Forum Mafia - Shawshank Redemption - Salvation lies within

[WillBy]

They do where I'm from. I think someone did bring it up though because I was thinking of asking about it.
On a total aside, you're wrong about Tiger Mafia's ascetic cult leader being kill immune while ascetic Exalt; asectic is nonkill actions

Anyway, mod confirmation that willby has no vote today.
WillBy what happens if you win the flip? You get two votes, but does your target lose theirs? If yes, since you targeted PF, does that mean you thought they were scum?
Your role is strictly bad for town if you're not targeting scum, since it destroys more votes than it creates.

I think I mentioned the ascetic thing, mb then. I've never used that modifier before.

Whoever loses gets no vote. Nothing changes for the winner. My role is only 2 shot, I elected to use it N1 against someone I suspected (hoping to town clear me- claiming a role but saying I havent used it at all is begging for town credit but not offering any proof). The damage from a N1 failure would be minimal compared to other nights. I am suspicious of PF, she has a reason for afkness but that doesnt town clear her. I know she can be dangerous as scum, and shes relatively under the radar at the moment. If shes town, I wouldnt feel as bad as she hasnt been exceptionally active so far. In short, PF was a high value low risk target in my eyes. FWIW I was planning on abstaining, then jessup broke the flavor rule, so I planned on saving us all from jessup votes this phase. But i do trust her role claim to a degree, so I didnt want to play against someone I do believe to be townie.

[scarlet]

What an odd role. Outside of edge cases for mylo, it seems like all it really does is add something inconvenient for kassius/wildcards to roll.
Anyway, if it's a 2shot role and it can only delete votes, what are you doing using it on anything that's not confirmed scum (i.e. ever)?
As far as I'm concerned, you've more or less claimed vanilla town. It's been partially confirmed by the mod now, but the point is that you're claiming and demonstrating that you're not e.g. the cop (or doctor, or jailkeeper).
What was your thinking in doing this? I wouldn't have said you were in any danger of lynch coming into this phase.

IMO exalt's case on willby has at some point diverged totally from what's going on in the thread. Either he has some secret reason for doing this that he doesn't feel like sharing with the class, possibly due to quote related (below), or it's bullshit. The fact that he's yet to either: substantiate his claim that he had reason to think willby was scum D1, or justify why he didn't post it before D2 and still hasn't posted it, is always going to make me doubt the legitimacy of his until it's resolved. I'm back to reading willby as town, anyway, so I don't mind that exalt's pet lynch is probably going to stall.
Quote for context. Feels like exalt is playing the game outside the thread, which can be a scumread or a PR read, but that's neither here nor there. He claims to have a way to convince me to vote with him that he refuses to post, so until I see that he can eat shit.

No, it doesn't, because again, I have a strong reason to believe multiple people in this game have voting modifiers of some kind, possibly ones that could trade the ability to vote the following day with the ability to do something else.

[Vehicle]

OK I read through the thread and I don't have much to add.

I officially think WIllby is full of shit. Sure he lost his vote power but as scarlet rightly points out this is basically an anti-town role regardless. If we knew someone was scum, we would vote for them. There'd be no need for you to play tiddly-winks with them overnight.

While it is clear that Willby lost his vote, that in no way clears him as town. I also thing his back-and-forth with Kassius has him coming out looking worse than Kassius.

With a lack of better evidence (ie: voting field for the way he speaks to people, or PF because of his lack of activity), I'm:
Voting WIllby

[m_leonhard]

I was googling around trying to figure out what fluoride and bad meat have to do with shawshank, and I think I found an answer for fluoride. Several games ago, kthx spent a good portion of D1 arguing about the benefits of fluoride in the water with paul. So I think this is purely *ahem* flavor here. Cant be sure on the bad meat part.

