Weasel Nerf'd

[Theif of Time]

recently I've been getting continuosly sniped by wbs in spawn for the simple fact that I cannot use both cloak and stealth. Not to kill people, just to get away. Weasel is so slow its a sitting duck, most wb's can radar shot to some extent (perhaps they were particularly skilled today) so i turn on stealth, turn off cloak. Then a wb spawns next to me or flys past, turns and shoots before I have time to get away. Sometimes I did have time to put on cloak, but that did not work either. Before, when i was on a pub with no terr, I could just cloak/stealth and the only threat would be terriers/javs/other weasels. But now, trying to fly to roof on the weasels tiny afterburner is futile, wbs pick me off 9x out of 10. Eventually I gave up and changed pubs.
And I say that it is good, if wb's are encouraged to change ships. I had a quick check through all the pubs today( 5 of them) and found that just under half of the players were wb's (with a total of about 35-50, whereas I spotted only 5 X's in 5 different pubs. Strangely, the Spider numbers were about the same. (This statistic is probably biased due to the fact GuanoBot was down, as was DockBot, But I believe it is accurate for non-pure pubs)
Is this the basing that pubs are supposed to encourage? half the players being wb's, spider virtually nonexistant, any decent basing packed full of javs and, believe it or not, slightly more lancs than spiders?Happy to say there was not a shortage of terriers or Levis, Approximatly 2 Lt's per pub.
So whats the bigger threat to basing, the 2 high speed big L3 bombers known as Lt's, or the single weasel (on average) in each pub? The abundance of wbs? or the wingle weasel? (in the wb's defence, most of them in the pubs which are usually pure were basing)

[SpiderMage]

I wonder if anyone has noticed the hit long range x radar has taken with the change to Weasels. Now since it takes energy to both cloak and stealth, most Weasels don't use stealth anymore, which means they are always on radar. The problem this poses is to mostly Terrs that switch x radar on and off to keep scout of the area adjacent to the flag room, to warn teammates on roof and in midbase. With stealth not being on, a Terr can't tell if an enemy that's on radar but off the screen is a Warbird or a Weasel.

It's not a huge problem, but it's a minor nuisence(sp?) that can make scouting and defense aspects of x radar less useful. It's still good for seeing cloaked ships, but now no longer useful for off screen Weasels.

[Riesen]

and it was a problem because the x's had an unfair advantage, not because it was inconvenient. if a mediocre player can have a 3:1 kill ratio in a specific ship, that's a pretty good sign that the ship was overpowered.

If you play a shark and laid mines in a tube and just ran away whenever an enemy showed up, you could do a lot better than 3:1.

If you play a warbird and do nothing buy spawn people, you can get a 3:1 or better, again, if you're good at running away.

Weasels kept a lot of things in check, and sure, they were a nuisance at times, too, but it's easier to hop in a terrier and take them out than it is to type a 10 paragraph thesis on why they're "overpowered". Now, I see more warbirds camping and spawning than ever. If you go hunt them, they just warp away. With a weasel, you could make sure they didn't. Simply put, it was an inconvenience to a lot of people, and they came here to voice their nonsensical reasons about how the ship is "overpowered" and "ruining the game". If you ask me, it's these anti-social, anti-teamwork people that are ruining the game.

I've been cloaked my fair share, even as a new player and didn't really know what it was, but I never came here and started complaining. I took some advice from other players on what to do about them, and now (well, not now) I ask the terriers or javs if there are any weasels nearby. Unfortunately, not everyone has the ability to type "//hey, is there a weasel nearby?" for whatever reason and thus the ship is ruined.

If you don't like playing a team game, then don't. Go to some arena where the main objective isn't dependent upon you working together with your team mates. Don't spin that "elim is for experienced players" bull, either. I've been in there and most of the players just spawn kill you and call you EZ. There's not a whole lot of difference between that and the way the pubs are now. You could also round up some friends and go to a private arena, or go in one by yourself and shoot at the rocks as targets. There are a lot more ways to practice than just spawning people in pubs.

[deutschpunkrevolte]

if U are teh girl on teh picure :wub:

u are damnit intelligent, clever... etc. :wub:

[Tone]

THe new settings are doing well and making a lot of sense. i was just in pub and i got Xed when i wasnt pay attention to radar. but thats a lot more fair that what went down before.

they can still get you if you ignore radar for a while. they just dont get you nearly as much and over and over and over while you try to play, its not like that anymore. settings are working very well.

also the cloakers have to operate more controls and use more strategy rather than just go around waiting to surprise people for kicks

[Kolar]

It's not a huge problem, but it's a minor nuisence(sp?) that can make scouting and defense aspects of x radar less useful. It's still good for seeing cloaked ships, but now no longer useful for off screen Weasels.

With the chaos going on in Mid you can still recharge while using Stealth, cloak and enter the Flag room if needed. The point you made would be an advantage to the weasel and its Freq and I don't see a problem with it.

Other posters:
If you're spawning as a weasel then the settings are not going to be changed in your favor to make this easier, this is about pubbing/basing.

[deutschpunkrevolte]

hell stfu tone

[PH]

THe new settings are doing well and making a lot of sense. i was just in pub and i got Xed when i wasnt pay attention to radar. but thats a lot more fair that what went down before.

they can still get you if you ignore radar for a while. they just dont get you nearly as much and over and over and over while you try to play, its not like that anymore. settings are working very well.

also the cloakers have to operate more controls and use more strategy rather than just go around waiting to surprise people for kicks

Yeah, the settings are working well for you and your spawner/LT buddies. Every pub, pure and otherwise, that I've watched in the past two days has been dead as far as basing goes. Yep, settings are working. Uh huh.

The settings are working.
The settings are working.
The settings are working.
The settings are working.
The settings are working.
The settings are working.
The settings are working.
The settings are working.

[Subjugation]

If you play a shark and laid mines in a tube and just ran away whenever an enemy showed up, you could do a lot better than 3:1.

If you play a warbird and do nothing buy spawn people, you can get a 3:1 or better, again, if you're good at running away.

As far as the shark comment goes, if you're flying up the main tube, and you run into mines, it's pretty much your own fault for dying. People mine the main chute all the time, and it's just a matter of paying attention to your screen and looking to see if there are mines there. That's completely a different situation than some newb cloaker in the spawn.

And as far as your 3:1 ratio for wb's go...you have no clue what you're talking about. I'm a perfect example of mediocrity with a wb. I have a 1:1 rec and even if I were to just go around laming levis, the best I could do is probably a 1.5-2:1 ratio. In fact, if a 3:1 rec in wb was as easy as you claim, it would probably be the average.

Weasels kept a lot of things in check, and sure, they were a nuisance at times, too, but it's easier to hop in a terrier and take them out than it is to type a 10 paragraph thesis on why they're "overpowered". Now, I see more warbirds camping and spawning than ever. If you go hunt them, they just warp away. With a weasel, you could make sure they didn't. Simply put, it was an inconvenience to a lot of people, and they came here to voice their nonsensical reasons about how the ship is "overpowered" and "ruining the game". If you ask me, it's these anti-social, anti-teamwork people that are ruining the game.

I've been cloaked my fair share, even as a new player and didn't really know what it was, but I never came here and started complaining. I took some advice from other players on what to do about them, and now (well, not now) I ask the terriers or javs if there are any weasels nearby. Unfortunately, not everyone has the ability to type "//hey, is there a weasel nearby?" for whatever reason and thus the ship is ruined.

If you don't like playing a team game, then don't. Go to some arena where the main objective isn't dependent upon you working together with your team mates. Don't spin that "elim is for experienced players" bull, either. I've been in there and most of the players just spawn kill you and call you EZ. There's not a whole lot of difference between that and the way the pubs are now. You could also round up some friends and go to a private arena, or go in one by yourself and shoot at the rocks as targets. There are a lot more ways to practice than just spawning people in pubs.

