Cloakers Ruining TW. Not "Balance"

[Troll King]

Aren't you the same person who started a thread about how staff changed the weasel settings into what they are now? You were the one who didn't like that change. No one here has said anything about being against the concept of "change". The only thing I see is people being against the kind of changes you want to make.

In order for people to want change things, you have to give them a reason for changes to be made. Change has to be made to improve things, not just for the sake of change. If your reason for change is that warbirds can't defend against them then that's not good enough a reason for change. Sharks don't have a reasonable defence against spiders but that won't lead to a change.

If you want to make changes then be more specific: don't just say "change it because it is lame". That's much too vague a statement. What's so lame about it?

As for giving arguments that don't "suck", those argument don't suck. They are perfectly valid. The only reason you say they "suck" is because they disagree with you. I haven't seen you actually address any of those arguments with a legitimate response other than to just say they are stupid. If you think they are stupid then say why. Just calling them stupid isn't good enough.

[za gophar]

i disagree with most of what you say. i guess no one cares if they get cloaked, you are right about that. that's why i cloaked over 300 people on sunday. most of them complained, but i guess that doesnt mean they care. i will continue to cloak, especially in the pure pubs and especially targeting people i have heard of before. it doesnt make that much of a difference if just i do it, but from now on the more discontent i cause in pubs the better.

sharks do have a reasonable defense against spiders. they can run away when they see one, it is not that hard. if you want to shark for bounty, fine, go ahead, there are some nice ways to do that and i have gotten bounties above 300 doing it. if you want to shark for you team, that's a different kettle of fish. you accept that you will die for you team. you dont have to, but you make the decision to. so feel free to find another example for me to consider.

[Sarien]

TELL ME WHY YOU PLAY WEASEL AND WHY IT SHOULD NOT BE SLIGHTLY MODIFIED TO DECREASE IT'S LAME FACTOR. YOUR ARGUMENTS SUCK, SHUT THE FUCK UP, UNLESS YOU PLAY WEASEL AND PUB A LOT AND DONT THINK IT SHOULD BE MODIFIED. THANK YOU.

Old small settings with rocket, new settings, it doesn't matter to me.
It shouldn't be modified in the way you want it modified to give your warbird a way to continually see it, because that's what ship 6 in TW is for. It's about being sneaky. It's an assassinating ship. I use it when my team is being held from the flagroom hardcore, and I can sneak in, and either pop their terrier/terriers, or cause enough of a disruption to allow the rest of my team a beach head to get in the door. I also use it when there are lots of enemy X around, and I'll fight their X with mine. It's a better ship to fight against weasels now, and I think that's a good thing. I always thought it was kind of stupid that terriers should be the "X Hunter". It's more in line with their role as attach point that they watch for X and help guide the defense of the flagroom.

Your main problem with the ship is when it boils down to it, you consider that being killed by a ship you can't see is "lame". If you feel that way then no amount of change besides having zero cloaking ships will make you feel any better. Before you say "Shut the Fuck Up" or "Your argument sucks", what that all boils down to is:

This isn't so much a problem for Trench Wars the Zone, as a problem for you personally.

[za gophar]

Your main problem with the ship is when it boils down to it, you consider that being killed by a ship you can't see is "lame". If you feel that way then no amount of change besides having zero cloaking ships will make you feel any better. Before you say "Shut the Fuck Up" or "Your argument sucks", what that all boils down to is:

This isn't so much a problem for Trench Wars the Zone, as a problem for you personally.

well i thank you for meeting my standards with your agrument, but consider that the weasel can still fit the role you designated to it while reducing the factor that i call lame.

i guess you could say that it is a problem for my personality, but it applies to many others. cloak a lot of people and you will see: a great deal of them make it clear that they dont like what you're doing. twforums is not a great place to get an accurate sample of what people think of cloakers.. people here are more into the community aspect of the game and that reflects in their playing styles.

