Distension discussion

[gdugwyler]

Distension doesn't run like every other event, though -- and as you know, not every event runs for only 30 minutes. Many do run longer. However, the difference between those long-running events and D are that people feel (like TWD) more invested in the play. That is to say, who they are is more important in Dist than in most other places; the bot remembers them and their decisions, and those decisions have a lasting impact on their gameplay for hours to come. It's not merely an event. At present it's hosted like an event, sure, but it really has no more need for a host than does tourny.

The reason that there are specific hosts for the game at present is due to a number of factors, the largest being that it's exceedingly complex, and those who host it need to be aware of its intricacies. The host is someone of whom one can ask questions and get solid answers. The host also operates somewhat like the beta-testing operators -- conduits for reporting bugs and ideas. It's not a difficult job, but it doesn't lack in requirements. Note that for security & safety reasons, all SMod+ have operator commands, though without strictly being recognized as operators. Those who play Dist are of course welcomed to host it as a normal Op if they feel comfortable doing so, however.

There are a few notable exceptions as far as events that can't be hosted by ERs -- Trivia I think is still one. Eventually, once Distension becomes (comfortably) part of the TW lifestyle, and almost all staff are familiar with it, it's likely that all senior ERs+ will be given the ability to control it to some degree -- enough to be able to host or shut it down as needed. It won't be that big a deal at that point; the controversy will be solved.

One benefit to an increasing number of Distension players is an increasing involvement in the zone. While any number of players may wait for Dist to load, only 40 can play; the rest can either wait or do something else. What happens when a player who's played too much that day is booted, and has to wait quite a while to get back in? Does he or she log off? Or does the player wait around a while, possibly attending hosted events, going to a JD, playing some pub? It's hard to say exactly without tracking people. I'd like to think that so long as we present high-quality offerings to substitute Distension when it's unavailable, players will stay. As the regular Distension population grows, the player limit will not. Maybe a solution is to allow them to wait in other arenas? For example, rather than sitting in spec in Distension, if you put yourself on the waiting list, the bot could PM you that a slot has opened up, and they'd have X minutes to wrap up what they're doing before the slot is given away again. While this might encourage some dropouts, at the very least waiting players could get involved in other aspects of the zone.

The other thing I'd been thinking about (as a distant potential) would be league games using Distension ships. In a contained match, players would be given rank X in all ships, and would have 10 minutes to assemble their ships as they please. After that point, you'd have a DD, JD or BD proceed as normal. This might open up more options, really... perhaps it would legitimize Levis and Weasels in basing, as well as allow new leagues to open? This could bridge Distension-only players with league play, and perhaps encourage larger kinds of competition... players might be competitive in the Distension version of BD, and also the regular DD. Wark also has an idea for Distension squads internal to the game that might help players become involved in other parts of the zone.

Bottom line: let's think of ways Distension can be used to bring the zone population and participation back up. If we assume it will divide us, or take over entirely, we're admitting to defeat that none would like.

[Soilderz]

distension should be an event that can be hosted like.. half hour everytime, by any ER+ (like any other event) Distension pretty much kills everything else in the zone, especially when it's hosted for hours at times.

[Peace_Maker]

Solution is to allow more people to start it. It is an event. ERs, event referees, should be able to start and stop this bot. What other staff started events can they not control? None that I know of.

[Kolar]

You're not seeing a decrease in <ER> events because of distension, you are seeing a decrease in event population because the <ER>'s are retarded and fuck everything up. .?go bug would have 40+ people if Flibb or Chao was hosting it, but I haven't seen Charis get more than 8 people to an event yet, even during peak hours, when distension isn't even running, because he/she (shim) ruins everything "shim" touches. I don't see the logic is holding 50 people hostage in distension for 30 minutes, so Flion or Charis can host a shitty event for 6 people.

From my perspective I think Hosted Events and games like Distention, even TWD, TWL, Elim ect... they target different people in the zone. You don't see your average TWL player playing ?go bug or a game of zombies. A lot of staffers seem to not understand that, and why should they? All they see is their position in this zone becoming less important so naturally they will fight back against something like Distension. In doing so they've lost sight of what staff's and development's role is here. It's not about their position or whatever they do here.

People aren't locked into those two categories either but if they are not exposed to something either then a random game of zombies or bug they will eventually return to Pub and never go beyond that, eventually tire of the environment and not return. Distension and by extension most advanced systems in this zone like it (TWD as another example) has the potential to retain player interest and maybe turn around our downward population stats.

All of that said I don't think it's our place to put a value on Dist over that of ER events, I think the general public has already spoken and it's our job to find a balance between the two while acknowledging the want of the player base. There are going to be legitimate times for Dist to not be online and also for no ERs to host events, most notable during TWL games. The best solution would be to figure out first how long per day (for now) should the play window be open and second how it should rotate day to day so everyone gets an opportunity to play.

Randomly turning it off and on throughout the day is causing too many problems within Staff right now and those coordinating it I think know this and want to cause that unneeded controversy.

