think some high priced useful items would be good but they might make it a bit more unbalanced but if you put the price high then it shouldn't matter that much. there are powerful items like Bounce, Prox, Super, Sheilds, Increased Speed, Energy Thrust you could even throw in a brick to the list. Not saying they all shoud be put in , just that i'd like to see how someof them would work, it might have been tried and tested i don't know.

[CloudHelmut]

I like your suggestions Sarien. My comments:

I like greening everything. From what I understand, you can set the frequency of different prize drops so real useful stuff like rocket and anti could be fewer. If we are going to go to a more "greening" zone, I wouldn't mind if everybody lost some recharge rate on spawn that you could green back up to current 100% (in say 1 or 2 greens).

It never really occured to me to switch the team green ships- I like a lot. Sharks would be a much more team oriented ship to give the greens to. If this is done they might want to lower mines per shark, maybe keep # per team the same.

I want the lev back in the game too. Gotta tone down that fucking bomb. I thought of double barrel reds before, it might be fun. Would it be possible to just lower the radius effect & damage of blue bombs and increase the shot rate? And sure, give it a little speed. It's just too helpless as is.

[Kim]

^^^pfft pubbers^^^

You guys should try thrust shooting with these things, you'd be surprised how many terrs and warbirds you can kill. You can actually get into a little joust with a wb no problem.

[CloudHelmut]

Oh, don't you worry about me. I kick ass in the weasel. :P

[PH]

Also Pure Hatred didn't know about this ability until the recent changes.. atleast that's what I read from the post in staff forums, who knows.. he was high on nyquil at the time :turned:.

Indeed I was. But no, I've known about the thrust shot for quite some time. I was just commenting that the reduced energy drain for boost made it easier and faster to pop a thrust shot off. In all honesty I don't use the thrust shot much unless someone insists on dueling with me. Other than that, I don't really care for it and I wouldn't really give a damn if they took it out and swapped it for something more relative to basing.

[Rion.]

Bring back the old Weasel when only like 5 of us could use it effectively.

That was fun.

They're overpowered now.

And this is sad, as you can see here: