Thread not about the Thunder sub that cost Pirates the game. Don't worry.

[Summa]

all of this banter seems irrelevant as i stated earlier. those people with some knowledge of the bots and how they work, along with some programming knowledge have spoken. the unintelligible banter and uninformed reasoning is not going to hold more water than what the few people who know something have said. those who at least knew what they were talking about to some degree either simply laid out the situation objectively or sided with the appeal being accepted. the twl op said "no" in the face of comparatively substantial evidence in the opposite direction. that says "hey i will not be reasoned with". end of story, quit whining, you'll make playoffs anyway.

[Capital Knockers]

I've said all I can say, I'm pull my head outta this swirly before my hairstyle goes back a few decades.

Oh and draft, be careful! I'll pull a vt response on you.

[Dwopple]

ease shouldnt have died, but he did.
if ease shouldnt have died, then chuckle shouldnt have either, but he did.

i dont get what mirror is stuck on? yeah, if the bots were perfect then NONE of this should have happened. but it did.


like ive said twice now, the game could have gone either way had the bot been perfect. Its not like thunder was up on us by 15 kills. We arent asking for Draft or Thunder to be removed from TWL, we just want a fair rematch.


sheesh

[Dwopple]

oh and to creature's psuedocode bullshit:


There is a delay between the !sub command and the actual sub, yes?

The !sub command was given

during this delay ease and chuckle both died

Then the bot went through with the original !sub command and Ardour was put in with an extra death.


how else would thunder get 51 deaths when both the TWLbot and f2 recorded ease with 10 deaths???

[kthx]

You know none of what we are talking about even matters, we are getting stuck on semantics instead of the real problem.

If this game was the TWLD finals would you have allowed Thunder to win TWL-D based on a bot bug that was being manipulated?

That is really the only question that matters, if you wouldn't then you are basically admitting that it is a stupid way for a squad to win a game and that this match needs to be replayed.

If you would then you are basically leaving yourself open to another "Stray vs Thunder" situation from last seasons TWLD, and I don't think TWL can handle another moronic decision like that.

Because although the TWLD finals has higher stakes, every game in this league should be treated with equal importance.

[Zingy]

bot bug that was being manipulated

Manipulation requires intent to abuse some kind of "bug." Subbing when someone is about to die isn't illegal and is not a "bug" and therefore it is not "manipulation" ... the wording makes a difference, and I feel that your use of "manipulation" is just an attempt to incite reactions...

I wouldn't call it a bug because it's merely an issue of timing. When it comes to programming and the internet, there are delays in everything that is done. The timing of the bullet hitting Ease was in such a way that in the time the bot went through the subbing routine (milliseconds) to put Ardour in, Ease was still alive, otherwise the sub would not have gone through. The bot determines whether a sub should go through based on whether they are still alive at the time the bot is about to put a new player in, not when the !sub command was actually done.

[kthx]

Pretty sure a bug is any mistake in the code of a bot in the terms we are using it in, therefore it is a bug, and it was manipulated to win a game.

[Zingy]

Pretty sure a bug is any mistake in the code of a bot in the terms we are using it in, therefore it is a bug, and it was manipulated to win a game.

Something that is due to a delay caused by either lag or because of inherent latency in any form of computer programming is not a bug.

[kthx]

Well in which case, there was only two possible scenarios.

1. What you are saying is true and Ease technically didn't die before the sub.

2. You are wrong because Chuckle died to Ease's bullet at the same time Ease died to chuckle. Either way it caused a situation in the game that drastically affected the outcome.

[Zingy]

Well in which case, there was only two possible scenarios.

1. What you are saying is true and Ease technically didn't die before the sub.

2. You are wrong because Chuckle died to Ease's bullet at the same time Ease died to chuckle. Either way it caused a situation in the game that drastically affected the outcome.

I'm not sure what the relevance of #2 is. The server's record already shows that Chuckle died to Ease's bullet before Ease died to Chuckle's bullet. I am referring specifically to the server's record and not the bot's record.

[Summa]

Manipulation requires intent to abuse some kind of "bug."

you forgot the word concious. i don't think this was done at all with the concious intention of exploiting a bug, and thus it was not manipulation. your idea is fine, word choice....not so much

[kthx]

1. Ease got Killed
2. Ease got specced for 10 deaths
3. Ease got subbed for Ardour.

---

The server log showed these three things happening at the exact same time, in the same second, in this order. How can you argue it?

[Scoop]

You know none of what we are talking about even matters, we are getting stuck on semantics instead of the real problem.

If this game was the TWLD finals would you have allowed Thunder to win TWL-D based on a bot bug that was being manipulated?

That is really the only question that matters, if you wouldn't then you are basically admitting that it is a stupid way for a squad to win a game and that this match needs to be replayed.

If you would then you are basically leaving yourself open to another "Stray vs Thunder" situation from last seasons TWLD, and I don't think TWL can handle another moronic decision like that.

Because although the TWLD finals has higher stakes, every game in this league should be treated with equal importance.

[Stabwound]

Something that is due to a delay caused by either lag or because of inherent latency in any form of computer programming is not a bug.

It may not be a bug, but it's definitely an oversight as this situation is something that should have been accounted for in the code.

[Capital Knockers]

Screw it, I said I'm out of this arguement, I'm out.