[Raible]

This is how to me repels and everything connected to them appears to work:

At the instant you press repel, your SS client repels everything that's within range and it 'knows' about. However it doesn't do this every frame it renders, only let's say every 4th. Let there be a WB at fairly close range that fired. So prior to the next frame your client gets the info that a bullet was shot at a specific point and direction 1/5 of a second ago (laggy), calculates where the bullet is now and displays the bullet. Even though the bullet is in the repel effect area, your client doesn't check for it. Had you pressed repel at this frame, your client would've known the bullet was there and repelled it. You didn't, the shot travels for another 2 frames and hits, you die by rep ignore.

The one and only true solution:

Make bullets (and bombs) slower so there are more frames in which they are in-flight per distance travelled. Anyone want to argue for that?

Increasing the repel strength (i.e. RepelSpeed) won't do anything for helping rep ignore, only drive everyone else crazy. Decreasing it will make repped mines travel too slowly among other things.

Increasing the repel radius (i.e. RepelDistance) won't do anything for helping rep ignore at close range, but decrease the skill required to stop a bullet at longer range, rise the duration and likelyhood of battles being stalemates exponentially, aside from driving everyone else crazy. Decreasing it would make even the skillful sharks complain.

If you travel at high speed, don't expect repels to do much for you since you'll be out of the repel radious sooner the faster you travel. The repel doesn't stick with you. And a shark like any ship should require skill to play, dodge, wait for the moment to rep, not plow through a contested flagroom with rep-rep-rep-rep expecting to be invincible doing so.

I like the present speed and distance settings but would put RepelTime to something lower (170 or 150) for various reasons. Creates strange effects for an otherwise manouverable ship rushing around even when the shark that repped may be far away already.

[dako]

Dakos specs:

Warbird - Artillery - The main thing that seperates a helpful warbird from a useless one is how fast he can pick off people attaching to the terr, or stragglers around the base perimeter. A faster fire rate helps this immensely, so you dont HAVE TO SIT IN THE EAR AND SNIPE!

Javelin - Scout / Artillery - This is a toughie, because javelin needs to be able to lob bombs a a decent rate. With artillery, you can achieve this faster. However, with artillery, you can NOT fire a level 2 bomb when you get to level 40 and are able to purchase the upgrade (you can with a scout, but this compensates some fire speed).

Spider - Artillery - Lets face it, obvious choice here. Spiders, regardless of specialization, are not ever going to be a tank. Make use of the spiders already fast recharge and ramp it up, I think with artillery you can shoot a constant stream without losing energy because of the fast regen.

Lev - Scout - Yes. Scout. The only class I left the way it was. Mainly because of the UP cost. Portals are expensive, so is multifire, and eventually, prox, level 3s, and shrap. You need all the UP you can get, and levs need to be able to both tank and shoot their bombs at reasonable speed (warship lev takes forever to load a bomb :_( )

Terrier - ??? - I only played terrier until 20, because I absolutely suck at this class, so I left it scout. Looking at it however, I would go with either warship or z-class.

Weasel - Warship - Also seems pretty obvious to me, once you get cloak + stealth + level 3s, you basically become a suicide bomber for terrs. You only really get one or two shots, and cloak / stealth is hella drain on you, so you need to be able to take as much punishment as you can while closing distance on the enemy terr. However, artillery would probably fare better for those lame people that sit in the ear and lob multi level 2s to get streaks.

Lanc - Z-class (pure tank) - Lanc was meant to be a tank anyway, but the leeching makes this obvious at high levels. Once you get to 60% leech, recharge shouldn't matter at all, because more than half the time you kill someone, youll get a full charge anyway. You're also going to need the UP for the bomb / leech / firebloom / multi / level 3s.

Shark - ??? - I played shark for a while on warship, but I didnt do very well, it was painful for me to get to 20, im at a loss for this ship.

[Stabwound]

btw, I left you an important in game ?msg regarding distension

[gdugwyler]

Repel settings

Don't have time for everything, but I just wanted to post the repel settings. First, a description:

Repel:RepelSpeed:::Speed at which players are repelled
Repel:RepelTime:::Time players are affected by the repel (in hundredths of a second)
Repel:RepelDistance:::Number of pixels from the player that are affected by a repel.


These are the default TW settings:

RepelSpeed=1200
RepelTime=150
RepelDistance=150


These are the Distension settings:

RepelSpeed=1100
RepelTime=190
RepelDistance=150



You'd think that only the distance would really matter for repping WB bullets. Note that WB bullet speed is exactly the same in Dist as in pub. I'm willing to bet if sharks weren't able to move as fast as they can at present, they could rep these fast bullets (the rep wouldn't "go off behind them"). I shark a decent bit, and I've definitely noticed the ability to rep goes right down the toilet the faster you run at the bullet, and it's not even about timing. Really, if the bullet didn't hit you, your rep would actually repel it in most cases if you press the button at the right time. (Imagine a ghost shark for this example.) However, I'm certainly willing to entertain modifying repel settings; I'd like the shark to be a valuable, entertaining and skillful ship. (Perhaps some of the skill needed is moving slowly?) To this end, we could increase the power of the distance somewhat, considering the larger flagroom, while reducing the time and speed... and we can also try returning to default TW settings for a bit to see if that's a bit more comfortable. Really, though (and pardon me if it doesn't seem relevant) if you thrust at the enemy and rep in normal TW, your rep is still likely to go off behind you as you take the bullet yourself.