Blah, nevermind. I don't know why I even bothered. I found out you're pretty much a hypocrite who should take his own advice about "it's only a problem when it's inconvenient to you". So when the shoe is on the other foot, I see you don't like it so much.

[deutschpunkrevolte]

let s keep it empiric:

if one weasel has nrg drain when cloaked it sucks
if two weasels have nrg drain when cloaked it sucks even more
if 3 weasels have nrg drain when cloaked it sucks even more
if 4 weasels have nrg drain when cloaked it sucks even more
if 5 weasels have nrg drain when cloaked it sucks even more
...

empiric enuf for u <_<

[PH]

Blah, nevermind. I don't know why I even bothered. I found out you're pretty much a hypocrite who should take his own advice about "it's only a problem when it's inconvenient to you". So when the shoe is on the other foot, I see you don't like it so much.

And you expected better when the average player of this game can't even buy a pack of smokes? You, Tone and probably a few other shitheads would still be bitching up a storm if the shoe was still on our foot, so I really don't know why you're pulling a holier-than-thou here.

Ditch these settings and give us back the big Weasel so the ship isn't a useless gimmick like it is now. Do I need to make 500 threads about it so staff will bow down? Do I need to repeat myself ten times in each post?

I love how arrogant most of the people who are satisfied with this change have become. Another life-or-death battle has ended in victory for those living the Internerd spaceship game fantasy.

[Subjugation]

And you expected better when the average player of this game can't even buy a pack of smokes? You, Tone and probably a few other shitheads would still be bitching up a storm if the shoe was still on our foot, so I really don't know why you're pulling a holier-than-thou here.

Ditch these settings and give us back the big Weasel so the ship isn't a useless gimmick like it is now. Do I need to make 500 threads about it so staff will bow down? Do I need to repeat myself ten times in each post?

I love how arrogant most of the people who are satisfied with this change have become. Another life-or-death battle has ended in victory for those living the Internerd spaceship game fantasy.

I'm pulling a holier than reisen attitude, because I'm not the one guilty of not following my own advice. So when I start doing that, I welcome you to set me straight.

btw, what's the big deal anyway? you can still use the ship to base, and still has plenty of lameness to x people in the spawn. The only difference is it requires more skill in manipulating the functions, and paying attention to your energy levels. I've been playing the x a lot for the last 2 days, and I dont' see how it has been crippled beyond function.

[PH]

Because of the variety of ships and the ways they can be played, someone's ALWAYS going to be inconvenienced by certain players and/or ships. I'm going to pull a Tone and repeat myself a few times.

Basers with bad communication skills are inconvenienced by LT's, roof javs and the occasional Weasel sneaking into the FR. This is their fault for not calling out the location of the threat and neutralizing it quickly and effectively. Inexperienced Javelins also don't know how to calculate bomb trajectories, and more often than not they don't know when to use bullets rather than bombs. Blaming the least frequent threat, the Weasel, for basers screwing up is ridiculous.

Spawners/"Duelers" and campers/"snipers", who are notorious for refusing to work with their teammates, are inconvenienced by Weasels. This is their fault for a couple of reasons. One, the newer players might not know that the big blob-looking thing on the radar is not for decoration. It is, in fact, a base. With a flag inside. If they're not interested in basing then there are other arenas (wbduel, elim, almost any private arena), all of which are readily available to them, that would be better suited for practicing than a pub.

This is where the "team" aspect came into play. Every ship worked together to protect one another. Now, by crippling an assassin ship that forced an opponent to cooperate with his teammates rather than follow his own selfish agenda, the team aspect is out the window. I've watched five different pubs, one pure and four regular, at least three times apiece, and not once have I seen more than five ships per side, at least three of which were javs every single time, trying to base. Everyone else is chasing an LT or having a pissing contest in the spawn zone, and killing anyone unfortunate enough to pass through the area en route to the base.

Eeks said it before, but he meant it in an entirely different way. I'm going to say it again and mean it on a much different, and broader, scale. Basing = dead. And all because a few selfish whiners wouldn't work with their team. Props, people. Big fuckin' props. I don't know how you did it, but with one tiny change to a ship that was a "minority" at best, you've destroyed basing.