Willby, do you realize that in addition to fluoridating water, why, there are studies underway to fluoridate salt, flour, fruit juices, soup, sugar, milk... ice cream. Ice cream, Willby, children's ice cream. You know when fluoridation first began?Nineteen hundred and forty-six. 1946, Willby. How does that coincide with your post-war Commie conspiracy, huh? It's incredibly obvious, isn't it? A foreign substance is introduced into our precious bodily fluids without the knowledge of the individual. Certainly without any choice. That's the way your hard-core Commie works. I, uh... I... I... first became aware of it, Willby, during the physical act of love. Yes, a uh, a profound sense of fatigue... a feeling of emptiness followed. Luckily I... I was able to interpret these feelings correctly. Loss of essence. I can assure you it has not recurred, Wibbly. Women uh... women sense my power and they seek the life essence. I, uh... I do not avoid women, Willby.But I... I do deny them my essence.

[scarlet]

What a cool and game-impactful post m_leonhard
Vote m_leonhard
Who do you think is scum? You briefly talked about willby's role in your last post, but never about how he's been playing or his alignment.

[WillBy]

What an odd role. Outside of edge cases for mylo, it seems like all it really does is add something inconvenient for kassius/wildcards to roll.
Anyway, if it's a 2shot role and it can only delete votes, what are you doing using it on anything that's not confirmed scum (i.e. ever)?
As far as I'm concerned, you've more or less claimed vanilla town. It's been partially confirmed by the mod now, but the point is that you're claiming and demonstrating that you're not e.g. the cop (or doctor, or jailkeeper).
What was your thinking in doing this? I wouldn't have said you were in any danger of lynch coming into this phase.

Yeah, it is useless until dangerous my/lylo situations. It's not even that useful on confirmed scum, because I would have to confirm they are scum the day before. And at that point, unless its controversial to lynch a confirmed scum, the power isnt useful anyways. And even in my/lylo situations, the fact that its 50% could flip things the other way, instant losing things for town.

That's why I decided the best thing I could do with my role is make it apparent as soon as possible. I took the best shot I could think of as I was typing my PM. Anyone active/better player would be a detriment to town. Anyone worse would be marginal advantage gained. Inactive players were, in my mind, good targets because if they dont vote in the first place, nothing was lost. If scum wants to waste a night kill on me over one of the more powerful roles, go for it. But my best odds for survival (not knowing anything else about setup, my survival = town survival) are to be closer to confirmed town as opposed to unknown, unconfirmed.

[m_leonhard]

What a cool and game-impactful post m_leonhard
Vote m_leonhard
Who do you think is scum? You briefly talked about willby's role in your last post, but never about how he's been playing or his alignment.

Hey, chill a second. It's not even 8 am and I'm just waking up. Decided to have fun with a joke about fluoride from one of my favorite movies. Give me a second to read everything before you attack me. God.

[scarlet]

WillBy but, to reuse the similie, that's like claiming vanilla unprovoked on D2. Congrats, you've successfully eliminated yourself from the pool of people scum are shooting into when aiming for powerroles. How does this benefit town? Why not just not act?

[WillBy]

OK I read through the thread and I don't have much to add.

I officially think WIllby is full of shit. Sure he lost his vote power but as scarlet rightly points out this is basically an anti-town role regardless. If we knew someone was scum, we would vote for them. There'd be no need for you to play tiddly-winks with them overnight.

While it is clear that Willby lost his vote, that in no way clears him as town. I also thing his back-and-forth with Kassius has him coming out looking worse than Kassius.

With a lack of better evidence (ie: voting field for the way he speaks to people, or PF because of his lack of activity), I'm:
Voting WIllby

Do you think I'm scum, or that my role has negative effects for town? Because roleblocker has negative effects for town. Or is it something to do with my interactions with kassius? Cause that guy hasnt given town anything less flavor-blasted than what youd expect from Elzars spice weasel.

you listed 2 half reasons and are treating it like a whole.

[kthx]

scarlet m_leonhard

Gentlemen, you can't fight in here. This is the war room.