[CounterPunch]

Getting Weasel Back Bug?

Previously I had lost weasel to someone.

After getting 20 kills in spider it says:
(DBot)>For earning 20 successive kills, your Weasel has been returned to the hangar!

I went on to get a 30 kill streak and then died. It never said I lost it to anyone.

However, my weasel is still locked. Why is that? Can anyone tell me.

Is this a bug in Distension? How do I get my weasel back? :unsure:

[Wil]

z-class your terr so you can get double burst/3 portal/multi-fire terr. Killing machine!

[Stabwound]

Terr - I would say Warship, but again emphasize not to do it too early in the ranks, for the 4UP you get per level with leave you at a huge disadvantage. I would say leave it as scout until at least level 50, which comes quickly for ship #5.

Umm, changing specializations gives you all of the UP you'd have had if you specialized at rank 10, so putting it off until a later rank does nothing except waste RP.

[Raible]

Can someone please explain all of the specialization penalties and if I do not like it will I get my RP back when going back to scout?

With a rank 39 terr it'll cost you about 6600RP each time (no going back) you specialize, which isn't that big of a deal at this level, just enough to not do it every day. You can also savely type '!specialize 1' to the bot and it'll tell you what'll happen and how much it'll cost since you have to include ':yes' to actually make it happen.


About Imbalance:

I've been thinking there could be a system of one army requisitioning a player from the other army or out of spec (putting him/her into a priority queue). Either for one round/until a war is won/lost (player should be locked to this army) or completely defect. Both need of course some incentive to this player that may or may not be paid for in RP by the players of that army. For example this player gets a bonus to profit sharing or an RP % increase while he's fulfilling his/her 'contract'. Tactical ops and/or a few of the players with the most wins and/or everyone once every X minutes might start an internal vote to requisition a player, and if more than half support the vote, the player itself is asked.

LF's Specializations

I see people inquiring about this alot in game, so I figured I'd list what I have as my specializations for other people to consider. Those who don't agree, feel free to edit it to your own preferences.

Warbird - Z-Class. This ship doesn't get a whole lot of anything before level 30. So it may even be worth it to wait until that point to specialize out of your scout.

Javelin - Do not use.

Spider - Artillery. Description alone makes it sound ideal for the spider. Though doing this too early in the ranks kinda sucks. I have fast recharge, but can only shoot 3 bullets before I'm out of energy. (I'm level 18 i think)

Levi - Scout. You're going to need the high # of UP per level, so I'd use this or Science Vessel. This is my highest ranking ship, and scout has worked out just fine for me. (Note: Max speed, rotation can be maxed out before level 25, so the rest of your UP can be spent on special abilities)

Terr - I would say Warship, but again emphasize not to do it too early in the ranks, for the 4UP you get per level with leave you at a huge disadvantage. I would say leave it as scout until at least level 50, which comes quickly for ship #5.

Weasel - I chose Z-Class for my weasel and had a lot of fun with it. Gave myself enough energy and recharge to eat a bullet and shoot one of my own, and enough speed/thrust to juke some terrs right out of their panties (gazo mainly)

Lanc - Haven't unlocked this. Don't really care to either.

Shark - The obvious choice here would be warship. The not so obvious fact to Distension newbies is DON'T DO IT EARLY LIKE I DID. I absolutely refuse to spend 3% of my RP to specialize back to Scout, because I think that's a huge ripoff, but I am now a level 23 shark, with less abilities than a level 18 shark. (Only 4UP per level up)

[2kill]

I would like to try specialization but as a rank 39 terr. I have been told I will lose 3% of my total RP earned so far. I have not done the math but to me I think it will be a lot. Can someone please explain all of the specialization penalties and if I do not like it will I get my RP back when going back to scout? Make the title specialization so its easy to see for future reference please.

when you are level 10 to 15 (they were talking about rising it to 20) you get free specializations to try out the different types. after level 15 (or 20) every specialization costs you the 3% of your total rp. but if you have never choosen a shiptype before there will be no rp penalties, so choose wisely. Also going back to scout will cost you another 3% rp

hope that helps
2kill

[Peace_Maker]

specialization

I would like to try specialization but as a rank 39 terr. I have been told I will lose 3% of my total RP earned so far. I have not done the math but to me I think it will be a lot. Can someone please explain all of the specialization penalties and if I do not like it will I get my RP back when going back to scout? Make the title specialization so its easy to see for future reference please.