[za gophar]

at first, the weasel was smaller than it is now. only for a day or two. it used to be able to go thru one tile holes lickity split.. now it takes some manuvering. what if it was shrunken back to that size, given a big energy boost, but having cloak and stealth on would drain energy at a fairly slow rate.

so i am proposing as an example a weasel with:

better access to 1 tile holes
cloak and stealth with a slow energy drain
1500-2500 energy
bullets cost roughly 100-200 energy less than full energy.

this ship would still be quiet capable of being an assassin or distraction. with more energy, the drain would not be as detrimental to it's overall ability, not to mention it's ability to withstand level one bullets from terrs and spiders. with these settings, i would say a weasel could fair for itself pretty well even without cloak and stealth on.

the beauty of it is, it would not be able to completely suprise a ship without x-radar. it would either have to cloak/stealth immediately before shooting, or would have to turn them off before shooting. i think this cloaker would be more strategic and a lot less lame.

[za gophar]

i mean come on, why would this be as bad as forum users seem to indicate any change in the weasel would be?

[Troll King]

If you go and kill anyone a couple of times in ANY ship, they'll be mad at you too.

As for your previous post asking me to "find another example [you] to consider", you're again overlooking my point: I don't need to find reasons for things to stay the way they are, that's not how it works. It's up to you to find reasons for things to change. That's how change works. If you think there's a problem with something, then you can start to propose changes that fix that problem. Change has to be made only if it fixes something. My argument is that there's no problem that needs to be fixed, so it's up to you to show the problem.

And as yet, the only reason you have given for change is that weasels can easily kill warbirds flying around the spawn zone. That's just not good enough of a reason.

[Ezor]

I like cleaning up spawn zone in a Weasel myself. The retarded WB's have elim and wbduel if they want to have their little samurai duels. Pubs (the pure ones anyway) are for basing, keep that shit out.

[za gophar]

good luck with that, ezor.

edit: by the way i couldnt disagree with you more. you dont have a duty to base in pubs. at all. elim and wbduel are for advanced and competitive players. others like relaxed freestyle playing. i cant duel warbirds in my spider in elim unless there is a fighter or any ship elim, and that's once every few hours. in wbduel you have to get pick, in elim you have to wait between rounds. it's totally different than dogfighting in pub spawn area. apparently you feel that the cloaker has a good enough advantage in that area to pretty much clear it out, though. i wouldnt go so far as to say a single cloaker will clear out the area, but it without a doubt has the upper hand because no one can see it. lame lame lame. simple changes can fix everything.

[Ezor]

Don't need luck, it's not that hard to take them out. Just watch out for their wild strays and they're ez prey.

Oh, btw, putting the heat on me won't work here. If you play the game the way it's meant to be played, Weasels aren't a problem. If you sit in the tubes popping off random shit and you get X'ed, your fault. If you go around spawn zone killing people that don't even move and you get X'ed, your fault. If you putt around midbase and get X'ed, your fault. The countermeasures are there, use them and stop whining.

[za gophar]

ok mr. shark terr

[Ezor]

Hello and welcome to last year.

[Sarien]

Pubs (the pure ones anyway) are for basing, keep that shit out.

edit: by the way i couldnt disagree with you more. you dont have a duty to base in pubs. at all.

Notice he says Pure Pubs which are absolutely basing arenas. They were a gift to the pub basing community who were sick and tired of Leviathans screwing up games royal. Then a second pure pub was added because the first was always full. Then there was notice that despite being basing pubs lots of guys were just warbird dueling or fucking off, and making teams severely lopsided. So Guano thankfully changed one of the bots to disable private freqs. I wish he'd done it to both pubs, hell I wish they'd change the settings for the lev and bring the basing joy to all the public arenas. Those first two arenas are undeniably the two most popular pubs in the game and I wish they'd just see that.

Do you think they removed leviathans so that warbirds in spawn would have to stop listening to people in the base complaining about them and could concentrate on their dueling, or what?

[Send]

Sarien, is your sig from Futurama..

and T0NE has made 61 posts in a week all about cloakers

[Sarien]

Yeah, I have all the episodes on DVD, Seasons 1-4.
Probably one of the only TV shows i've ever liked enough to want every episode. One of the features on one of the DVDs is all the little bits they used at the beginning of the episodes, and they have the ones they had down to use but never got around to using, too.