[WillBy]

WillBy but, to reuse the similie, that's like claiming vanilla unprovoked on D2. Congrats, you've successfully eliminated yourself from the pool of people scum are shooting into when aiming for powerroles. How does this benefit town? Why not just not act?

I'm not convinced there are true vanillas this game. Instead we have relatively useless roles like mine. Additionally, it's a bit better than vanilla because it is, to a degree, verifiable. Finally, I wasnt exactly unprovoked, I had 100% of votes (2) at that point, nearly a third through the (expected) phase length. I thought we could put a stop to this nonsense early on, but apparently it just made it worse.

[m_leonhard]

I agree with scarlet, Willby's claim is useless and doesn't benefit town in any way. Assuming that Willby is fully telling the truth about his role...his actions make no sense if he were town.

First, if he only gets to use his vote blocking power twice, why blow it N1 why not wait until later in the game when we have more theories on who might be scum. Sure it's not the most useful role, but at least you have the potential to block a scum vote.

Second, why on earth would you use it on some random person N1? Your odds of hitting town at this stage are just as good, if not higher than hitting scum. Idk what PF's role is, but if PF is town and you successfully blocked....then we'd be out a town vote this turn.

Finally, even if this is all true, why the hell would it be claimed now? If you do have the power to block a future scum vote, why not just keep that quiet and attempt to use it against scum on a later round?

I don't know if this is a cult role, or a scum role, but it's not town.

VOTE WILLBY

[m_leonhard]

scarlet m_leonhard

Gentlemen, you can't fight in here. This is the war room.

Mein Fuehrer! I CAN WALK!

[Vehicle]

Do you think I'm scum, or that my role has negative effects for town? Because roleblocker has negative effects for town. Or is it something to do with my interactions with kassius? Cause that guy hasnt given town anything less flavor-blasted than what youd expect from Elzars spice weasel.

you listed 2 half reasons and are treating it like a whole.

Yes I think you're scum. I don't really see a use for you if you were town, so I don't really see a reason for your role to exist unless you were scum.

[WillBy]

I agree with scarlet, Willby's claim is useless and doesn't benefit town in any way. Assuming that Willby is fully telling the truth about his role...his actions make no sense if he were town.

First, if he only gets to use his vote blocking power twice, why blow it N1 why not wait until later in the game when we have more theories on who might be scum. Sure it's not the most useful role, but at least you have the potential to block a scum vote.

Second, why on earth would you use it on some random person N1? Your odds of hitting town at this stage are just as good, if not higher than hitting scum. Idk what PF's role is, but if PF is town and you successfully blocked....then we'd be out a town vote this turn.

Finally, even if this is all true, why the hell would it be claimed now? If you do have the power to block a future scum vote, why not just keep that quiet and attempt to use it against scum on a later round?

I don't know if this is a cult role, or a scum role, but it's not town.

VOTE WILLBY

Let me get this straight.

My role is useless and doesnt benefit town, but I should have waited to make sure I targeted scum. by this same logic a roleblocker should abstain N1 because they could block cop or something. Is that how you would play roleblocker?

and then you make an argument about not wanting to hit a townie with it. Of course this argument could be made for lynching D1 as well, but we all agreed that lynching someone day 1 is a good move as it provides information about players perspective. Except just losing a vote for D2 is a lot less impactful than lynching a power role.

Finally, what would I save my second shot for? The odds of me surviving to lylo twice are pretty low, especially when I claim to be abstaining from something every night.

Now here's a bit I think is interesting. You think that this could be a useful cult or scum role, but that it's definitely not town. Could you elaborate? Scum and cult are far more dependent on their ability to control votes. Why would scum use a role that gets rid of one of their votes? Moreover, what kind of bullshit would it be if scum could kill someone AND remove a townie vote the same phase? This would let scum bypass the last phase for an instant win. I dont see how this can be a balanced scum role, as it can function as a second kill in crucial moments.