EDIT: Saying you can still base with this gimmick Weasel is like saying you can use the Spider as a basing ship even if its firing rate is cut by 75%. A well-rounded basing team with good communication can neutralize any Weasel, with any settings. I tested a lot of teams' communication skills with the old Weasel, and I found that the average pub basing team, with a lineup that looked something like one terr, six javs, one spider and maybe one lanc, was horrible at watching out for and disposing of me. So what this leads me to believe is that rather than educate the stupid basers, staff took a shortcut and said "Okay, you guys can't communicate and we're sick of Tone's whining, so here. You don't need to talk to each other at all now. Enjoy." Voilá. The Weasel "menace" is now severely crippled. And yet the basing teams are still made up of mostly Javelins, almost none of which can aim to save their life. Props for fucking up your priorities this badly, boys. I didn't think it could be done.

[deutschpunkrevolte]

*dancing the forbidden dance to show FULL ACK to PURE HATRED*

[Kolar]

Well you guys are hopeless but at least you're fighting amongst yourselves now, not with people who actually want to make the zone better.

Spawners/"Duelers" and campers/"snipers", who are notorious for refusing to work with their teammates, are inconvenienced by Weasels.

If a weasel is spawning or not inside the base then they do not matter. What would killing or harassing them do? certainly not want to go inside the base.

I've watched five different pubs, one pure and four regular, at least three times apiece, and not once have I seen more than five ships per side, at least three of which were javs every single time, trying to base. Everyone else is chasing an LT or having a pissing contest in the spawn zone, and killing anyone unfortunate enough to pass through the area en route to the base.

Pure Hatred, by reducing this ship's effect on public it has strengthened basing from what I've seen. I've seen more publics full with 30 people or more and even at 12 am as I'm writing this almost all of them have even teams of more then 10 people. I'm seeing a lot of action in the flag rooms and in Mid. I think you're all over stating the effects of the weasel on the entire game.

Eeks said it before, but he meant it in an entirely different way. I'm going to say it again and mean it on a much different, and broader, scale. Basing = dead. And all because a few selfish whiners wouldn't work with their team. Props, people. Big fuckin' props. I don't know how you did it, but with one tiny change to a ship that was a "minority" at best, you've destroyed basing.

Eeks was talking about ?go base and in general the basing comunity since it has be diluted by newer players. The older players have lost their drive to do all that they can to win.


If basing in the publics has not changed (which I believe it has not for all 3 different modern weasel settings) then the small minority of weasel users would not have a global effect over the public arenas and reducing their power and abilities in publics to balance out the settings would not do anything to cause problems in TW. If you would like to say Staff is not doing the right thing here to make basing better (because you cant really say anything else about thier effect in publics, because that's all they should be doing) then do so but do not imply that basing is dying due to this.

EDIT: Saying you can still base with this gimmick Weasel is like saying you can use the Spider as a basing ship even if its firing rate is cut by 75%. A well-rounded basing team with good communication can neutralize any Weasel, with any settings.

And you are not always going to have that or even a terrier in most publics. Can you not see that we are not promoting or encouraging basing in the publics if we appease small and insignificant minorities. That's not saying, "hey everyone else, you're fucked if you're not a baser" this is beyond that, the publics have a primary goal and that is basing/flagging.

And yet the basing teams are still made up of mostly Javelins, almost none of which can aim to save their life. Props for fucking up your priorities this badly, boys. I didn't think it could be done.

The only reason why people have started to use javs more recently is to hunt down weasels.


You can do everything you could before the change but now you need to watch your energy, use some brain power and develop some skill for this ship. The changes were made not to apease anyone but to make the publics better and that's that. Staff, dock, Priitk, bluemoon; they wouldn't be paying for this shit if they didn't want to make it better. When I say better, I'm not saying it as a baser, a staffer or anything but a player of this zone, that's what this change was for and that's why so many people play it.